1. #1

    Resto shaman stats for a newbie

    Hey, I just started raiding with my resto shammy about a month ago... im 569il atm, and i mostly do 25man hcs.
    I'm wondering... how should i reforge/gem?
    Right now, unbuffed, I am:
    19.41% haste (5831)
    29.90% crit (9506)
    62.93% mast (7787)
    18.500 spirit

    If i ask Mr robot, it tells me to get to 21k spirit, so I guess it's totally crazy... I think for 25man 17k spirit should be enuff. My question is... how much haste should i get? And crit? I would like to get 41.68 haste but it seems a bit too high with my gear, yes? I would lose too much stats. What's your suggestion? What should I am for? Thank you in advance!

  2. #2
    I don't think you should go so heavy into spirit (many succesful raiders have 9-11k, as they cannot get lower). it isn't necessary. go the other way and try to get rid of it even. through crit and your resurgence talent you will not go oom. therefor choose a haste cap depending on how much gear you have generally, e.g. 6077* in your case, add some haste for the latency bug with totems -> ~ 6300 and forge the rest into crit. any surplus can be put into mastery or go for a higher haste cap instead. take care not to loose too much crit in the process.

    this works pretty well. a rule of thumb as a restoshaman is nowadays to pretend you have unlimited mana and play accordingly (-> when in doubt or bored spam chainheal). you will have a hard time to go out of mana - especially in a 25-man raid. between your own mana tide and any other mana tides and hymns of hope there should be enough mana restoring cds available. if you find yourself low on mana at some point in a fight despite what I said earlier, you should use those cds earlier and more often in a fight. also mana is a resource to spend. so you did fine, if you have no mana at the end of the fight as the boss dies.

    all of the above works better with a legendary meta, but it also works without.

    concerning ask mr robot. amr is just a fancy calculator and acts accordingly. therefore you need to choose sensibly statweights and limits to reach a good and reasonable result.

    *assuming not goblin & not specced into ancestral swiftness
    Last edited by Deiae; 2014-07-05 at 02:57 PM. Reason: clarity

  3. #3
    As Deiae said you shouldn't go for so much spirit, you'll regenerate enough mana with resurgence and enough crit. I myself (on my 569 rshamy alt) go for 12k spirit~ and put everything I can into crit while going for some haste cap (I'm at 11k+ haste atm but I think you could go for the 8830 haste cap and put the rest into mastery).

    By the way I go for 12k spirit but I'm healing in 10m, so depending on how much regen cds your raid has you could go for a lower rating. Anyway you can tweak some things with AMR to get what you want: just click on "Edit Weights" and you can choose which haste cap you want to go for, how much spirit you want and your stat priority. Mine looks like this.

  4. #4
    I'm around 12k spirit on my shaman and mana normally isn't an issue, and I've healed up to 6/14h on 10 man.

  5. #5
    First of all, thank you for your help. And yes, i do have ancrestral swiftness. It just seems 10-13k spirit is so low, I guess I need to get used to spamming mana tide more often, seems so little spirit... :P
    Anyway I played around with mrrobot a bit, what do you guys think:

    13k spirit, 61% mastery, 50k spellpower, 41.7% crit, 30.2% haste (for healing rain extra tick)

    Too much spirit still? That crit % is fine to get enuff crits for manaback? I'd like an extra healing rain tick becase it's very nice in 25man I guess... thank you.

  6. #6
    I know that some 25 man guilds have shamans stack spirit to act as a mana battery. But if your other healers aren't having mana issues, then it's not necessary.

    Do you have you legendary meta? If so, you can definitely go lower. If not, I'd try to drop 1-2k more spirit. Remember, any mana you end the fight with is mana regen wasted. But you still want a buffer for tougher fights/shit hitting the fan.

    I'd say you also have too much mastery. Our mastery isn't that good, especially with a high number of absorbs. You probably want ~50% mastery. Focus your stats on getting to haste breakpoints and crit. You're probably close to the point where you can simply reforge all your spirit/mastery to crit/haste and be fine.

