1. #1

    Lightbulb Holy Priest and Priest Dicipline - Very Same - Useless!!

    I have criticisms about the existence of Priest Holy and Discipline Priest.

    There is no reason to be two separate talent trees for them, the difference is very small ...

    Both have a ridiculous DPS, and serve only to Heal ... One has a few buffs and a better shield, another has a cure a little more AoE, could better distribute between these two options only HOLY talents for example, and turn Priest Dicipline in another more different thing ... or a holy DPS or a tanker cloth (that would be unheard of) ... I do not know what would be the novelty, just do not see the sense in maintaining two trees so alike ...

  2. #2
    I think disc and holy are just as different as affliction vs demonology. Or survival vs marksman. Or Subtlety vs Assassination.

    They're never going to be as different as say, moonkin vs feral since essentially, they're both ranged casters.
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  3. #3
    Field Marshal Rait's Avatar
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    Do you even play this game?

    Holy and Disc are completely different from design standpoint (Disc is naturally proactive and absorb based spec while Holy is more of a reactive high throughput healer). Both spec are completely different not only in design but in playstyle and each of them has its niche, shines in different type of encounter (lets talk aside late-MoP since disc is completly broken on most of the T16 encounters and scales too much with gear (crit/mastery)->Divine Aegis while not needing any spirit at all).

    The only point i can agree upon is that holy could use some of prot warrior treatment (gladiator stance I'm looking at you!), having talent option (Inquisitor? Purifier?) to switch into holy-themed dps spec without changing whole gear could be cool.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Rait View Post
    Do you even play this game?

    Holy and Disc are completely different from design standpoint (Disc is naturally proactive and absorb based spec while Holy is more of a reactive high throughput healer). Both spec are completely different not only in design but in playstyle and each of them has its niche, shines in different type of encounter (lets talk aside late-MoP since disc is completly broken on most of the T16 encounters and scales too much with gear (crit/mastery)->Divine Aegis while not needing any spirit at all).

    The only point i can agree upon is that holy could use some of prot warrior treatment (gladiator stance I'm looking at you!), having talent option (Inquisitor? Purifier?) to switch into holy-themed dps spec without changing whole gear could be cool.
    Yes, it is exactly what I mean, I know they are different but I do not see enough difference to be worth two talent trees ...

    I have not played a priest in MOP, played up the Cataclysm, but I have a friend with whom do Arena, he is priest healer, and do not really see the point of be two fashion than this.

    Formerly dicipline was great for arenas, holy was more pve. But today I see holy being more efficient in both roles. The big arena teams are just holy, felt that the dicipline lost its usefulness, could be modified given talents, so he could choose between the functions today and holy dicipline within a single tree, and convert the dicipline in something different, just like you said ...

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by nandomau View Post
    I have criticisms about the existence of Priest Holy and Discipline Priest.

    There is no reason to be two separate talent trees for them, the difference is very small ...

    Both have a ridiculous DPS, and serve only to Heal ... One has a few buffs and a better shield, another has a cure a little more AoE, could better distribute between these two options only HOLY talents for example, and turn Priest Dicipline in another more different thing ... or a holy DPS or a tanker cloth (that would be unheard of) ... I do not know what would be the novelty, just do not see the sense in maintaining two trees so alike ...
    Is this a troll? The two specs barely use the same abilities. Both have a "cure" as you say, I'm not sure where you got the idea that only one did. One is almost purely damage mitigation and the other is all throughput.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nandomau View Post
    Formerly dicipline was great for arenas, holy was more pve. But today I see holy being more efficient in both roles.
    I can't speak for PvP, but in PvE, holy is definitely not more efficient.

  6. #6
    Stood in the Fire grumpyoldman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nandomau View Post
    Formerly dicipline was great for arenas, holy was more pve. But today I see holy being more efficient in both roles. The big arena teams are just holy, felt that the dicipline lost its usefulness,
    HOWEVER this is not enough to claim "the difference is very small". What you wrote here is true, but still, the two specs play very differently. Hence, they deserve to be two different specs.

    It seems to me you are concerned that discipline lost its "usefulness" in PvP, and then, somehow, you concluded that the two specs should be merged into one. I disagree that holy is more efficient in both roles (PvP and PvE); to me, at this moment, disc still has some advantage over holy in PvE (at least in most fights, except, say, gimmick fights like Malkorok). But I agree that holy "took the place" of disc in PvP.

