Thread: Snowden 2.0

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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubby View Post
    Just so we're all clear, Snowden is a 100% traitor.
    And yet most people are still thankful for what he did. So...who exactly cares?

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    Your Founding Fathers were considered traitors. You consider Snowden a traitor. Also, I wasn't making an analogy. I was stating a fact. If you found an "analogy" within that fact, good for you.

    I guess anyone fleeing the oppressive government of North Korea is a traitor too, then? Oh, and just to Godwin the conversation... All the Jews who were killed by the Nazis; someone might think it's insulting for you to consider them traitors as well.

    A little man having a little thought in his little head does not a traitor out of someone make. Congratulations, you made the list.
    you assume the two are similar? usa is like north korea? or nazi germany? i dont even know what to say... must be nice living in finland not in reality.

  3. #43
    The Unstoppable Force Bakis's Avatar
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    Snowden <3 <3 <3

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by UncleSilas View Post
    Is your Government being secretly run by the cast of Monty Python?
    I wish, it would be much better ran, but a lot less hilarious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Schmeebs View Post
    I just read the article, and nothing seems that shady, they gather information on people, ahve lists of people, and some people are selected for extra scrutiny... seems reasonable to me but then again I'm not crazy.
    I'm almost willing to guarantee my partner and I are on a list somewhere. For the 10th anniversary of 9-11 we went to London, France and Germany (spent a week going between all three). We have also made countless numbers of trips to Canada. Our passport sees a lot action. I would hope they would monitor people that traveled that much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleSilas View Post
    First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Socialist.
    Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Jew.
    Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

    It's the principle of the matter. If you're fine with infringements of your privacy for your security, awesome. But no choice was ever given to the people.
    You do realize that poem references coming for as imprisoning and killing right... please show me where there have been socialists and trade unionists imprisoned or killed. I think its a great bastardization of that poem to apply to monitoring people for the safety of the country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Annoying View Post
    You imply that we're a democracy. When's the last time you voted for *any* federal issue?
    It's a republic. We voted people in to office that we thought had our best interests in mind, and they turned around and stabbed everyone in the back for some loose change.
    They are still doing pretty much what I want them to do. Then again, I'm weird that way... I'm a social liberal and a true financial conservative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Annoying View Post
    Because the military tests that everyone still thinks were some alien crap aren't infringing on our rights. Leaking military research = espionage/treason. Leaking constitutional infringements = whistleblowing.
    Please, show me where there is a constitutional right to privacy. There is a constitutional right against unreasonable searches and seizures, but I would have to say that monitoring the public domain is by no means violating that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    Just so we're all clear, so were the Founding Fathers.

    Thanks to them, who history now calls "patriots" by the way, there you are, whining and bitching about someone who's fighting a corrupt government to defend your freedoms, and thanks to him, the future is just a little bit brighter.
    Name 5 ways in which Snowden improved the future of this country and its foreign relations... just 5. Go on!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    I think you should check the definition of an analogy in a dictionary, because I didn't make one.
    Doy! You can't be that bloody daft. You just compared Snowden to the founding fathers. That is an ANALOGY!

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/analogy

    My brain hurts for you, and I can totally understand how YOU would consider Snowden a hero.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    Your Founding Fathers were considered traitors. You consider Snowden a traitor. Also, I wasn't making an analogy. I was stating a fact. If you found an "analogy" within that fact, good for you.

    I guess anyone fleeing the oppressive government of North Korea is a traitor too, then? Oh, and just to Godwin the conversation... All the Jews who were killed by the Nazis; someone might think it's insulting for you to consider them traitors as well.

    A little man having a little thought in his little head does not a traitor out of someone make. Congratulations, you made the list.
    I think there is a huge difference between being a traitor to your own people and that of another country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by turskanaattori View Post
    United States Constitution Article III Section 3:
    'Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.'

    Snowden is helping U.S. citizens, not levying war against the United States.
    Name 5 ways in which Snowden helped ANY US Citizen.
    "The round, metal cooking utensil referring to the larger, cookware customarily used for, but not limited to, stews, as being of a dark shade or possibly of African descent." ~~ Fixed for now. But keep in mind any one of the words used in that fix may become politically incorrect or offensive at any moment for any reason. Further amendments may be required to prevent frivolous lawsuits in the future.

  5. #45
    Scarab Lord Nachturnal's Avatar
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    Eh.. these leaks are poop though =/. NSA and all that bla bla isn't interesting lol. I wanna hear some crazy shit, like aliens, and death rays, and like actual proof of politicians getting bribes and stuff, these security leaks are about as interesting as a door closing.