  7. #7
    Actually I wrote wrong.... its 13k spirit, 64.75% mastery, 50.5k spellpower, 41.4% crit and 30.07% haste (569 itemlevel, legendary meta yep).
    Keep in mind mrrobot gives those stats with raid buffs... infact atm I don't have anything gemmed +mastery, just feet enchant and gloves +170master. I guess I could change the 4 160+ crit/spi gems to just 320crit to gain some crit %... mastery I don't think I can get lower than that. :/

    I could get to 8882 haste (for another healing stream totem tick), 12k spirit, 62.2% mastery, 50.5k spellpower, 41.1% crit... sounds better?
    If i go to 12116 haste (so extra riptide, earthliving, healing tide) id still have 12k spirit, down to 55% mastery, 50.5k spellpower and down to 39% crit... dunno if it's worth it.

    Sorry for asking all these questions... wish I could just do hcs like flex just to test stats out and see whats probably better... thank you!!

  8. #8
    Dreadlord Akaihiryuu's Avatar
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    As a shaman, I have to say in the *current* healing environment (bar a couple of exceptions), resto shaman mastery is *useless*. Especially in the heroic environment. If anyone stays below 100% for more than a GCD they are probably going to get 1-shot. I got rid of as much mastery as I could and put it into crit. For haste, I just went for the 12.5% breakpoint. For spirit, just go with what's comfortable for you. It's hard to tell someone exactly how much spirit they need because it's so dependent on other things like the legendary meta gem and crit (since crit = mana regen for resto).

    From what I've heard, 6.0 will actually make our mastery useful again.
    Last edited by Akaihiryuu; 2014-07-05 at 11:37 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Akaihiryuu View Post
    As a shaman, I have to say in the *current* healing environment (bar a couple of exceptions), resto shaman mastery is *useless*. Especially in the heroic environment. If anyone stays below 100% for more than a GCD they are probably going to get 1-shot. I got rid of as much mastery as I could and put it into crit. For haste, I just went for the 12.5% breakpoint. For spirit, just go with what's comfortable for you. It's hard to tell someone exactly how much spirit they need because it's so dependent on other things like the legendary meta gem and crit (since crit = mana regen for resto).

    From what I've heard, 6.0 will actually make our mastery useful again.
    Out of curiosity... how much crit and spirit you got unbuffed? Its useless to go to 12116 haste? That's like over 40%... but you're at 12.5%... im confused. :P

  10. #10
    Dreadlord Akaihiryuu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sauzer View Post
    Out of curiosity... how much crit and spirit you got unbuffed? Its useless to go to 12116 haste? That's like over 40%... but you're at 12.5%... im confused. :P
    I actually just got back from an extended break, and I haven't been playing my shaman in resto since I came back since I haven't been raiding. That in mind, I just logged in and put on my resto gear to check...I have 3143 haste (12.77%, as close as I could get reforging), 6719 crit (23.39%), 5631 mastery (52.15% - I reforged out of all the mastery I could), and 13233 spirit. Keep in mind also that I do not have the legendary meta gem or the legendary cloak - quite an extended break since I did not enjoy MOP much. I don't have stellar gear.

  11. #11
    Resto shaman stats are quite flexible -- different settings work equally well.
    It's best to experiment -- try different settings and find the one that works best for you.

  12. #12
    Personally, in a 10man environment, I have gone for the 11 ticks of HST.. But I am missing my 40%+ crit unbuffed, so I am debating whether I should go back or not as I am at 35%+ unbuffed at the moment. I'll give it a few weeks and see.

    Mastery is down to as far as I can take it, to around 46%.

    My spirit is around 13.4k unbuffed as well. Because that is what I am comfortable with. I could probably stand to lose a bit more, but since everything that doesn't have crit, has spirit being put into crit anyway, I am debating a few gearing choices/options in that regard. At the moment, I think I have reforged out of most of my spirit.

    Haste breakpoint.. The one just under 9k (if you aren't a goblin) with AS/5% haste buff in raid is really good. It means you can dump more into crit and lose some spirit in the process. I've seen many go for inbetween the 10 and 11 ticks of HST to meet a few of the other breakpoints, and I've done it myself without trying, and that's okay. But if you are going for that at the expense of crit, or you need more spirit and you are going to that in-between breakpoint at the loss of the spirit you may need, then cut back to the 10 ticks of HST and keep your spirit and/or crit.

