Thread: WoD Beta....

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  1. #61
    Herald of the Titans Nalira's Avatar
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    Jun 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by Vigilate View Post
    I'm not feeling it for Combat at the moment. Damage feels way too slated towards Adrenaline Rush. Fierydemise was running numbers, and outside of AR, Combat is currently averaging the lowest APM of all the Rogue specs.

    In ilvl 660 gear:
    -Sub: 40.7 APM
    -Assassination: 25.5 APM outside of execute, 28.5 APM during execute
    -Combat: ~25 APM outside of Adrenaline Rush

    Fiery mentioned creating a more detailed post about this later tonight with more math, but I just felt the need to point out how awful Combat feels. Even if it ends up gaining a boatload of GCD uses during a .5 GCD during AR, it'll feels incredibly sluggish the rest of the time. Keep in mind that AR will have significantly less uptime that on live due to no CDR trinket and no Shadow Blades.
    Let's face it: Combat feels like shit! They need to seriously rework SS and Evis to make feel like you do something. It feels like a button mashing specc without actually achieving anything because you lack energy and the only finisher is underwhelming.

  2. #62
    Some more accurate and more complete APM numbers.
    Assassination_APM_WoD_No_Execute: 31.77
    Assassination_APM_MoP_No_Execute: 37.44
    Assassination_APM_WoD_Execute: 39.75
    Assassination_APM_MoP_Execute: 34.32
    Combat APM_WoD: 27.69
    Combat APM_MoP: 28.85
    Combat_APM_WoD_3rd_Haste_Point: 30.9
    Combat_APM_MoP_3rd_Haste_Point: 30.7
    Combat APM_WoD_AR: 50.23
    Combat_APM_MoP_AP+SB: 58.17
    Subtlety_APM_WoD: 38.11
    Subtlety_APM_MoP: 37.02
    Full data here:

    Some thoughts:
    1) Assassination is substantially faster.
    2) Combat is slower but scales faster.
    3) Gap between AR and no AR is smaller but still probably too large.

    Full thoughts on my blog:
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  3. #63
    I have mentioned this before, but I think AR needs a redesign. My idea is 30-40% true haste with duration and cooldown adjusted to balance. Bring SS back to 40 energy, bring baseline regen back to 12.5 (maybe, I don't know), remove the AR perk and put something else in its place, and remove the extra combo points from ruthlessness, but allow all finishers to proc ruthlessness (including kidney, SnD, and recup). With AR at 40% haste, swiftblade's cunning, 1-target lemon zest, bloodlust, and 50% haste from gear would still result in 37e/sec before combat potency, which with a 0.8sec GCD during AR should be manageable, but 40e SS and 12.5e baseline regen outside of AR would go a very long way to increasing the feel of the spec outside of AR. Flattening AR will flatten the intra-rotational scaling of the spec while also giving more headroom for haste increases as the expansion progresses.

    I can't say how it feels (not on beta), but I think increasing the RvS effect from 20% to 25-30% may also improve the feel of the spec. I'd also argue that bringing back the wrath SS glyph but change it so 100% chance at an extra cp when SS crits would make crit an interesting and valuable stat, but I don't think that's necessary (it may also create scaling problems due to interaction with RB).
    Last edited by shadowboy; 2014-07-08 at 11:24 PM.

  4. #64
    So like....

    We gave feedback for months on 463-500ish ilvl gear, right? That was the first tier of this expac. In the beta, I don't even think we got to test full heroic (509) gear, and I'm positive we didn't get to test the 517 upgraded stuff.

    And the game launched, and we leveled, and our energy was crap, and then we got to raiding and our energy was crap and then we got gear and our energy was fine.

    And then like two and a half months later, they launched ToT, and everyone got free 522 gear, and we had way too much energy and combat was global capped and they had to add the 50 energy sinister at the end of ToT and blah blah here we are in 580ish gear and our energy is amazing.

    So to reiterate MoP:
    2-4 months without enough energy
    20 months with too much energy

    I don't even know why we beta test the first tier for feel if it's just a fucking rounding error in our lives as rogues. We spent like triple the time testing that content than it was on live or something, and it looks like WoD will be no different.

    So when people say energy is too low, I don't care. They aren't wrong, and good rogues are saying this, but we really spend almost no time at all during the first tier of an expac- it's just a brief glitch in your flow. Compare time in Nax to all of Ulduar, that stupid BDSM closet raid with spiders and spankings, and then all of ICC. Naxx=rounding error. Compare time in whatever forgettable Halfus the Who Cares raid versus all of Firelands and all of Dragonsoul. Rounding error.

    WoD will be no different. NO DIFFERENT, because unlike the BC and vanillla they intend to span around a hundred item levels again, because that's how they support the multiple raid difficulties, so the time you spend in reg mode whatever tier we're gonna be on is like two to four months tops, and then that gear is gone.

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