12 year old MI boy charged as adult with murder, stabs 9 year old.

[AmericanJustice]

So do many criminals involved in every other crime you listed yet you believe that only murderers cannot be rehabilitated for some arbitrary reason.

They do not believe a fucking second chance, REGARDLESS of whether or not they change or not... Earlier I made a thread that murderers could purchase the ability to "reprogram" themselves in the far future to have better control over their anger or control empathy levels or whatever so they would be easier to rehabilitate.. When I made a post on the CNN forums about it, they told me something that I had not really looked at. MOST victems of homicide suffer from PTSD and high suicide rates, for the most part they do no want their killer released whether or not they are reformable! and one of them brought up a chart that MOST victims of murder do not want their victimizes to be given a second chance REGARDLESS on whether or not they changed. In addition they also do not support the death penalty... 91% of victims according to a Pew Poll reviles that

ITS FUCKING EASY to stand in your high horse and call down "NOT ALL MURDERERS ARE THE SAME" "Hes only 12" but lets see what fucking happens when you get the short end of the stick. Life is not pretty, prison is not pretty, JUSTICE can be hideous, but justice must be carried out. If a loved one got murdered, I would not give a damn if he is "reformed" or not, I would want him to serve the rest of his days in prison. That is what i consider justice, and apparently, 91% of victems agree with me, and the bulk of America are behind me, the majority of MMO-C supports my views on manditory life without parole for murder regardless on whether or not the murderer can be rehabiliated. Oh and btw, GL trying to rehabilitate a murderer..... They have rediculous re-offend rates here in the US. Do a quick google seach and see what I mean.

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So do many criminals involved in every other crime you listed yet you believe that only murderers cannot be rehabilitated for some arbitrary reason.

It's not just about re-offend rates, it's a way to pay restitution to the victims, by giving up YOUR freedom.

AND AGAIN, murderers have the HIGHEST RE-OFFEND RATES OF ANY CRIME. what that means is at least half who are released are going to commit a crime ON release.

[Mayhem]

HOLY CHRIST from the age of 4 I FUCKING KNEW murder was wrong, the kid is literally 3 times my age back in 1990 holy wtf???? The reason why they cannot drink alchohol is cause it causes much more damage to their brains than kids, voting? You think kids have the ability to vote? talk to the average 12 year old and see what happens....

knowing something is bad and comprehending the outcome is something different, am i saying he should go free? no, but there is a reason minors are treated as minors

[AmericanJustice]

knowing something is bad and comprehending the outcome is something different, am i saying he should go free? no, but there is a reason minors are treated as minors

Ok, if you want to play games I'm down for it. The fact the kid gave himself up to the police tells us that hey comprehended what he was doing.

LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE

[Deleted]

They do not believe a fucking second chance, REGARDLESS of whether or not they change or not...

So what you said is based solely on an emotional response than anything logical. I understand.

ITS FUCKING EASY to stand in your high horse and call down "NOT ALL MURDERERS ARE THE SAME" "Hes only 12"

I never actually said that one, although not all killers are the same. That is an objective fact.

Life is not pretty, prison is not pretty, JUSTICE can be hideous, but justice must be carried out.

Whose justice? That is the question.

If a loved one got murdered, I would not give a damn if he is "reformed" or not, I would want him to serve the rest of his days in prison.

And what is that supposed to mean? If I believe somebody who steals from me needs to be tortured or imprisoned forever does that mean they should be?

That is what i consider justice, and apparently, 91% of victems agree with me,

I'm sorry but so what? People want the harshest punishments for those who hurt them because they are emotionally effected. Nothing more.

Oh and btw, GL trying to rehabilitate a murderer..... They have rediculous re-offend rates here in the US. Do a quick google seach and see what I mean.

Oh please, like most crimes don't.

[Mayhem]

Ok, if you want to play games I'm down for it. The fact the kid gave himself up to the police tells us that hey comprehended what he was doing.

LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE

no, he knew he did something bad, but that´s still not comprehending the consequences, do you understand the difference?

[AmericanJustice]

no, he knew he did something bad, but that´s still not comprehending the consequences, do you understand the difference?

Yeah this dumb kid thought he would just be tried as a child, THAT is the reason why he committed first degree murder. If he knew he would be tried as an adult, maybe he would have thought about it twice.

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So what you said is based solely on an emotional response than anything logical. I understand.


I never actually said that one, although not all killers are the same. That is an objective fact.

They are ALL very difficult to rehabilitated, that is an objective fact.

Whose justice? That is the question.

I already explained this. Justice for society. Life without parole = zero recidivism, infact the odds they will kill another innocent person behind prison is lower than the odds a normal person will become a murderer, Life without parole = justice for the victims, Life without parole = strongly supported in the US.
And what is that supposed to mean? If I believe somebody who steals from me needs to be tortured or imprisoned forever does that mean they should be?

I'm sorry but so what? People want the harshest punishments for those who hurt them because they are emotionally effected. Nothing more.

This is not about emotions FFS

Oh please, like most crimes don't.

except it's fucking murder, if you ruined someone's life your life should be ruined, it is only fair. and again RE-OFFEND RATES OF MURDERS IS AT LEAST 50%.

[Deleted]

They are ALL very difficult to rehabilitated, that is an objective fact.

Naturally soldiers who kill as per their duty should be imprisoned, same with police officers and those who kill in self defence if that is the case.