    If you want to know about haste breakpoints, then you can look at totemspot for their breakpoints (they have them for 5.4 as well): http://www.totemspot.com/vb/entry.php?b=41

    You need to remember that if you are goblin, then it will alter your haste cap. And AS and haste buff in raid also factors in, as I am sure you are aware.

    But things like spirit, that's just down to personal playstyle. I have the crit to allow me to be able to go with less spirit if I need to and totemic recall glyph and meta gem procs and magma totem to allow me to regain mana on fights that are mana intensive.

  13. #13
    I think I'll try going for the 8882 haste, 14k spirit, 54% mastery, 41.18% crit and see how it goes...
    Got two more questions tho... :P
    mrrobot puts at 8882 the breakpoint for an extra HST, that's including 5% raid buffs and AS. the site you linked at 8916: which one is right?
    and about totemic recall glyph... is it really that useful? do most of you consider it a must to use to survive without high spirit? my concern is that it uses a gcd to recall it back... in fights not much mana intensive, you can probably waste that gcd without risking raid life, but in those fights usually mana isnt an issue. in fights very mana intensive, you could use the mana back, but can you actually waste the gcc without someone dying? i know some will say i dont have to recall it every time... and that even with 50% times its still a good amount of mana back during a boss... but just wondering if i really need to get used to using it...
    in case i do... what do you guys use to track the duration of HST? i use tellmewhen and it tells me how many seconds left it has... i just have to recall it at last second right?
    thank you!

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by sauzer View Post
    I think I'll try going for the 8882 haste, 14k spirit, 54% mastery, 41.18% crit and see how it goes...
    Got two more questions tho... :P
    mrrobot puts at 8882 the breakpoint for an extra HST, that's including 5% raid buffs and AS. the site you linked at 8916: which one is right?
    and about totemic recall glyph... is it really that useful? do most of you consider it a must to use to survive without high spirit? my concern is that it uses a gcd to recall it back... in fights not much mana intensive, you can probably waste that gcd without risking raid life, but in those fights usually mana isnt an issue. in fights very mana intensive, you could use the mana back, but can you actually waste the gcc without someone dying? i know some will say i dont have to recall it every time... and that even with 50% times its still a good amount of mana back during a boss... but just wondering if i really need to get used to using it...
    in case i do... what do you guys use to track the duration of HST? i use tellmewhen and it tells me how many seconds left it has... i just have to recall it at last second right?
    thank you!
    Haste breakpoints for totems are a bit unreliable, you have to be slightly above the breakpoints to get the extra tick, and the exact amount differs from player to player -- 9100 is probably safe, but needs to be tested to be sure.

    Each recall of healing stream totem is 14100 mana, and magma totem 12660 mana. The legendary meta has a proc rate of 1.4 RPPM. With 30% haste this amounts to 1.4*1.3 = 1.82 procs per minute. Ideal usage of totemic recall therefore refunds, on average, (2*14100 + 1.82*12660)/12 = 4253 mp5, which is equivalent to about (4253 / 0.56435) = 7536 spirit.

    To achieve that, you need, per minute, a maximum of six additional gcds -- about two to drop the magma totems during the meta procs, and four recalls -- two for HST, and two for magma. Often due to overlap it's possible to recall both totems together by delaying the magma recall till the time HST expires (though it may result in loss of a meta proc), for a total of four gcds.

    In practice half of that amount is a good amount to target, since indeed sometimes you can't afford wasting the gcd to recall, or use the meta procs to cast spells rather than dropping magma totem. There is also the danger of loosing the last HST tick when you recall -- while it's possible to recall just after the totem expires and get the mana back without loosing any ticks, it's tricky and sometimes you do loose the tick.

    If you trade spirit for crit, totemic recall is required less than if you trade it for haste or mastery, since you get mana back from crits due to resurgence.

    However it currently looks like this gameplay is going away in WoD, so might not make sense to get used to it that late in the expansion.

    Here is a weakaura to track HST:

    Code:
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