Mental health support failing men, pretty dramatically

[Slant]

Sorry, that wasn't what I was trying to say.

I mean to say, whatever it is that's causing guys to not seek help, whether it's a "masculinity under threat" issue or a "don't know the help exists" or whatever it is, places that provide that help need to do WHATEVER IT TAKES, no matter how ridiculous it may seem, to get guys to seek the help they need. I don't claim to know why guys won't seek help while women do, I'm not a mental health professional, but it needs to be figured out and solved.

Yes it can help a lot for people around to notice, but sometimes they don't. Sometimes there arn't any people around, and this is what's causing the problem. Also, while other people might notice signs, if they are a keen observer or have some knowledge on the issue, most people are not mental health professionals and don't know what to look for, or are stuck with a lot of misunderstanding and stereotypes about mental health being not a real problem, or a woman's problem or something you just need to get over. This is obviously a big problem, and needs to be fixed, but it's not always possible to rely on others to notice and get you the help you need, we have to create an environment where men are willing and comfortable to seek help, and are even encouraged to do so, even when others don't notice there is anything wrong.

I think I'm getting what you're trying to say, but it may be more fruitful to phrase it neutrally in terms of "showing weakness" than gender specific "masculinity" issues. I'm sure women have just the same problems, if not as often apparently. It may be just as sexist of me, but I do suspect the women's suicide rate may also be lower, because they are more social than men. I've often observed women being the social hubs of their groups, while men drift in and out of these circles as time goes by. Perhaps that's just my personal viewpoint, I could be totally wrong about this. But if I'm right in saying that people around you keep you from blowing your head off with a shotgun is the solution, the social hub thing would explain the difference. And now I'm talking out of my arse here really...

About the second paragraph, I do think people notice all the time. But in today's age of offending people with the slightest remarks, they don't dare speak up early. And when the problem boils up, it's too late to say anything but "Yeah well... I never guessed it was *this* severe...". And at other times, people just don't care enough. We're all busy living our own daily lives and depending on your situation, you may be stretched to your limit with regular life as it is. How many of us get home and just want to spend some time with family before the next day arrives? Society doesn't leave much room for contemplation anymore. And the anonymity of big cities doesn't help, either.

[schwarzkopf]

if it gives you time to get into therapy etc,

The issue with therapy is that it doesn't help if the underlying cause is environmental and outside anyone's control.

Or as a few of my psychiatrists have said - "we can't help you because your life actually sucks".

[Slant]

Ummm.... how about when I went to a doctor and he prescribed alprazolam for migraine symptoms after listening to me discuss concussion symptoms for 2 minutes without even doing a physical examination?

I'm a special case in that I have pretty good medical knowledge. But, no, don't ever just trust a doctor just because.

So... you gamed the doctor? Good job, you tricked him into prescribing you stuff, that's quite an achievement. I'm talking about the regular guy going to a doctor. Let's say me, I have absolutely no medical knowledge. I don't like doctors very much, I suspect the pharma industry is trying to make everyone a (legal) junkie. But when I do acknowledge a problem and go to the doctor, I don't ignore his advice... That's just stupid.

Going to the doctor, asking for a specific drug and then ignoring him when he suggests an alternative method that doesn't involve drugs seems highly suspect to me. I'd rather see your doctor than any doctor who immediately proceeds to fill his wallet by prescribing you some bullshit drug that may or may not help you.

[Yakrion]

As a man, this doesn't really surprise me. Culture is brutal on men when men show any sign of 'weakness'. Support does exist, but it's generally going to be from people you've known for a very long time.

[Merite]

Oh dear - if a few hours helps you, then were were not mentally ill.

In fact it took hundreds of hours, and by no means am I fine today, I still have the occasional thought stemming from anxiety, but I'm far better. It was simply an analogy, sorry if it offended you.

If isolation is your issue, honestly the best thing that worked for me was moving, getting a new job, leaving everything behind. Perhaps I've been blessed with enough that allowed me to move, but moving gave me 2 key friends that literally shaped who I am. One of them paid for my first prescriptions and psychiatrists visits, the other taught me how to be vulnerable and kind and loving again.

As always, one persons journey can mean nothing to another, best of luck.

[Post]

The issue with therapy is that it doesn't help if the underlying cause is environmental and outside anyone's control.

Or as a few of my psychiatrists have said - "we can't help you because your life actually sucks".

