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  1. #661
    Quote Originally Posted by Titheon View Post
    I would pay a subscription fee of $39.95/mo for the way Warcraft used to be.
    Attunements, dedication, mastering your class, etc.
    Why not play on one of the free servers if you prefer a former patch?

  2. #662
    I've been subscribed since Nov. 2004 and was in the tiny minority that saw Nefarion die in Vanilla (nobody on my server cleared Naxx in Vanilla). The OP is looking at things through rose colored glasses and exaggerating the things he doesn't like now. In the nearly 10 years I have played I have gone through burnout and renewed interest many time (currently on a burst of renewed interest), but that has always been on me.

    Are there changes I don't like? Of course, I do think the general game (not heroic raiding) has gotten too easy, but cie la vie. I hope WoD is balanced to be more like BC questing and dungeoning. Raids, sans LFR, are fine as they are in MoP.

  3. #663
    High Overlord Everztar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    Why not play on one of the free servers if you prefer a former patch?
    The lag, the fake and unstable shit...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Taftvalue View Post
    I'd like to know when the people who always say 'It's notalgia' started playing haha

    mop babies
    Indeed, indeed...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by willtron View Post
    I'm surprised this has made 33 pages - its simple. Evolve or die. If WoW was the same as vanilla for 9 years, it wouldn't be 9 years old, it'd be dead.
    New content, new levels and new spells would be enough, arenas and new battlegrounds would be nice...

    But flying mounts and cross realm? That's what ruined it.

  4. #664
    Quote Originally Posted by Everztar View Post
    The lag, the fake and unstable shit...

    - - - Updated - - -


    Indeed, indeed...

    - - - Updated - - -



    New content, new levels and new spells would be enough, arenas and new battlegrounds would be nice...

    But flying mounts and cross realm? That's what ruined it.
    do you gank low level players because i dont see any other reason why flying mounts ruin the game

  5. #665
    I am gonna just pointing out some facts about how popular wow was and is right now. Durring vannila, TBC and Wrath Wow got bigest raise in number of subcribers. It was game where you had dedicate yourself to actualy see content. When Blizzard introduced systems what allowed for most of the players see content WoW sudennly start lossing players. Yes i heard lot of you that people changed and bla bla they got families and bla bla so they dont have time anymore to stick with game and bla bla. People had families back in vannila, they were mature back in vannila, they had same free time back in vanilla. Maybe some vannila veterans dont have time what they used to have. But wow isnt filled only by veterans. New people start playing or used to start playing every day. Actualy it was over 100 million unique accounts what was created and only 7m (now even less then that) still playing. WoW stop growing as game and switch to mod where Blizzard trying to milk it befor it dies. Vannila was sandobx game where blizzard created content then let you enter the world and play how you want. Now everything is handed to you. There is no goal in the game. You can see whole content in jsut few days which makes game even more boring after you see everything.

    Back in TBC i was casual in casual guild. My progress end about 50% into BT. And i wasnt mad at all that i didnt saw whole content becouse i had fun whole expansion. Why? Becouse there was always goal for me to work for. World look more alive and no just bunch of UI and instances and 6565 difficulties.

    Btw to everyone who defend wow that even after 10y it have 7m subs. Many even older games got even more players than that and it is still growing. Age of the game doest not affect sub grow. It it stupid decisions in development of the game what cause sub losts. And those 7m are not acurrate at all . Since many players got more active accs and eastern wow subs got different system for subscripion what mess with this stats. So beliave me or not but wow can have 7m subs but only about 5mil active players what actualy play the game.
    Last edited by Sinndor; 2014-08-03 at 02:21 PM.

  6. #666
    Legendary! Luko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Everztar View Post
    Indeed, indeed...
    Indeed? You've been called out by at least a dozen Vanilla players that I've seen and I haven't even spent much time in this thread. They challenged you fact for fact and those were normally the posts you chose not to reply to, conveniently.

    I'm still wondering what the goal is, here.
    Listen kiddos, trust Handsome Jack. You want every part of this insanity.
    So many people are gonna die.

    Formerly Ryngo Blackratchet

  7. #667
    Playing Vanilla doesn't make you right no matter which side your on. How do we know you weren't the worst player on your server?

  8. #668
    WoW is OK in my opinion. I like every expansion.

  9. #669
    High Overlord Everztar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vipers View Post
    do you gank low level players because i dont see any other reason why flying mounts ruin the game
    Ganking high levels... How am I supposed to do this? No one is at ground, ever...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Luko View Post
    Indeed? You've been called out by at least a dozen Vanilla players that I've seen and I haven't even spent much time in this thread. They challenged you fact for fact and those were normally the posts you chose not to reply to, conveniently.

