First Marijuana commercial maybe the best one ever ...just ever!

[Deleted]

That actually sucked. The end was sort of funny, but everything leading up to that was complete garbage. You're probably all just a bunch of pot heads so you think anything pot-related is just the best thing ever.

This has been the standard of posting for so many people in this thread , if you have any argument against pot then you have completely discredited it with your ignorant generalisation.

Pretty much everyone here has agreed the advert is terrible , but thank you for letting us know how little insight you have into something you are commenting on.

[StayTuned]

Whelp, I actually completely agree with what you said. I only have problems with the bolded part, since the the frequency/dosage has very little effect on the possible onset of depersonalization disorder in particular. If you have the predisposition towards it, even one joint can trigger it.

My beef is with people who think that they can complete control the harmful effects of smoking weed by adjusting their dosage or what ever, but this is simply not true.

You would have to show me a serious study proving that weed was the ultimate trigger of any disorder after the first use. I think it is more of a platitude that you shouldn't take drugs if you already have a mental disorder - but this is hardly an argument against legalization. Every person is responsible for his/her own body.

And the bold part still holds truth. Everything in excess is harmful. Even drinking too much water at once can cause severe problems.

It is also true that you cannot completely control any/all harmful effects by just adjusting your dosage. Smoking weed is by no means very healthy, especially not spliffs (weed/tobacco joints). But again, the argument I have is that people need to have the freedom to decide for themselves whether or not they wish to take it. I hate nanny states who dictate everything you should be doing

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There is a problem though; heavy cannabis smokers tend to have a "Our opinion is the right and there is no other" attitude towards the discussion - I've mostly stopped trying to have any reasonable conversation on the matter because they are about as flexible as Tumblr feminists when it comes to looking at things objectively.

Their dependence on the substance has effectively created a psychological need to defend it like they are on a holy crusade - what's ironic is that alcoholics display exactly the same behavioural pattern.

Or gun fascists. But that would be too OT :P

[StayTuned]

I agree with everything you said in theory, but my point is that you cannot be sure that you have pre-existing disposition to mental illnesses before any underlying conditions get triggered. Which can happen with the first joint you smoke.

I feel the need to repeat that even though I'm personally against weed, I agree that people should have the right to decide on their own. What I am against, is potheads and weed-believers foaming at the mouth at the first notice of someone saying that weed is not 100% safe.

But who said it is? What you are claiming though is that first use can already cause severe mental illnesses. Increased anxiety after first use? Yes. Mental illnesses? Never read a study from a trustworthy institution claiming this. Not even with predispositions have I ever heard this.

You are not this trustworthy source, and neither is a random selfhelp forum on the internet, where people can only claim that weed triggered it. There might be other causes to everything they had to experience.

[StayTuned]

My god this should be this hard to understand...

I'm talking about triggering pre-existing, underlying, previously unnoticed conditions, not creating new ones.

And I am talking about sources for your claims which you have completely failed to deliver.

[tumppu]

If that crap is the best pro-legalization ad they can come up with, it's no wonder the process is going on so slowly.

[StayTuned]

Thank you for your time. Some things have been interesting to read / skim through, but shizophrenia.com is not that one legit source I was asking for. Just look what they claim:

Andrew Campbell, of the NSW Mental Health Review Tribunal, warned that a hidden epidemic of cannabis-induced psychosis could make the so-called soft drug more dangerous than heroin.

"It's much safer to take heroin -- you can live to be 90 with heroin," Dr Campbell said.

That they use the Daily Fail in their reports makes it even less legit.


All other studies you have linked only support what I said. Excessive use over the years can cause damage.

If cannabis use is legalized, an increase in consumption is to be expected.

This is false.



http://www.eastbayexpress.com/Legali...robert-maccoun

US citizens have a larger per capita use than Dutch. The usage of other drugs is a lot higher as well.


Have you actually read through those studies yourself or have you googled "connection between weed and mental illnesses" and copy pasted those results? I don't even disagree with 99% of what is said there... but only your first link explicitly states that first usage alone, even the tiniest bits, can immediately cause you to go nuts through a predisposition. And it's the only one I do not regard as credible.

People need know that they are at increased risks with predispositions, yes. But unnecessary fearmongering is unnecessary.

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Also, Marijuana and Madness is a 100$ book with only ONE review on Amazon. Hardly a scientific bible.

[StayTuned]

Why is it so hard for you to believe that even first time use can trigger previously unnoticed mental illnesses in people with genetic, or otherwise disposition towards them?

That is like arguing that you don't believe it is possible for people who are allergic to bees to die from shock after having being stung just once.

And yes, I've read many of the studies concerning depersonalization disorder after having to personally deal with it for 15 years now.

It's all about the sources my friend. I am highly critical towards almost everything that hasn't been scrutinized to death. And rightfully so... Otherwise I would have to believe almost every day something else.

I wouldn't even argue with you if you just claimed that it was your personal opinion, or something you just experienced yourself. But you were trying to sell it as facts set in stone, which I just couldn't accept.

There are plenty of sources proving that the bee toxin can kill allergists almost immediately. No such source for first time weed users. Only evidence suggesting that prolonged usage + predisposition is really bad for you depending on what your predisposition is.

I'm not arguing against informing people that those issues might arise, but going "you don't know if you might be affected so better don't smoke because you could become mentally ill immediately" is just fearmongering.

[StayTuned]

more commonly when the dose is larger than that to which users may have become accustomed, and more commonly in older users who may enter the drug state with a higher level of initial apprehension.

Not exactly saying something about tiny bits of weed More like taking more than they should for their first time.

I have to agree with almost all parts of those articles, though. I could hardly find any plausible reason for weed use as long as you are a in high school. Complications during such an early stage of brain development can surely be triggered through weed. I would never argue for weed usage under the age of ~20.

Also, panic and anxiety can be caused through sheer inexperience alone. I have supported people during their first usage and explained to them how they will most likely feel. Mostly people react negatively to the feeling of being stoned, thinking something is going wrong whereas nothing actually is going wrong.

Even this study says

Reactions are usually self-limited and may respond to reassurance or "talking down"; in the case of cannabis use, sedatives are rarely required as the inherent sedative effect of the drug, following initial stimulation, often is adequate. Occasionally one may see a dissociative reaction, but this complication is readily reversible.

So again, I do not even completely disagree with you. Especially not after you actually took your time to defend your stance with some better sources. But no study suggest that smoking 1/3 of a gram of weed will trigger predispositions. Now if you smoke 2 grams in a blunt alone for the first time at the age of 17, you do have a case. That's why we need to inform people how to smoke safely. Banning weed doesn't do much help - but you aren't even against legalizing it so I'm not addressing you with this bit.

[Deleted]

"I can quick any time" -Every Pot Smoker Ever

Do you enjoy the feeling of getting high, do you look forward to when you smoke, and do you get sad when something stops you from smoking? If so, you are addicted.

I think I may be addicted to steak then =/

[Deleted]

Why is it so hard for you to believe that

Simple. Science is not about beliefs. It's about data collecting, studies, theories, and so on.

It seems you are not educated on the subject while trying to sound you are, presenting opinions as facts, backing them up with misread studies and creating artificial or completely irresponsible behavior.