iLvl 570 for Garrosh NORMAL?

[Dazu]

"Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact."

This is quite funny isnt it

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Meters dont count in stuns as interrupts. So tell me again how you know you are the top interrupter?

Just an unrelated question. If its your actual interrupt that you are the top interrupter in then the rest of your raid sucks

Well I cant for certain tell how many stuns were interrupts, but finishing garrosh normal with 3-4 interrupts (plus stuns/fears myself via shadowfury/howl of terror) and the next interrupter is at 1 or 2 gives me a pretty good idea. Also, you rarely need to interrupt in the first place during phase 2 as they should be damaged enough to break prior and if its a healer who was MC'd and you stun them good chance they could die due to debuffs ticking, especially if using the stack method (which I personally dislike, its not hard to move and doesnt really improve dps much but can easily wipe the group or stress healers around iron star impact damage).

And yes thats kind of also the point I was making, the rest of those PuG's generally suck and fail at many things they shouldnt, and normally the worst of them are people sub 555 ilvl, although I care more about how they are gemmed/reforged than the actual item level. Normally you get people who do what they are meant to more often at the higher areas. Then again, no reason a lock cant interrupt as well as any other class on that fight, you cant get more than one MC interrupted per cast of touch of y'sharrj, so the fact that a warlocks CD is 24 seconds not 15 like some is irrelevant. Interestingly though, quite a few locks ive seen dont even know they have an interrupt, and some of them have been doing SoO heroic bosses. The people I prefer to avoid are those which dont know what a personal self CD is, or what a raid CD is, or even methods they can use to reduce raid damage taken (aoe stuns on adds, anti magic shield, twilight ward etc).

People saying everyone should be higher than 540 etc, quite a few of those are alts you need to remember. I have 5 toons over 540 ilvl, out of 13 level 90's. Im still competitive for my ilvl (as in I pull about what I should at say 520 etc) on those other toons but I dont have time to LFR that much per week. That and ive found alot of really good players in those lower ilvl areas, its just less the normal now and far more common to find people who have only done LFR previously.

[Gray_Matter]

You don't care at all. You're just so entrenched in this farce of a thread that you're feigning a combination of concern and discouragement that has been marred by both selfishness and misinformation. The fact that you've just told us that you don't need to do anything demonstrates that you're unwilling to remedy the situation yourself and want others to change for your needs. Oh wait you said you're not playing so none of what you say should matter.

Everyone is selfish. Every single post on this forum has a certain amount of bias in it. It's the nature of people. Misinformation is your opinion, it's not a fact. I don't have a situation that I need to be remedied. I have a certain direction that I would like the game to take because I believe that direction suits the majority of players and not the minority that seem to be posting here a lot defending the toxic behavior that has taken over WOW. Of course there are ways around the problem ranging from spending time in PVP to grinding for 2 odd months or joining a guild and binding myself to a fixed set of raid nights every week. Of course there is also the option of starting your own raid. A new person with no experience at all in that raid type would be foolish at best for doing that. That's not fun for me personally and for a lot of other players. We have a choice to leave the game or put up with it. History is telling us that a lot are choosing to leave.

If anyone on these forums complains about anything in WOW then people jump out of the windows and start calling them names like baddies, lazy, useless or combinations thereof. When that doesn't work, they pull out the whining or whinging card. Yes, it's the nature of forums.

Nothing that anyone else says matters, regardless of whether they are playing or not. The only person it does matter to is the one saying it.

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Anyone else feel that this is the most rude thing you can do too anyone on a forum?
It's like saying "I don't wanna face your arguments because i know i am right so i just ignore that those arguments excist"

Yes it's rude but there are certain cases where it's warranted. I ignore trolls because there is no logic to their arguments. They push an opposing view, regardless of how illogical it is just to cause strife. The second group of people that I ignore are people who can't discuss or argue and instead revert to name calling an insults. In this case, it was the latter. That and it really hurt my eyes reading the posts.

