Israel commences ground offensive in Gaza

[Deleted]

Congratulations, you've followed the playbook exactly! 10 points for 'but Hamas'. 10 points for 'But they're violent'. And a whopping 50 points for including random other nations while ignoring the weaponry Israel recieves from the West!

More than that I'd ask him if he thinks the current one to be a working solution.
Mavett, in order to achieve peace through bombs you need to kill ALL Palestinians or you'll never be safe. Are you ready for that?

[Capp]

It really makes me sad to see Israel becoming such a scary echo of what the Jews fled from in Europe, A hypermilitarized state bent on destruction of another group of people.

[Mavett]

More than that I'd ask him if he thinks the current one to be a working solution.
Mavett, in order to achieve peace through bombs you need to kill ALL Palestinians or you'll never be safe. Are you ready for that?

It's obviously not a solution, but neither propping up and giving legitimacy to Hamas and Islamic Jihad is.

@Emiyo, are you done yet drama queen?

[Deleted]

@Emiyo, are you done yet drama queen?

Oh, ouch. The guy who uses hyperbole to shut down discussion calling me a drama queen . 'We could talk about alternatives, but they'll kill us all!'.

You mentioned lifting the blockade. That would work, with international oversight looking into both sides.
You mentioned allowing them to have an airport & seaport. This would work, with international oversight looking into both sides.
But no, you dismissed those outright without giving any thought to them. Your reasons? 'They all want to kill us.'. >.>

[Mavett]

Oh, ouch. The guy who uses hyperbole to shut down discussion calling me a drama queen . 'We could talk about alternatives, but they'll kill us all!'.

You mentioned lifting the blockade. That would work, with international oversight looking into both sides.
You mentioned allowing them to have an airport & seaport. This would work, with international oversight looking into both sides.
But no, you dismissed those outright without giving any thought to them. Your reasons? 'They all want to kill us.'. >.>

It's quite rich coming from you, considering that for the past 2 pages or so indirectly accuses me of "Hasbara" because someone else's view on the situation collides with his own.

Congratulations, you've followed the playbook exactly! 10 points for 'but Hamas'. 10 points for 'But they're violent'. And a whopping 50 points for including random other nations while ignoring the weaponry Israel recieves from the West!

Nice spin you've got there, been practicing?

I mean, just look at this thread. You give people stories of human rights abuses, of children being killed en masse, and it's all brushed away like its nothing. 'But Hamas' they say, or 'it's their nature' others claim. I hope the world can see it before it's too late, though it is concerning that those people who literally called for the extinction of another race are still in office (unless I missed something). Right-wing extremism is winning in Israel. Racist groups are being funded by the Government. Gangs of right-wing thugs are being protected from prosecution (the three sent home despite knowing about the killing of the Palestinian boy). Left-wing Israelis are being attacked on the streets. If I was living in Israel right now I would be shitting bricks, and not because of the Palestinians.

and the amount of fucking drama in this one is absolutely fucking staggering.

It's never brushed aside, perhaps it's just convenient for you to think that way because "reasons", how many times it was expressed that it's absolutely horrible that none involved children women and men dying is not okay, but it's never fucking enough for you and like minded folk here, so what fucking else do you want? the little Israeli crowd that posts here do not have control over the policies of their government nor their votes will swing the balance towards another party, so give it a fucking rest already with brushing everyone as inhumane barbarians.

A bunch of left wing protesters getting assaulted by a small crowd of right wing extremists, AMAGAWD RIGHT WING EXTREMIST WINNING IN ISRAEL111!!!@#

Give me a fucking break, what a joke...

[Deleted]

It's obviously not a solution, but neither propping up and giving legitimacy to Hamas and Islamic Jihad is.

@Emiyo, are you done yet drama queen?

Well it has to be one of the two. By the way, why hams and Islamic jihad? Those are obviously to be politically isolated.

[Fokstar]

Are these supposed to act as peacekeepers between Hamas and Israel?
No, thanks, you can take them back.
Only a matter of time till this Jihadist human waste shows up at our borders.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...565648,00.html
http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/1.613189

[Deleted]

It's quite rich coming from you, considering that for the past 2 pages or so indirectly accuses me of "Hasbara" because someone else's view on the situation collides with his own.





and the amount of fucking drama in this one is absolutely fucking staggering.