    I'm still wondering what the goal is, here.
    It's 50/50 and i replied to the most of them, go re-read...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon138 View Post
    Playing Vanilla doesn't make you right no matter which side your on. How do we know you weren't the worst player on your server?
    Hahaha, you're funny... There was plenty of people with worse gear, or that didn't even reach 60... Until tbc...

  10. #670
    The answer is never. What is old cannot be made new again. Only something new and exciting can be new and exciting.

  11. #671
    That was one hell of a post, so I only read about half :P If you think you couldn't one-shot people, think twice. Used to PvP with a hunter, best ally team on Burning Legion, we often played against Nihilum (for those of you who don't remember they were the best guild at a certain time), I could one-shot their full epic mages with my half blue hunter, Aimed Shot was OP and no resilience made it even more OP :3

    But WoW is 10 years old game, it's obvious it will get boring some day. While I agree game got dumbed down and scaled for 12 years old boys/weekend players, many of your arguments are... not really good. Endless grind was stupid and nowdays nobody would do that anyway, people have learnt how to earn with auction house. I agree that rate at which you become full epic is idiotic, but with all encounters being based on controlling your dps (too fast may be bad, too slow will be bad) you need good itemization. Blizz lost its way around WLK/laaate TBC and now they cannot really get back on it, that's why we're getting stat squish and WoD resembles TBC so much.

  12. #672
    Quote Originally Posted by Everztar View Post
    i've seen drakedog crit 9k... then they nerfed the zul gurub trinket... but 1v1 at level 60 there was no one shotting or two shotting :3
    PoM-> Pyro with trinkets.
    Feral4Life since 2005
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  13. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luko View Post
    Indeed? You've been called out by at least a dozen Vanilla players that I've seen and I haven't even spent much time in this thread. They challenged you fact for fact and those were normally the posts you chose not to reply to, conveniently.

    I'm still wondering what the goal is, here.
    Yeah, when he replies to me, he conveniently ignores half my post, so I stopped trying to convince him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bentusi View Post
    Yes let`s please. They`re known as roles. You know as in Role Playing Games, which is what the RPG at the end of MMORPG stands for. Remove that and there`s no RPG, to go with the fact that WoW is barely massive anymore, and doesn`t invite traditional multiplayer either, and you`ll have gotten rid of most the letters in the genre WoW still formally describes itself as. For your edification MMORPG = Massively multiplayer online role playing game. In the spirit of truth in labeling WoW should change its designation to a MOCG, or Massively online casual game. And you could even lose the "massively" and the "game" (Everything is handed out, how can it be a game in the traditional sense?), making it an OC.
    All I can say is that I`m never gonna play any of the games you design.
    I think you misunderstood my point. I don't have a problem with Blizzard deciding to force Shamans/Priests/Paladins/Whatever into healers, they should just have put a message when selecting your class "This is a healer class, nothing else". But it's not what happened, you could effectively play a DPS spec as Shaman, but no one would want to raid with you, because DPS Shamans were terrible compared to mages/rogues/warlocks/hunters. Because the specs weren't balanced. This a design flaw. Nowadays Shamans have two viable DPS specs and aren't forced to play heal to see the hardest content.

    And what about the one-two button specs ? I remember spamming shadowbolt on my warlock for hours, and now I see people complaining about the "dumbing down", makes me smile.

  14. #674
    Quote Originally Posted by ThunderTaco View Post

    I think you misunderstood my point. I don't have a problem with Blizzard deciding to force Shamans/Priests/Paladins/Whatever into healers, they should just have put a message when selecting your class "This is a healer class, nothing else". But it's not what happened, you could effectively play a DPS spec as Shaman, but no one would want to raid with you, because DPS Shamans were terrible compared to mages/rogues/warlocks/hunters. Because the specs weren't balanced. This a design flaw. Nowadays Shamans have two viable DPS specs and aren't forced to play heal to see the hardest content.