    If I understood that correctly, then let me say: I agree with your premise - that discipline lost its place in PvP, and I, myself, would like to see it be viable again to PvP. But I disagree that holy got better in both roles (PvP and PvE). I also disagree that this situation would be resolved by merging disc and holy into one spec (if that's what you're implying). The two specs still play very different one of the other, they still deserve to be two different specs. Maybe what you really want is the specs to be more balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by nandomau View Post
    but I have a friend with whom do Arena, he is priest healer, and do not really see the point of be two fashion than this.
    As I already said, the two specs play different. Maybe if you try and play a priest you would see how the gameplay is actually different between the two.
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  7. #7
    It really is obvious that you haven't played disc or holy in a very long time. Disc has nothing to do with buffs anymore, both specs have the same dispel capabilities. Disc has a LOT of shields (PWS, DA, Spirit Shell), holy only has a very weak PWS, Disc can do damage to heal, holy cant, disc has damage reduction cooldowns, holy has throughput cooldowns, disc is OP in PvE, holy is dogshit, holy uses Hots, disc uses shields, holy has chakra, disc has archangel.

    The two specs are as far apart as resto druids and holy paladins. There is more difference between holy and disc than there is between the specs of any of the pure dps classes.

  8. #8
    Indeed, I'd say holy priest is closer to a resto shaman than a disc priest :S
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  9. #9
    Dreadlord
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    I think they should merge Disc and Holy into one tree, call it "Holy" and then make a shockadin DPS spec everyone keeps asking for.

    Holy- Healing
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    Balance- Uses Light and Shadow to deal direct damage-

  10. #10
    Mechagnome shanthi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Penguin View Post
    I think they should merge Disc and Holy into one tree, call it "Holy" and then make a shockadin DPS spec everyone keeps asking for.
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  11. #11
    Scarab Lord foxHeart's Avatar
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    Well, I think Shadow Priests are no different than warlocks so we should just remove that spec and give priests a holy dps spec. They're, like, exactly the same thing, after all.
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  12. #12
    Scarab Lord Zka's Avatar
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    Oh noes. Holy and disc are totally different. Different ability sets, different healing mindset, etc. I've been a huge fan of priest healing since vanilla and the only time I was holy was T7 when disc was really really bad. The gameplay is so different that I would never spec holy unless forced.

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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by foxHeart View Post
    Well, I think Shadow Priests are no different than warlocks so we should just remove that spec and give priests a holy dps spec. They're, like, exactly the same thing, after all.
    Well i think all 3 mage specs and all 3 warlock specs are no different, so lets just remove them all and make a single class with one spec called "caster" and it has one spell called "spell damage"

    Except, that's complete shit.

  14. #14
    The Patient Healeze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atonement View Post
    Well i think all 3 mage specs and all 3 warlock specs are no different, so lets just remove them all and make a single class with one spec called "caster" and it has one spell called "spell damage"

    Except, that's complete shit.
    I think that all roles are no different, so let's just remove them all and make 4 classes: Aggroman, Stabbystab, Pewpew, and Healing Tide Totem.

  15. #15
    Not even gonna reply to OP, he's obviously trolling.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rait View Post
    The only point i can agree upon is that holy could use some of prot warrior treatment (gladiator stance I'm looking at you!), having talent option (Inquisitor? Purifier?) to switch into holy-themed dps spec without changing whole gear could be cool.
    Unlikely this will happen. Holy priests are the original WoW healers, not to mention they gave discipline the role of pseudo-DPS (Atonement).

  16. #16
    High Overlord magnapoet's Avatar
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    I think we can just sum Discipline up as the "accidental spec". Disc kind of existed for a long time as a support/buffing spec that no one really used until the talent overhaul. Blizz realized "hey, this shield ability is kind of cool. Why don't we make an absorb spec with weaker healing?" and it kind of just hopped onto a conveyor belt and has yet to be fully realized.

    Just thinking thematically, Disc does kinda play logically. Smiting enemies with holy light and drawing on the soul's of allies to protect them. Discipline is like the bitchy nun that smacks you with a ruler for your own good and Holy is the Catholic priest that's a little too friendly.

  17. #17
    In vanilla alpha & beta disc was planned to be the monk-like melee dps spec. Shame that it didn't turn out that way. :'(

  18. #18
    Why do people keep bumping this thread, he is obviously a firestarter. Some people like disc because they are among the best healers right now, some people actually lile their playstyle, some people like holy and some people don't like either. Pick another class then. XD I have been disc since Vanilla, when BC came out, my job was to give Power Infusion to the mages, off heal when necesary and otherwise dps. When wrath came out they made our bubbles actually mean something and we became viable healers. In cata, thwy brought back our support dps capabilities but made them too good and in mop we were just broken. I would be happy if holy was the healing spec and disc was the mitigation/support spec. As it looks, they'll never get it right.

  19. #19
    Saying that Disc and Holy are the same is crazy. Disc's heals are almost solely absorbtion based, where holy is just straight healing throughput. That's just one example. There are so many differences between the specs that I can't believe this is even a discussion. I love playing my priest simply because of the differences between these healing specs. Unfortunately, I've hardly used holy at all this expansion, but I'm hoping to be able to use both in Warlords.

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