1. #1

    Glyph of CS and UqT - What do?

    First off, forgive me for starting another thread on warrior changes, but I felt like unless you were in on the ground floor of the 180 page current thread it was difficult to search through. I logged onto the beta today to try things out. I knew HS was gone, I don't mind ability cull - but I logged on and literally sat there not knowing how I should be going about it rotationally. Yes, wild strike feels weird and imprecise, but that's not my main issue.

    In short - how do Glyph of CS and UqT play together? Should both be used? one or the other? neither? It just feels very lost woods at the moment and without addons working and final numbers I'm unsure as to which direction to head. My gut tells me the glyph is pretty much a wash, but I'm really not sure about unquenchable thirst. Both have the potential to make the rotation incredibly open and confusing. Is there a TLR for the current thoughts on these two options? I'm just looking for some rotation advice. Again, sorry for making a new thread on what has probably been answered already.

  2. #2
    Glyph of CS is the new glyph of reck last I checked.
    No point thinking about what L45 talent is best until they're done tweaking.

  3. #3
    New glyph of reck in that it's a loss and I should avoid it? That would make me happy.

  4. #4

  5. #5
    Unquenchable Thirst

    Works well because it allows us to control the rotation much better and fill GCDs. To use it effectively;

    • Spam Bloodthirst until Enrage procs
    • Use RB whenever available (preferably while Enraged)
    • Use WS to keep rage around 60-90 (prefering to spend during Enrage as much as possible)

    The CS phase is somewhat complicated due to Bloodsurge but I will attempt to break it down as easily as possible;

    • Use Bloodthirst until Enrage procs
    • Use Colossus Smash once Enraged and preferably with 60-90 rage. Too much more and you can cap out easily, too much less and you can rage starve. Better to go in with more than less.


    After CS hits you will have three 4.5 seconds left on Enrage, or 3 full GCDs.

    1) First use 3x WS first to spend rage and keep from capping
    2) Use Storm Bolt if talented
    3) Use Raging Blow

    You will now have 1.5s / 1 GCD left on CS without Enrage. Despite it being our lowest damage attack, the best thing to do is use Bloodthirst to get Enrage back up again, you simply shouldn't have much rage left over for anything else.

    • You can BzR here to use an extra RB on the last GCD of CS, or you can save it to force Enrage for every other CS without delaying for Bloodthirst luck. Haven't decided the best Single Target use yet, but keep in mind any time we are doing AoE it will be best to save BzR for that.

    • If the first 3 WS were free due to Bloodsurge, you will instead use 6 Wild Strikes and Storm Bolt on the last Enraged GCD. You now have a choice to use an Unenraged RB in the last GCD of CS, or to get Enrage back up and use two RBs outside of CS. With low mastery levels it is probably better to RB and delay Enrage, once mastery is higher than 32%, it is probably better to get Enrage back up. Either way it is a very small difference and the easiest answer is likely to just use BT for consistency.

    • If you are not using Storm Bolt it is probably worth pooling an extra charge of Raging Blow to use during Colossus Smash. You need to be careful however, because it is easy to run the timer on the stack-buff out trying to proc a second.
      The best way to do this is to only use RB when you have two stacks or if you have one stack and the buff is about to expire, and try to proc a second stack along with Enrage on the GCD before you use Colossus Smash. It can be kind of tricky.


    Glyph of Colossus Smash

    Allows for a more stable rotation by removing rage pooling as a concern, and along with it makes rage capping much easier to avoid. It is currently a slight DPS loss, but more tuning and testing is needed.

    However, it does have a couple major drawbacks;
    • If the target dies before the debuff expires
    • Being unable to hit the target for any reason such as movement, target swapping, etc

    Losing uptime on the target greatly diminishes the effectiveness of the glyph since the benefit is spread out over 20 seconds instead of being concentrated within 6.

    To use the Glyph effectively;

    Simply use Colossus Smash on cooldown and follow the basic rotation. It really is quite simple. Because there is no need to pool or collect rage, you should never really be in danger of capping rage either.

    Without UqT the rotation has enough downtime that you can use Wild Strike more or less however you see fit, without worrying about its impact on the GCD (using it four times for example instead of three), as long as you do your best not to push back Bloodthirst.

    With UqT you follow the same "out of CS" rotation as above, simply use Bloodthirst on cooldown until Enrage procs, then use RB and WS accordingly.

    Either way, being Enraged is your primary concern while using the glyph so that you can stack the bonuses.

  6. #6
    Wow, my hero - thanks for the breakdown. Knowing this, I dunno...definitely changes the feel of fury. Time to toy around with arms and glad perhaps. Thanks!

  7. #7
    Thanks archi!