    And what about the one-two button specs ? I remember spamming shadowbolt on my warlock for hours, and now I see people complaining about the "dumbing down", makes me smile.
    Well, the problem with this is that when you had four dps specialists they obviously needed to be better at dps than hybrids. Anything else is what is bad game design. And indeed, after years of moaning by people who failed to understand this basic concept, hybrids were suddenly doing just as much dps as dps "specialists". Even more in some cases. The last "raid" (This was in Cataclysm and can hardly be called a raid) I did, had two shadow priests, one balance druid, a retri paladin and an elemental shammy (Me.) topping the dps meters. Even though I was doing well enough personally I truly hated this development, and it was one of the main reasons I quit, along with the pointless gear welfare. You just cannot have healing and tanking classes topping dps when they don`t even need to pay for a respec, because it makes the four dps classes pointless. And that was always the big problem with these demands for dps equalization. And to be even more specific; hunters and warlocks were supposed to have slightly lower dps than mages and rogues because they had pets and therefore more survivability. And all this was very good game design. Unless I`ve gone senile, the ratio was mage/rogue 100, hunter/warlock 90, two role hybrids 75 and three role hybrids 60. Any sane person who sits down to design an MMORPG will probably use something very close to this model, which was just totally standard MMORPG stuff at the time. And obviously that`s why Blizzard did this also, because believe it or not they actually had sane people working there at one point.

    And again, it has to do with roles, and most people knew about this and rolled priests if they wanted to heal and warlocks if they wanted to dps. There was no problem, except in the minds of people who truly do not understand anything about what makes games good or not. Hybrids had dps specs to help them level and that was all they were for. In most cases you could use them to dps five mans just fine as well, and the only thing you couldn`t use them for was end game raiding. "Oh what a huge scandal and moan and whine endlessly until they buff my dps so I can raid with any spec whatsoever!"
    For intelligent people, if you didn`t know this and rolled the wrong class, then by golly you just rerolled like everybody else. You certainly didn`t demand that Blizzard destroy the game because you`re dumb enough to roll a healer when you wanted to dps. So to me, every change Blizzard made in this area made the game progressively worse. And it includes things like giving the same buffs to multiple classes, giving self heals to every class etc. The distinct classes WoW set out with are all gone, and what remains is a mush of indistinct, messy solo characters. And this was what the morons wanted because it was too much work to team up with others and work together to achieve things. And this is what they got, and why the average age and IQ of the WoW player base has been cut basically in half. And so has the number of subs, for those who believe the majority is always right. And the mentality has gone down the toilet with it.

    As for 2 button specs this is a totally different discussion and no they were not very fun to play. But all that can be fixed, and was fixed, without removing the healer/tank/dps dynamic and class roles like Blizzard did.
    Last edited by Bentusi; 2014-08-05 at 12:59 AM.

  15. #675
    #1 When Blizzard reduces monthly fee.
    #2 When realms no longer have any real meaning. No limit on who you can raid and what guild to join.
    #3 No longer lock players to raids. While we're at it, no more raid lock outs.

    These things will bring WoW to it's former glory.

  16. #676
    When I see threads like this I wonder why Wildstar isn't more populated. It's all the Vanilla WoW glory.. in space.

    Oh wait.. 40 man raids and attunements are actually hard and time consuming and NOONE WANTS TO DO THEM ANYMORE.

  17. #677
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelangel View Post
    When I see threads like this I wonder why Wildstar isn't more populated. It's all the Vanilla WoW glory.. in space.

    Oh wait.. 40 man raids and attunements are actually hard and time consuming and NOONE WANTS TO DO THEM ANYMORE.
    I stopped Wildstar because i dont like sci-fi theme and i didnt like how everything u cast is AOE and there are other things that made me just not care about the game. MMORPG have to be time consuming and it should go harder and harder the more you progres. It keeps the game interesting and the goal somewhere that you are trying to reach and when you get more towards to your goal. It feels something. In wow you dont get any feelings of the game. "oh i got this, oh i did this, well who cares". The reason why i quitted Wildstar has NOTHING to do with vanilla. So your statement that wow would fail if it went back to vanilla/BC times is wrong on my part.
    Last edited by sheepra; 2014-08-05 at 05:54 AM.

  18. #678
    High Overlord Everztar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelangel View Post
    When I see threads like this I wonder why Wildstar isn't more populated. It's all the Vanilla WoW glory.. in space.

    Oh wait.. 40 man raids and attunements are actually hard and time consuming and NOONE WANTS TO DO THEM ANYMORE.
    This must be a joke? Wildstar will turn great eventually, I love wildstar... Except for that it's not medieval... I font like fancy lasers and weird choppers and such... I want warriors and rogues, I want priests...