[Jessicka]

For Garrosh only, this isn't surprising, people are going for an Heirloom farm for their alts. 540 is probably a bit low to be expecting to get a run for Normal mode at this point too; sure it's doable at that level, but folks don't want to roll the raid back to progression gear-level difficulty - especially for those later bosses. There are plenty of groups out there on openraid or oqueue who are looking around 550 - 555 ilvl - which is acheivable through Flex/Ordos/Celestials easily enough, you'll get through the first 7-8 bosses comfortably to gear further and then you can start looking at the higher ilvl requirement groups to get you your Garrosh kill.

[Lime]

Holy christ, even if English isn't your first language, you could at least make an attempt to be legible.

Please... It's perfectly legible. Maybe you need to question your own intelligence first.

[Deleted]

Meters dont count in stuns as interrupts. So tell me again how you know you are the top interrupter?

Just an unrelated question. If its your actual interrupt that you are the top interrupter in then the rest of your raid sucks

Actually, meters do count interrupts. Both recount and Skada do it. I'm not sure how seriously I can take you, considering you don't even know how to analyse a raid.

[Jessicka]

Actually, meters do count interrupts. Both recount and Skada do it. I'm not sure how seriously I can take you, considering you don't even know how to analyse a raid.

He said 'stuns as interrupts' which is correct, Skada and Recount count interrupts, but not stuns/knockbacks when they're used to interrupt casts.

[Alroxas]

There should really be a "civilized" rating for players that you could click up every time someone said something in a reasonable way. Of course, if I had my way that would probably be the only way anyone would ever be allowed on the forums. Honestly, you could still have raging arguments in a polite, civilized way.

So we should just move the discussion to reddit?

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He said 'stuns as interrupts' which is correct, Skada and Recount count interrupts, but not stuns/knockbacks when they're used to interrupt casts.

Technically though, stuns only work in P2 MC'd and once you get to P3 MC'd (where players transform when they are MC'd) they don't work (only hard interrupts do).

Shouldn't really rely on stuns as interrupts for that particular fight.

[Deleted]

He said 'stuns as interrupts' which is correct, Skada and Recount count interrupts, but not stuns/knockbacks when they're used to interrupt casts.

Oops. Read that as "stuns and interrupts".

[Klik]

It's a combination of supply & demand (specifically for Garrosh kills, there are a lot of people with 570+ ilvls who want Garrosh kills each week) and of risk mitigation. It's worth holding out for someone with an ilvl high enough to trivialize the encounter.

[cabyio]

Being nice is it's own reward. Or it should be, I'd hope.

Ah, so you be nice so you can feel are warm and fuzzy inside, what a load.

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I don't think it'll force anyone to use the raid browser. That's not going to be all that much more enticing then than it is now (Which is to say, to most, it isn't at all.)

Though I do agree that I wish it were easier to get things done without a guild, but it isn't, and it isn't going to change, so whatever.

It shouldn't be easier to get things done without a guild. Hell, they should make it harder to get things done without a guild. Guilds are the key to all the crap people like you whine about. I can't find a group that will let me raid normal. Find a guild. This raid is too hard. That is because your pugging it, find a guild.

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The thing is, again, WoW teaches you just the opposite while leveling, while doing battlegrounds, while doing dungeons, while doing heroics, while doing LFR, while doing practically everything else that isn't Arena, RBGs, or raiding (all ultimately activities that aren't even all that relatively popular, might I add!). It's a fundamental design conflict within itself. It needs to pick what it wants to be, and stick with it.

It has. Wow is the end game by evidence of being able to buy a skip to the end game. So what makes the end game enjoyable is what is important and in this case it is being in a guild.

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Think people just wanna be immersed in a nice World, and dosen't wanna be dependent on others for their progression

Then they should go play a single player game with good immersion. What is the point of having others in a world if you don't have to depend on each other to get some stuff done.

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It's a combination of supply & demand (specifically for Garrosh kills, there are a lot of people with 570+ ilvls who want Garrosh kills each week) and of risk mitigation. It's worth holding out for someone with an ilvl high enough to trivialize the encounter.

Right. If you can ask for 570+ and still have no problem filling your raid then why wouldn't you? Like in business you balance what price you ask for your product and how many people will still buy it at that price.

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Please... It's perfectly legible. Maybe you need to question your own intelligence first.

