[WOD] Any changes in mechanics that hurt soloing?

[Arcanimus]

But MD threat is reset after 30 seconds. The actual tank has to have seriously horrible threat (unless the target is pet-tauntable) for MD to matter after the first ten seconds.

If you glyph MD and chain-cast it, the transfer will wear off and be immediately re-transferred. You can literally transfer ALL of your threat for the entire duration of the fight to your pet if you so desire.

[Charo]

Sort of off topic: Have any of you tried using the tank trinket from Iron Juggernaut for soloing stuff? It has dodge rating on equip and converts a % of damage into health, while it won't heal your pet, it could generate quite a bit of healing on the hunter. Been wanting this trinket to try it out for soloing stuff for awhile.

[Spiralphoenix]

If you glyph MD and chain-cast it, the transfer will wear off and be immediately re-transferred. You can literally transfer ALL of your threat for the entire duration of the fight to your pet if you so desire.

Right, but the transferred threat amount expires on the target after 30 seconds. You can transfer all of your threat to the pet, but it is not permanent on the pet in the same way as if it remained attributed to you. It isn't a factor when it's just you and your pet, but when you're able to have your pet keep threat on a non-pet-tauntable target over a tank, it's a bad tank.

[Arcanimus]

Right, but the transferred threat amount expires on the target after 30 seconds. You can transfer all of your threat to the pet, but it is not permanent on the pet in the same way as if it remained attributed to you. It isn't a factor when it's just you and your pet, but when you're able to have your pet keep threat on a non-pet-tauntable target over a tank, it's a bad tank.

Read: If Misdirection is up when the transferred threat returns to you, it will be re-transferred to the pet. You're welcome.

[Spiralphoenix]

Read: If Misdirection is up when the transferred threat returns to you, it will be re-transferred to the pet. You're welcome.

The tooltip says the threat fades, not that it returns to you.

This, while an old discussion, existed after the "30 second fade" rule existed, and seems to indicate that when it fades, it's just gone. I have yet to see any evidence that this has changed, or that this is not how it works.

[Phototropic]

Regardless of whether MD threat fades form the target and disappears forever or if it gets traded back to you, if you constantly chain MD to your pet through use of the glyph, the 30sec will continue to roll. Might mean that total threat diminishes or grows over the course of a fight due to CDs and procs but it'll remain there until you stop casting MD.

[Spiralphoenix]

Regardless of whether MD threat fades form the target and disappears forever or if it gets traded back to you, if you constantly chain MD to your pet through use of the glyph, the 30sec will continue to roll. Might mean that total threat diminishes or grows over the course of a fight due to CDs and procs but it'll remain there until you stop casting MD.

I'm sort of confused by your wording here, because the amount of threat on the target would be distinctly different depending on if it fades or gets returned to you (in the way that people are describing above). And if it was returned to you, it's possible they could design it so that when it returns it is just added onto your existing threat total, circumventing the current misdirection duration entirely anyway, in which case yes, it would make no difference.

Anyway, assuming it does fade and disappear completely as the tooltip and the link I provided earlier indicate, I think a good way to think of it would be that the maximum threat at any given time that is on a target due to your MD is basically always limited by how much threat you can generate in roughly a 30 second period.

[Arcanimus]

Anyway, assuming it does fade and disappear completely as the tooltip and the link I provided earlier indicate, I think a good way to think of it would be that the maximum threat at any given time that is on a target due to your MD is basically always limited by how much threat you can generate in roughly a 30 second period.

Simple way to prove I'm right: Go to a mob that wont kill your pet in 30 seconds, put pet on passive and MD to it (don't heal it), and watch as it magically swaps to you after the threat transfers back.

TLDR: Tooltips are not the end-all be-all of how abilities work.

[Phototropic]

I'm sort of confused by your wording here, because the amount of threat on the target would be distinctly different depending on if it fades or gets returned to you (in the way that people are describing above). And if it was returned to you, it's possible they could design it so that when it returns it is just added onto your existing threat total, circumventing the current misdirection duration entirely anyway, in which case yes, it would make no difference.

Anyway, assuming it does fade and disappear completely as the tooltip and the link I provided earlier indicate, I think a good way to think of it would be that the maximum threat at any given time that is on a target due to your MD is basically always limited by how much threat you can generate in roughly a 30 second period.

It's limited by how much threat the hunter can generate in 4s, and since we're talking about the glyph and spamming the use of MD on your pet, the uptime would be nigh on 100%. If the 30s duration of threat disappears, then it doens't matter as a new 30 second window is created every 4 seconds.

[Spiralphoenix]

Simple way to prove I'm right: Go to a mob that wont kill your pet in 30 seconds, put pet on passive and MD to it (don't heal it), and watch as it magically swaps to you after the threat transfers back.

TLDR: Tooltips are not the end-all be-all of how abilities work.

I don't have an active sub, so I can't actually test anything. And the tooltip was not my only source. I linked a discussion specifically where people stated it fades, and does not transfer. Here's another.

That said, the most valid test would be to closely watch both threat values on omen, after 30s. If the pets goes down by x value AND yours goes up by x value, then it transfers. But the mob just switching targets when this happens is not proof - the fade could be enough to put you ahead, depending on prior threat. And your bar getting bigger is not proof either - bars are scaled based on the highest threat value, and if the highest goes down all other bars grow larger.

It's limited by how much threat the hunter can generate in 4s, and since we're talking about the glyph and spamming the use of MD on your pet, the uptime would be nigh on 100%. If the 30s duration of threat disappears, then it doens't matter as a new 30 second window is created every 4 seconds.

No, you did not understand what I said. The TOTAL amount of threat on a target (your pet) from all of your MDs is limited by the maximum you can generate in the window that ANY of that threat expires.

Let's say you generate 100k threat every 4 second window. Then after 30 seconds, you will have generated roughly 25k*30 = 750k threat. But at this point, the first 100k that you generated expires. So you're back to 650k. Then by 32 seconds 700k, 34 seconds 750k, but here another 100k expires, so back to 650k. Effectively hovering around 700k with a max of 750k.

And yes, it doesn't really matter if it's just you and your pet since you'll never actually generate any threat personally with a 100% uptime MD, it's just about knowing the true mechanics behind the ability. And I've never heard of the threat returning to the hunter after 30s prior to this discussion, and all sources I can find (not many, since nobody really cares about this) state that the threat disappears entirely and does not transfer.

Anyway, I don't know why I'm here without an active sub, guess I still have some passion for this class or whatever, but as typical these forums meet any question of what they believe with hostility or smartass replies when you feel you've won the internet discussion. I'm just trying to clarify a mechanic that I believed to have worked differently to what has been said here, that's it.

[eschatological]

The threat transfer would even out, yes, after 30s, as it goes out roughly proportional to how it comes in. And yes, any tank should be able to surpass 750k fairly easily in 30s.