    Wildstar is just too futuristic for my kind, will definitely try it again some time soon

  19. #679
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bentusi View Post
    Well, the problem with this is that when you had four dps specialists they obviously needed to be better at dps than hybrids. Anything else is what is bad game design. And indeed, after years of moaning by people who failed to understand this basic concept, hybrids were suddenly doing just as much dps as dps "specialists". Even more in some cases. The last "raid" (This was in Cataclysm and can hardly be called a raid) I did, had two shadow priests, one balance druid, a retri paladin and an elemental shammy (Me.) topping the dps meters. Even though I was doing well enough personally I truly hated this development, and it was one of the main reasons I quit, along with the pointless gear welfare. You just cannot have healing and tanking classes topping dps when they don`t even need to pay for a respec, because it makes the four dps classes pointless. And that was always the big problem with these demands for dps equalization. And to be even more specific; hunters and warlocks were supposed to have slightly lower dps than mages and rogues because they had pets and therefore more survivability. And all this was very good game design. Unless I`ve gone senile, the ratio was mage/rogue 100, hunter/warlock 90, two role hybrids 75 and three role hybrids 60. Any sane person who sits down to design an MMORPG will probably use something very close to this model, which was just totally standard MMORPG stuff at the time. And obviously that`s why Blizzard did this also, because believe it or not they actually had sane people working there at one point.

    And again, it has to do with roles, and most people knew about this and rolled priests if they wanted to heal and warlocks if they wanted to dps. There was no problem, except in the minds of people who truly do not understand anything about what makes games good or not. Hybrids had dps specs to help them level and that was all they were for. In most cases you could use them to dps five mans just fine as well, and the only thing you couldn`t use them for was end game raiding. "Oh what a huge scandal and moan and whine endlessly until they buff my dps so I can raid with any spec whatsoever!"
    For intelligent people, if you didn`t know this and rolled the wrong class, then by golly you just rerolled like everybody else. You certainly didn`t demand that Blizzard destroy the game because you`re dumb enough to roll a healer when you wanted to dps. So to me, every change Blizzard made in this area made the game progressively worse. And it includes things like giving the same buffs to multiple classes, giving self heals to every class etc. The distinct classes WoW set out with are all gone, and what remains is a mush of indistinct, messy solo characters. And this was what the morons wanted because it was too much work to team up with others and work together to achieve things. And this is what they got, and why the average age and IQ of the WoW player base has been cut basically in half. And so has the number of subs, for those who believe the majority is always right. And the mentality has gone down the toilet with it.

    As for 2 button specs this is a totally different discussion and no they were not very fun to play. But all that can be fixed, and was fixed, without removing the healer/tank/dps dynamic and class roles like Blizzard did.
    Or, you could just remove the ability to heal for hybrids if they choose a DPS spec, that way they can be tuned to have the same DPS as pure DPS classes but they have the option to respec into healing (and lose the ability to DPS effectively, let's say enough for questing and farming a bit) if they want to and pure DPS specs can respec to another gameplay but still have to DPS.

    If you go by "Hybrids should have X% of the DPS of a pure class" you will have to stack pure DPS classes for raids with some boss with low raid damage but high DPS requirements and you will have to stack hybrids for raids with high raid damage but low DPS requirements and only if there is high raid damage and high DPS requirement you will have to find a good balance.

    This would encourage people to reroll so that their group can face any situation, this is what guilds did for WotlK and Cata (25 warlocks for the soulstones, the ferals for Heroic Nefarian, the mages/rogues for Spine, etc etc) and Blizzard clearly stated that they prefer the philosophy "Bring the player, not the class".

    I agree with this philosophy, maybe it goes a little against the RPG, but I like it, it'd rather player that with my friends than play a "true RPG" with random people because my friends didn't chose the right class from the start.

  20. #680
    High Overlord Everztar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThunderTaco View Post
    Yeah, when he replies to me, he conveniently ignores half my post, so I stopped trying to convince him.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I think you misunderstood my point. I don't have a problem with Blizzard deciding to force Shamans/Priests/Paladins/Whatever into healers, they should just have put a message when selecting your class "This is a healer class, nothing else". But it's not what happened, you could effectively play a DPS spec as Shaman, but no one would want to raid with you, because DPS Shamans were terrible compared to mages/rogues/warlocks/hunters. Because the specs weren't balanced. This a design flaw. Nowadays Shamans have two viable DPS specs and aren't forced to play heal to see the hardest content.

    And what about the one-two button specs ? I remember spamming shadowbolt on my warlock for hours, and now I see people complaining about the "dumbing down", makes me smile.
    Primo, Enhancement Shaman of Darksorrow who had the hand of Ragnaros... > any dps
    The windfury was sick as fuck... I'm telling you

    There was a lot of shadowpriest and fury warriors too, I knew a good balance druid... The reason why druids were playing healers or priest playing healers is simply because: Makes don't wanna trade gear with priests, hunters shouldn't have to fight over gear with a shaman and druids shouldn't have to fight over gear with a rogue... However... There was plenty of people on my realm playing shadow, feral, elemental an such...
    Last edited by Everztar; 2014-08-05 at 10:59 AM. Reason: got autocorrected

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