I already explained this. Justice for society. Life without parole = zero recidivism, infact the odds they will kill another innocent person behind prison is lower than the odds a normal person will become a murderer, Life without parole = justice for the victims, Life without parole = strongly supported in the US.

Interesting how you made the 'innocent' distinction there. Very interesting.
Also a lot of support in the US for something is not an argument for anything.

except it's fucking murder, if you ruined someone's life your life should be ruined, it is only fair.

Yet you're okay with rehabilitating rapists and people who violently attack without killing others.

[Phookah]

Yeah. It kind of does matter since the entire American justice system (juvenile and adult) is based partly on intent. The justice system takes all factors into account and weighs them against each other. Intent has always been a mitigating circumstance. There is a huge difference between killing someone because you want to kill all white children and killing someone because you were doped up on some medication that has been known to lead to violence (for example).

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Juveniles cannot be given the death penalty. That has been ruled on by the Supreme Court of the United States. I'll give you one guess where that case came from.

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If you think the American prison system (which normally costs us more to house a convict for life than it would cost to send them to Harvard) is completely a for profit system then you have been watching to much Orange is the New Black.

You really don't think our prisons are for profit, because "its costs us more"?
You boggle my mind.
Kids shouldn't be tried as adults, except in EXTREME cases. I'd say the kid turning themselves in and saying he wants to die shows remorse which is much more than can be said about adult criminals. Not to mention, didn't the kid say something about eating some pills earlier in the day? Who's to say they weren't PCP or some fucked up shit?

[AmericanJustice]

You really don't think our prisons are for profit, because "its costs us more"?
You boggle my mind.
Kids shouldn't be tried as adults, except in EXTREME cases. I'd say the kid turning themselves in and saying he wants to die shows remorse which is much more than can be said about adult criminals. Not to mention, didn't the kid say something about eating some pills earlier in the day? Who's to say they weren't PCP or some fucked up shit?

The victims do not give a shit how much 'remorse" the perpetrator has. 91% of victims of homicide want life without parole for the perpetrator REGARDLESS on whether or not he/she is reform-able.

[Deleted]

I can't say which story is true as they all seem to be different. Honestly though, 6 years for murder doesn't seem right... Especially when those 6 years are in a Juvenile Detention Center.

I am of the mind that this child should be charged as an adult and given a sentence that fits his crime.

I agree on the sentence length but not about trying the individual as an adult myself.

[Skalm]

I'm referring to the massive racial disparity in how children are tried as adults.

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And for Michigan in particular, since that's where this story is.

Nationwide, racial disparities appear at each
juncture of the criminal justice system. In
Michigan, 73% of those youth serving life
without parole are children of color, despite their
only representing 29% of youth in Michigan.

Here's a though...maybe 73% of the juvenile crimes (penalized with life) in Michigan were committed by colored juveniles?

Lets make it simple. There are only 100 youths in Michigan. 29 of them are colored.

Now say that there were 10 crimes committed where the penalty was life.

7 of those crimes were committed by colored juveniles.

Guess what...there is your ~73%. Oh yeah...that's only ~24% of the colored juvenile population OR only 7% of the total population.

So yeah, get out of here with your doctored stats.

Statistics is one of the greatest tools to manipulate people into taking your view on something. While the #'s are valid, the way they are represented changes the 'overall' oicture. As can be seen by the quote you referred to.

[Pickynerd]

Ok, if you want to play games I'm down for it. The fact the kid gave himself up to the police tells us that hey comprehended what he was doing.

LIFE WITHOUT PAROLE

Great idea! Oh wait.. 180,000 dollars a year to feed and guard this kid for the next 70-80 years?

Death is to harsh for an undeveloped child, life is to expensive. I say 13 years of rehabilitation and set free. He knows exactly what he did, he has to live with it.

Then again prisons for profit are probably already bidding on him.

[bestpike]

If the law can make an exception for a minor to be tried as an adult, then consistency says that there must be a context where sexual relations between an adult and a minor should not be considered paedofilia. Consistency is the key word here

[SocialJusticeWarrior]

Hang him. Or whatever is in fashion now. Not all children are precious.

[AmericanJustice]

Hang him. Or whatever is in fashion now. Not all children are precious.

agreed. we need to stop this wierd empathy for murderers.

[PACOX]

Fucking tragic.

I see a lot people in this thread also don't understand child psychology or mental illness. It's obvious that the kid who did the stabbing had some issues and being a kid he is probably pretty conflicted in his head. Kids have very little impulse control and this kid other mental health problems as well. Being remorseful after the incident really doesn't say much about his state of mind when he committed the crime. Long story short, the kid shouldn't be charged as an adult because his mind isn't even close to that of an adult. Trying him as an adult is an attempt to sweep everything under the rug. Fuck for sakes just going off the story it seems llike his impulses git the best of him.

The kid is young enough and malleable enough to get proper help, and not become a fucks up adult.

[Crissi]

Guy gets convicted for 2nd degree murder, people say just give him prison time. Kid murders, people say kill him. I dont get whats with people having more empathy for an adult than a kid.

[Mayhem]

Guy gets convicted for 2nd degree murder, people say just give him prison time. Kid murders, people say kill him. I dont get whats with people having more empathy for an adult than a kid.

the kid knew what he was doing, obviously

[vaeevictiss]

Guy gets convicted for 2nd degree murder, people say just give him prison time. Kid murders, people say kill him. I dont get whats with people having more empathy for an adult than a kid.

i say kill both of them. I dont support either.