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  1. #41
    Bloodsail Admiral Ashtwo's Avatar
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    Resolve is going to be so much better than the current Vengeance. Encouraging people to stupid things just to do more DPS is the main reason I detest some peoples tanking.

    It may be "fun" for the person tanking but when you're making life harder for everyone else, or risking wiping on content that's been on farm since March (a late kill in our case) then yeah, it's a mechanic that needs to be removed.

    Tanks in my eyes aren't meant to do damage, but hey ho I'm old fashion.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtwo View Post
    Tanks in my eyes aren't meant to do damage, but hey ho I'm old fashion.
    Our first priority should be to stay alive, yes. But maximising your output whilst staying alive without hindering the raid is what makes a good tank, especially on the fights with tight enrages/DPS mechanics.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Methyl View Post
    Our first priority should be to stay alive, yes. But maximising your output whilst staying alive without hindering the raid is what makes a good tank, especially on the fights with tight enrages/DPS mechanics.
    I agree with you on that one, I have nothing against tanks maximizing their dps without hindering the raid. The problem with vengeance stacking in general however is that it creates an abundance of tanks that think they do a good job if only they do enough dps on a fight, sacrificing their survivability and taking hits like an old lady in the process.
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. The universe is winning...

  4. #44
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    Sorry i meant to say 'one of the things that make a good tank' xD

    I guess even with vengeance stacking gone there will always be questionable builds that maximise output at the expensive of taking much bigger hits. I'm no expert but a mastery heavy build looks like it'll be the safest way to go with release, but crit will likely contribute much more to damage at the price of taking significantly more at those gear levels.

    Either way, it'll be very different to how we're expected to tank now and i'm looking forward to it :]

  5. #45
    I'm mostly looking forward to not having discussions anymore with one of the tanks in my guild along the lines of "let me tank this, I do more damage than most dps because I can push more vengeance" or "I need this dps trinket for my tank spec because I'll do more damage"
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. The universe is winning...

  6. #46
    Bloodsail Admiral Ashtwo's Avatar
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    I'm yet to find a tank that grasps the idea of maximising output whilst GUARENTEEING they stay alive. It's always "okay lemme get a few more adds so I can do more dp- FUCK QUICK RES ME"

    All the while I'm bladestorming and suddenly have to cancelaura so I can DieByTheSword so I don't get anally rampaged.




    "Hey if you delay the Iron Star in P4 I can get some sick Vengeance"
    -Yeah or we could kill the boss and stop fucking wiping in p4 with a guarenteed kill, your rankings don't indicate skill -.-


    /rant

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtwo View Post
    I'm yet to find a tank that grasps the idea of maximising output whilst GUARENTEEING they stay alive. It's always "okay lemme get a few more adds so I can do more dp- FUCK QUICK RES ME"
    This sounded so so familiar lol
    Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. The universe is winning...

  8. #48
    Bloodsail Admiral Ashtwo's Avatar
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    Literally at least once every... single... raid...

    It's either that or "quick vigilance me" and by the time I click the macro that automatically targets the tank, they're dead - Naturally the blame is split between the healers and my 'inability' to Vigilance in 0.005 seconds.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtwo View Post
    Literally at least once every... single... raid...

    It's either that or "quick vigilance me" and by the time I click the macro that automatically targets the tank, they're dead - Naturally the blame is split between the healers and my 'inability' to Vigilance in 0.005 seconds.
    Sounds like you need better tanks xD

  10. #50
    A good tank that knows when, how, and how much damage he will take ain't that hard to heal if your healers are aware that he'll be going for high vengeance. For instance, on Garrosh we 2heal (25man), with our tank doing everything he can do increase his damage, but as long as he's on top of calling externals he'll never die and his damage output is insane. A good tank can turn a 9min kill into a 7min kill without too much hassle, and by doing that increases the likelihood that the dps manage to snag some ranks as well.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Warriorsarri View Post
    Protectors: Solo tanking. A group with few Warlocks so that the small adds stay up for as long as possible. Having the Anguish focusing on you for increased vengeance.
    Fairly certain the fixate does nothing aside from the small amount of damage you take from the attacks directly. The armour debuff you get does not effect vengeance. To do lots of tank damage you pull the trash with the boss and the trash empowers the boss.

  12. #52

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Warriorsarri View Post
    What trash?
    The trash between Protectors and Norushen.

  14. #54
    I've yet to see any other guild than Duality using those adds to pad on him, with that said I'll see if I can make that change...

  15. #55
    I didn't say everyone uses it, I said that's how you do huge tank damage. My guild 2 tanks and our warrior is only ~200k behind rank 1.

  16. #56
    The fact that people go to the lengths of pulling extra trash to buff the boss to rank higher makes me laugh. No wonder it still takes guilds of that skill at 388 ilvl 3-4 hours to clear...
    Last edited by Gliff; 2014-09-08 at 11:14 PM.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtwo View Post
    It may be "fun" for the person tanking but when you're making life harder for everyone else, or risking wiping on content that's been on farm since March (a late kill in our case) then yeah, it's a mechanic that needs to be removed.

    Tanks in my eyes aren't meant to do damage, but hey ho I'm old fashion.
    Ranking in dps or doing speed kills and such always required gimmicky tactics. It might not have been gimmicks for the tanks, but for others, but it was always the case. Hysteria/Salv rotation, class stacking, cooldown stacking, unusual positioning etc.

    For a lot of people it is very boring just to go back to SoO to farm and nothing else. Why not get some spice in the game with some gimmicks?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ashtwo View Post
    Literally at least once every... single... raid...

    It's either that or "quick vigilance me" and by the time I click the macro that automatically targets the tank, they're dead - Naturally the blame is split between the healers and my 'inability' to Vigilance in 0.005 seconds.
    Stop clicking and keybind :P
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    Woman rapes a guy, gives birth to child and has custody of the child.
    I don't see why you should take the child from the woman unless she abuses it.

  18. #58
    Top ranking dps is almost always BS. Tanks or dps... doesn't mater. Get your entire raid to stack around what is best for you and your dps will go way up.

  19. #59
    Honestly the DPS rankings game is a different game in itself. If you're just trying to beat the boss your group is playing so much differently than if you're trying to get dps rankings. And the hardest part is convincing a group who just wants to beat the boss to relearn it a different way for one person's glory on a site most people don't care about.

    I'm not trying to knock what he did, I'm sure that took work and research, but for people just wanting to know how they rank amongst people doing the same fight as it was meant to be done, it sort of makes the value of all those sites deceptive.
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