I see a lot of people that are depressed saying it's all about loneliness. You're right in that pills can't help if you can't/won't interact with people (although I think the goal of them is a lot of times to get you to interact with people easier). Isolation will almost always screw with someone's head.

[schwarzkopf]

If isolation is your issue, honestly the best thing that worked for me was moving, getting a new job, leaving everything behind.

I don't have anything to leave behind, nothing at all - nor the money to leave this nothing behind. Everything has been taken from me.

For me - there is no solution, apart from the final one (which is damned hard to track down - but I'm getting there).

[Slant]

The issue with therapy is that it doesn't help if the underlying cause is environmental and outside anyone's control.

Or as a few of my psychiatrists have said - "we can't help you because your life actually sucks".

Wow, that's honest. Hope life improves for you. I found that making a life decision to improve matters can actually help. There's literally no situation that you cannot get out of if you have the will to do it.

[schwarzkopf]

You're right in that pills can't help if you can't/won't interact with people. Isolation will almost always screw with someone's head.

My illness means people won't interact with me.

[Mayhem]

Seeking help as a man is a sign of weakness. That's why men are reluctant to do it.

just like when you cut your finger off or when break an arm... get over it, heal yourself, stupid

But I doubt that most male suicides are due to mental health issues. There are probably other factors pushing men to kill themselves such as lack of opportunities etc. You have to be a real psycho to succeed in this world, or plan your future and be determined to succeed. But even that might not be good enough. Many young people today will never own a house because their value has been artificially inflated. They are "generation rent".

that is always the factor when not under influence of substances

[schwarzkopf]

Wow, that's honest. Hope life improves for you.

Screw hope - if I had never hoped, I'd be a more contented soul today. Hope is a delusion that infects the mind.

[Deleted]

The issue with therapy is that it doesn't help if the underlying cause is environmental and outside anyone's control.

Or as a few of my psychiatrists have said - "we can't help you because your life actually sucks".

In many cases though, they can help you do things to improve your situation. Whether that's offering advice on something or other, or helping you look for places to make friends or whatever.

[schwarzkopf]

In many cases though, they can help you do things to improve your situation.

Apparently not, 10 years, 10 psychiatrists, 5 psychologists, 2 therapists and 20+ drugs later - the only way is down.

[damntree]

Probably a lot of guys just kill themselves because they have no prospects. I know I often think about it. I'm simply tired of living to work; nothing ever gets better. It would be nice to have the option of just spreading your legs and having someone take care of you.

[Slant]

Apparently not, 10 years, 10 psychiatrists, 5 psychologists, 2 therapists and 20+ drugs later - the only way is down.

If you want to take the cheap way out, sure. I agree with your psychiatrists, it's a waste of time if you have given up already and made up your mind about it. Time better spent on people that want to be helped. Sad, though, that you can't see that there is always a solution.

[Deleted]

Apparently not, 10 years, 10 psychiatrists, 5 psychologists, 2 therapists and 20+ drugs later - the only way is down.

Depends on your situation. I'm sorry it hasn't worked for you (may I ask what you suffer from, if that's not too personal? - Just with you saying it means people won't interact with you?) but it can help a lot of people. Everyone's situation is unique.

[Slant]

Probably a lot of guys just kill themselves because they have no prospects. I know I often think about it. I'm simply tired of living to work; nothing ever gets better. It would be nice to have the option of just spreading your legs and having someone take care of you.

That's called motivation. Get up and do something about it! Start small then build from there.

[schwarzkopf]

it's a waste of time if you have given up already and made up your mind about it. Time better spent on people that want to be helped. Sad, though, that you can't see that there is always a solution.

I haven't given up - I've run out of options. Big difference.

As for there always being a solution - that is just a load of tripe.

[Deleted]

Probably a lot of guys just kill themselves because they have no prospects. I know I often think about it. I'm simply tired of living to work; nothing ever gets better. It would be nice to have the option of just spreading your legs and having someone take care of you.

If you really feel that way, you can always transition. The grass isn't always greener, though, you'll find

[Slant]

I haven't given up - I've run out of options. Big difference.

As for there always being a solution - that is just a load of tripe.

I don't believe you. I am not asking you to do this, but as a mental experiment... if you posted your situation here on MMO-C, I'd wager 100 bucks that you'd have 10 pages of people with smart (or stupid) ideas how to help you. I don't believe in the no-win scenario, either.