It's never brushed aside, perhaps it's just convenient for you to think that way because "reasons", how many times it was expressed that it's absolutely horrible that none involved children women and men dying is not okay, but it's never fucking enough for you and like minded folk here, so what fucking else do you want? the little Israeli crowd that posts here do not have control over the policies of their government nor their votes will swing the balance towards another party, so give it a fucking rest already with brushing everyone as inhumane barbarians.

A bunch of left wing protesters getting assaulted by a small crowd of right wing extremists, AMAGAWD RIGHT WING EXTREMIST WINNING IN ISRAEL111!!!@#

Give me a fucking break, what a joke...

Are you denying the worrying rise of violent right wing extremism in Israel?

[Mavett]

Are you denying the worrying rise of violent right wing extremism in Israel?

I am not denying anything, hes just blowing it out of proportion just as he does with about everything else.

Well it has to be one of the two. By the way, why hams and Islamic jihad? Those are obviously to be politically isolated.

You can't isolate them when money will start flowing freely to pay wages to their 40000+ strong militia, let alone the same taxing system on goods that come in to the strip just like they did with the tunnels between Gaza and Egypt, standing around in a uniform and an AK-47 and above average salary would be much more appealing than hard labor.

[Deleted]

Are these supposed to act as peacekeepers between Hamas and Israel?
No, thanks, you can take them back.
Only a matter of time till this Jihadist human waste shows up at our borders.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...565648,00.html
http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/1.613189

Maybe stop bombing innocent Muslim kids and perhaps you'd have less hate directed at you?
Anyway, un peacekeepers in Syria are not equipped nor ready to stop isis. Their mission is/was completely different.

- - - Updated - - -

I am not denying anything, hes just blowing it out of proportion just as he does with about everything else.

Well, funny you say that, as I'm just out from a discussion with an israeli citizen that had to emigrate as she wouldn't feel safe. She described a whole different scenario, with extremism finding roots at academical and political level, and not only in the streets.
This is confirmed by the shocking political scenario and by the involvement of universities and academics into neo-zionism.
You know the whole "rape as a weapon of war" thing. Do you remember?

Maybe she's wrong? Exaggerating?

[Deleted]

It's never brushed aside, perhaps it's just convenient for you to think that way because "reasons", how many times it was expressed that it's absolutely horrible that none involved children women and men dying is not okay, but it's never fucking enough for you and like minded folk here, so what fucking else do you want? the little Israeli crowd that posts here do not have control over the policies of their government nor their votes will swing the balance towards another party, so give it a fucking rest already with brushing everyone as inhumane barbarians.

A bunch of left wing protesters getting assaulted by a small crowd of right wing extremists, AMAGAWD RIGHT WING EXTREMIST WINNING IN ISRAEL111!!!@#

Give me a fucking break, what a joke...

Read through this thread, the amount of times civilian casualties are brushed aside as casualties of war is staggering. The amount of times they've been explained away as justifiable is staggering. Didn't you, yourself, try and legitimise the strike on a UN school because it was yards infront of the gates, despite it killing yet more civilians? Forgive me if it wasn't you. I have not called anyone inhumane barbarians, I don't equate the actions of a Government to its civilians. I have called out where inhumanity has presented itself.

If you've read anything I've said, I haven't used left wing protestors getting attacked as the sole evidence for a rise in right-wing extremism. A simple look at the charter of the ruling party & the fact people in Government think it is ok to talk about genocide is the main evidence I've cited. That people in the Government can damn an entire race of people without consequence is the main evidence I've cited. The Government openly and knowingly funding racist movements is the main evidence I've cited. A former IDF soldier talking about his experiences is the main evidence I've cited. The discriminatory laws in Israel that seperates Jewish and Palestinian people is the main evidence I've cited. The use of collective punishment only against a single race of people is the main evidence I've cited.

[Mavett]

Maybe stop bombing innocent Muslim kids and perhaps you'd have less hate directed at you?
Anyway, un peacekeepers in Syria are not equipped nor ready to stop isis. Their mission is/was completely different.

- - - Updated - - -


Well, funny you say that, as I'm just out from a discussion with an israeli citizen that had to emigrate as she wouldn't feel safe. She described a whole different scenario, with extremism finding roots at academical and political level, and not only in the streets.
This is confirmed by the shocking political scenario and by the involvement of universities and academics into neo-zionism.
You know the whole "rape as a weapon of war" thing. Do you remember?