  8. #8
    Since this is a nice concise thread so far, I thought I'd tack on a few other things I'd noticed in Beta - is stormbolt still worth talenting with a 30s CD? I know it's a no brainer on live with trinkets that make it fittable into each CS, but with 30s...is it as mandatory? I'll hold my questions on RB and extension of CS windows, because I assume that'll get pretty broken down in the main warrior 6.0 thread. Thanks in advance!

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Nascosto View Post
    Since this is a nice concise thread so far, I thought I'd tack on a few other things I'd noticed in Beta - is stormbolt still worth talenting with a 30s CD? I know it's a no brainer on live with trinkets that make it fittable into each CS, but with 30s...is it as mandatory? I'll hold my questions on RB and extension of CS windows, because I assume that'll get pretty broken down in the main warrior 6.0 thread. Thanks in advance!
    Yes. Right now it's worth using Storm Bolt on cooldown. They will rotate hitting inside and outside of CS, much like they do with low ilvl Galakras Trinkets. First one will be inside CS, second one outside. Right now it isn't worth delaying SB to put it inside every CS though we may see some changes with the RB extension. Possibly get 2/3 inside CS instead of every other.

    For AoE, it takes 3 or 4 targets for Dragon Roar to be better than Storm Bolt. I want to say 4, but I can't remember the exact number at the moment, tuning will change anyways.

    - - - Updated - - -

    On that, I'm working on the 6.0/Warlords of Draenor guides for Fury and Arms (and prob Glad). Might have an early version posted soonish, but I rather not post things early and then have to redo it all ya know?

  10. #10
    Thank you, you're the man!

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    The CS phase is somewhat complicated due to Bloodsurge but I will attempt to break it down as easily as possible;

    • Use Bloodthirst until Enrage procs
    • Use Colossus Smash once Enraged and preferably with 60-90 rage. Too much more and you can cap out easily, too much less and you can rage starve. Better to go in with more than less.

    After CS hits you will have three 4.5 seconds left on Enrage, or 3 full GCDs.

    1) First use 3x WS first to spend rage and keep from capping
    2) Use Storm Bolt if talented
    3) Use Raging Blow

    You will now have 1.5s / 1 GCD left on CS without Enrage. Despite it being our lowest damage attack, the best thing to do is use Bloodthirst to get Enrage back up again, you simply shouldn't have much rage left over for anything else.
    Haven't had a chance to be on the beta much yet so forgive me if these questions are off, but how does Bloodbath/Ravager come into play with using Bloodthirst (UqT talented) until Enrage procs prior to CS windows?

    BB+Rav>BT>CS>WS/WS/WS>SB>RB>BT and praying that the BT before CS procs Enrage? Or is there a more reliable way to handle this?

  12. #12
    Its funky. BB doesn't stack with Ravager so you dont need to use them together and the random nature of BT crit is going to make it a crap shoot.

    I'd say your best bet is to save BzR for Ravager if you can; Ravager - CS (BzR if no enrage) + BB - CS rotation.

    Failing that, you're playing a guessing game; "will BT crit before I run out Ravager?"

    Ideally you would:
    BT [Enrage] - Ravager - BT until Enrage - CS; but if that 2nd BT takes more than 2 you start running out the time on CS + Ravager stacking.
    Alternately you could:
    BT until enrage, Ravager - CS - WS/WS/WS - SB and screw the RB. It would be less optimal though easier and more consistent.

    Important to note, with UqT Mastery becomes our prime stat, not Crit (though it is still strong) so the most important thing you can do is spam BT when not enraged.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    Its funky. BB doesn't stack with Ravager so you dont need to use them together and the random nature of BT crit is going to make it a crap shoot.

    I'd say your best bet is to save BzR for Ravager if you can; Ravager - CS (BzR if no enrage) + BB - CS rotation.

    Failing that, you're playing a guessing game; "will BT crit before I run out Ravager?"

    Ideally you would:
    BT [Enrage] - Ravager - BT until Enrage - CS; but if that 2nd BT takes more than 2 you start running out the time on CS + Ravager stacking.
    Alternately you could:
    BT until enrage, Ravager - CS - WS/WS/WS - SB and screw the RB. It would be less optimal though easier and more consistent.

    Important to note, with UqT Mastery becomes our prime stat, not Crit (though it is still strong) so the most important thing you can do is spam BT when not enraged.
    Damn, seems pretty messy and inconsistent. Holding BzR for each Ravager CS would probably be best for consistency's sake, but the same can be said for missing the RB with Enrage (though less ideal). Outside of that don't particularly like the idea of it being left to praying BT crits.

    Cheers though ^^

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by esoterickk View Post
    Damn, seems pretty messy and inconsistent. Holding BzR for each Ravager CS would probably be best for consistency's sake, but the same can be said for missing the RB with Enrage (though less ideal). Outside of that don't particularly like the idea of it being left to praying BT crits.

    Cheers though ^^
    TBH the whole spec is messy and inconsistent. Just wait till you see how it looks if WS procs before going into CS....

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