  6. #46
    Brewmaster Pantupino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AbsolutVodka View Post
    Eh.. these leaks are poop though =/. NSA and all that bla bla isn't interesting lol. I wanna hear some crazy shit, like aliens, and death rays, and like actual proof of politicians getting bribes and stuff, these security leaks are about as interesting as a door closing.
    Same here (on the first part lol) but still, this is serious stuff. I'm not an US citizen but I still care for this as other countries might copy what the US is doing with the NSA. I don't like my government spying on me because I like X stuff and do Y stuff.
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  7. #47
    The Insane Masark's Avatar
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    Warning : Above post may contain snark and/or sarcasm. Try reparsing with the /s argument before replying.
    What the world has learned is that America is never more than one election away from losing its goddamned mind
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  8. #48
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Bruce Schneier points out that there are likely three U.S. intelligence leakers, not two.
    "In today’s America, conservatives who actually want to conserve are as rare as liberals who actually want to liberate. The once-significant language of an earlier era has had the meaning sucked right out of it, the better to serve as camouflage for a kleptocratic feeding frenzy in which both establishment parties participate with equal abandon" (Taking a break from the criminal, incompetent liars at the NSA, to bring you the above political observation, from The Archdruid Report.)

  9. #49
    The Undying
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendra View Post
    And yet most people are still thankful for what he did. So...who exactly cares?
    Lol, dream world time again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    Bruce Schneier points out that there are likely three U.S. intelligence leakers, not two.
    How is this guy the end-all, be-all of sources on this subject?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    I already did. Bruce Schneier, the most respected independent cryptographer on the planet, doesn't agree with NSA-front company Recorded Futures. But to add to that..
    NPR’s Story Saying ‘Snowden Tipped Off Terrorists’ Isn’t True


    In reality, Al Quadea and related organizations have been improving their crypto capabilities for a long time, including releasing a new encrypted messaging tool months before Snowden's leaks began.



    This is rich, coming from someone who has pretended the misdeeds of the NSA (and the CIA) just don't exist. What hypothetical "objective discussion" are you talking about? You've repeatedly ignored clear evidence of wrongdoing exposed by Snowden, and the very real, very obvious damage to the US that's come about as a result of the NSA's actions, in favor of trying to shoot the messenger. Pay no attention to the Man Behind the Curtain, indeed.
    You're just so biased against federal government agencies - I seriously have no idea how you can consider yourself anything but. And those other two "sources" - aren't they basically blog posts?

    And I've never ignored wrong doing exposed by Snowden (show me where I have if you doubt me). But it cannot be denied, by anyone with a shred of logic and knowledge, that Snowden is a traitor.
    Last edited by cubby; 2014-08-08 at 03:07 AM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendra View Post
    And yet most people are still thankful for what he did. So...who exactly cares?
    but the people that matter...

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by bufferunderrun View Post
    why they never leak something juicy about area 51? Always this nsa crap .
    The government released tons of Area 51 documents last year. http://www.nbcnews.com/science/space...ek-f2D11591426
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  12. #52
    Deleted
    I once thought to become a employee of the NSA.

    Until i thought about all those emails every morning.
    Last edited by mmoc903ad35b4b; 2014-08-08 at 06:03 PM. Reason: Sarcasm.

  13. #53
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    Berlin: NSA is not spying on German industry
    August 11, 2014

    Among the many untruths propagated by the Snowden Operation is the notion that the National Security Agency is busy spying on private firms to seek economic advantage for the United States. In Germany especially, this caused a firestorm of controversy, with many believing that Germany’s powerful economy is at risk from American espionage against German industry.

    Left-wingers in Berlin grew sufficiently worried about this issue that they asked the Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution (BfV), Germany’s counterintelligence agency, to investigate the matter. Their assessment has been obtained by the Berlin daily Die Welt, which reported its findings today. The BfV is aware of some 200 cases of potential or actual espionage against German firms since 2005. However, in only in a few of those cases did the counterspies find “concrete evidence” of intelligence service involvement in industrial espionage.

    Many such cases involved Chinese individuals and firms, but given their possible ties to governing structures in Beijing, it was difficult for German counterspies to determine what was private data theft or the work of an intelligence entity operating through a cut-out. In the BfV’s words: “Because of the close links between the industry and the state, for example, in the People’s Republic of China, it is difficult to differentiate whether the industrial spying was done on behalf of the state or competing foreign companies or private persons acting on their behalf.”

    The question of American involvement in industrial espionage against German firms was investigated closely by the BfV, which came to this conclusion: “There is currently no concrete evidence of potential involvement of U.S. intelligence services in espionage attacks on German companies,” adding, “the U.S. Government has assured the Federal Government several times that its services do not conduct economic espionage.”

    Instead, according to the BfV, known cases of industrial espionage since 2005 have “almost exclusively” involved spying by China and Russia. “The companies have not reported any indications of spying activities by Western countries,” reported German counterintelligence.
    http://20committee.com/2014/08/11/be...rman-industry/

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