Maybe she's wrong? Exaggerating?

She is definitely exaggerating about universities, it's very much dominated by the left wing spectrum of the political map.
As for the political stance, i guess she bases it on Bait Yehudi ( Bennett's party ) empty slogans to appeal to electorate doesn't mean anything really changed on the ground.

[Fokstar]

Maybe stop bombing innocent Muslim kids and perhaps you'd have less hate directed at you?
Anyway, un peacekeepers in Syria are not equipped nor ready to stop isis. Their mission is/was completely different.

Sure, sure, you do comedy?

[Mavett]

Read through this thread, the amount of times civilian casualties are brushed aside as casualties of war is staggering. The amount of times they've been explained away as justifiable is staggering. Didn't you, yourself, try and legitimise the strike on a UN school because it was yards infront of the gates, despite it killing yet more civilians? Forgive me if it wasn't you. I have not called anyone inhumane barbarians, I don't equate the actions of a Government to its civilians. I have called out where inhumanity has presented itself.

If you've read anything I've said, I haven't used left wing protestors getting attacked as the sole evidence for a rise in right-wing extremism. A simple look at the charter of the ruling party & the fact people in Government think it is ok to talk about genocide is the main evidence I've cited. That people in the Government can damn an entire race of people without consequence is the main evidence I've cited. The Government openly and knowingly funding racist movements is the main evidence I've cited. A former IDF soldier talking about his experiences is the main evidence I've cited. The discriminatory laws in Israel that seperates Jewish and Palestinian people is the main evidence I've cited.

The strike was done outside the school, not ON the school and given the visual evidence of the strike area (aka the deep one and a half inch hole in the asphalt, which was created by a molten jet of a small HEAT projectile) i find it hard to believe 10 people have been killed by that, i will prefer to wait for the UN investigation where all of the evidence not available to the general public will be presented instead of relying on UNRWA as a source.


By the way N-7 if you read it, you asked me to update you regarding the sniper shot during riots in the West Bank, people i know ( officer ranks ) that serve in the area, said that they have been using compressed sand rounds (similar to rock salt, painful but not lethal) for riots during protective edge and live rounds only as last resort and with a permission from a higher up.

Take it as you want.

[Deleted]

Sure, sure, you do comedy?

Not really no.

[Fokstar]

Not really no.

Well, your post was an attempt at it.

[Deleted]

Well, your post was an attempt at it.

It wasn't at all. I don't know what your point is.

[Fokstar]

It wasn't at all. I don't know what your point is.

The point was simple - your post had nothing to do with what I wrote, so I thought maybe you like comedy.

[Deleted]

I am not denying anything, hes just blowing it out of proportion just as he does with about everything else.



You can't isolate them when money will start flowing freely to pay wages to their 40000+ strong militia, let alone the same taxing system on goods that come in to the strip just like they did with the tunnels between Gaza and Egypt, standing around in a uniform and an AK-47 and above average salary would be much more appealing than hard labor.

Missed this answer. Why would people be willing to go back to a warlike scenario once they get to sample a taste of normal life?

[bayushisan]

Well it has to be one of the two. By the way, why hams and Islamic jihad? Those are obviously to be politically isolated.

This is precisely the attitude that keeps terrorism around. You can't politically isolate Hamas, because now they're part and parcel of a supposed unity government with Fatah (who are supposed to the the reasonable ones in all this). Islamic Jihad, ISIS, any terrorist group of a similar nature will never be beaten politically because they don't care about politics. They'll just overthrow whatever government the people have established and put themselves in charge. We know this because that's what we're seeing right now in the Middle East.

I've said before how you stop these groups, and no one wants to admit it. No one wants to admit what it would take to actually stop terrorism of Islamic Jihad movements dead in their tracks because it means admitting that there are certain awful and uncomfortable realities about life and the world that people have become to stupid, obtuse or unwilling to see. Keep in mind I don't like what I've said about what it would take to stop this stuff. I know how horrific it would be and I know the level of violence it would entail is something the world hasn't seen in a long time; but the sad reality is that, sometimes, to stop monsters and to save the people you're sworn to protect, you have to take things to a level that the rest of the world would turn their back on you for.