It may be strictly readable, but it look like your cat was trying to crawl across the keyboard while you were typing. Is it so hard to go back and proofread your post one time before you hit post?

[Radish Spirit]

But I'm NOT complaining about that, sheesh.

Are you serious? You literally accused me of not being "compassionate" because my farming runs aren't open to people of lower iLvl. Does that not qualify as "complaining" about it?

[cabyio]

Are you serious? You literally accused me of not being "compassionate" because my farming runs aren't open to people of lower iLvl. Does that not qualify as "complaining" about it?

Heh, the classic, "Have compassion" aka "I'm not very good, please carry me "

[melodramocracy]

"I'm not very good, please carry me "

aka "I'm just looking for a smooth fast run"

[judgementofantonidas]

Oh, he most definitely is. He's got a long history of acting like this and putting people down.

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the only person on this forum that I see showing a history of putting others down recently seems to be you. I made one post about 570 not being a very lofty goal for anyone, and no one in particular, who takes the time to apply themselves and it elicited, what 5-6 posts about me personally?

look in the mirror.

[Radish Spirit]

aka "I'm just looking for a smooth fast run"

Uhh, right. Key difference being the former is spoken by a 540 and the latter by a 575, so guess who gets to come to the farming run?

[Otimus]

the only person on this forum that I see showing a history of putting others down recently seems to be you. I made one post about 570 not being a very lofty goal for anyone, and no one in particular, who takes the time to apply themselves and it elicited, what 5-6 posts about me personally?

look in the mirror.

What? You freaking call LFR Looking for retards. You constantly insult people who do things a way you don't approve of. Do you DENY this?

How can you view anything you've done as NOT insulting?

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Are you serious? You literally accused me of not being "compassionate" because my farming runs aren't open to people of lower iLvl. Does that not qualify as "complaining" about it?

No, I didn't, I said you should see how things are from other people's point of view. Not that you should like.. allow people in or anything. You know, see how it can be frustrating for people to pug content.

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Heh, the classic, "Have compassion" aka "I'm not very good, please carry me "

What a douchey thing to say. I'm not even pugging content :x

What's your deal, anyways?

[cabyio]

What a douchey thing to say. I'm not even pugging content :x

What's your deal, anyways?

My deal is all the people that constantly clamour about raids being too hard, people being too exclusionary, community being too toxic, that it stops them from doing the content they want. If those people would spend that time trying to improve themselves or finding a guild to work with instead of whining and doing LFR they would be able to do all the content they want just like people that are already raiding.

The attitude that is so prevalent lately that instead of trying to overcome boundaries and achieve goals people spend effort complaining that the system is too hard or that the system is against them. Not just in wow, in everything.

[Selphia]

The problem is bad players who have full upgraded normal gear. They do bad/mediocre DPS and even though a good player with 540 or 550 ilevel will out dps them, they are never given a chance (because you have to assume everyone is bad). Same thing for heroic. I tested it with guilds who are only 6 or 8 kills into Siege and want really high ilevel people. Even though I've cleared 3 weeks 11/14 heroic, they wouldn't accept me because I'm 10 ilevels under their requirement.

[Deja Thoris]

the only person on this forum that I see showing a history of putting others down recently seems to be you. I made one post about 570 not being a very lofty goal for anyone, and no one in particular, who takes the time to apply themselves and it elicited, what 5-6 posts about me personally?

look in the mirror.

Well, if you are not 570 by now you have been doing something terribly wrong for one thing.

No, you actually said "you have been doing something terribly wrong" which makes you sound like a dick.

Saying it's not really a lofty goal at this stage in the expac with quad upgrades and time to farm ordos is both correct and it doesn't make you sound like a dick.

When you are perceived as a dick then people start to come with put downs like "killing more than 2 hc bosses with 575 ilevel isn't a lofty goal", if 5/6 people do it then you are the one in the room people haven't taken a shine to, if you want to stop eliciting those responses from people choose your words more carefully.

[Archermit]

I would personally never invite a 541 to a normal Garrosh kill. If I'm hosting a group, I want a fast, easy kill, not a fight where we barely have the DPS reqs.

How does a higher item level give you the fast clear?
If people still focus him down and ignore MC's at teh end you could have all 600 item levels and wipe