Gamergate - OP updated 27 October

[Wildberry]

Milo's comment may have been over the top, but he's gone and issued an apology and it's still not good enough...

[Lyese]

Secondly, people like parallel are more than welcome here, I actually wish more who disagreed with GamerGate came here. They are what keeping us honest and sane. I just wish they were better debaters, so far we've only had people cherry picking and generalizing to the max, with no real arguments and with the usual rhetoric that we are anti-feminists or harassers etc.

I resent that.

As far as the whole "Why don't we make the damsel rescue the hero" bit, I think Yahtzee made a pretty good point in this week's Extra Punctuation.

Of course I don't believe that hero-damsel narratives are actually misandrous. I'm trying to illustrate something I was taught on my first day of media studies: that the same facts can support a wide range of conflicting agendas, depending on how you frame them. In truth, I don't think hero-damsel is misandrous or misogynistic. I think the worst you could say about it is that it appeals to gender roles that are part of our base, emotional instincts, the animal brain stating that men need to be the big strong defenders going into harm's way to protect the poor fragile women who can't be expected to save themselves, thus ensuring the continued survival of the species.

And if I object to that, it's because it's lazy, and tired, not because it's slanderous or unrepresentative of me. I think video games should aspire to be more thoughtful, rather than create appeal by triggering pure emotional responses. Hero-damsel isn't trying, it's too easy. But having said that, there's certainly nothing wrong with using it as a foundation to explore more interesting concepts, such as in Silent Hill 2 again. And furthermore, if we're talking about using it as a blatant placeholder plot in order to concentrate on creating a raw, cathartic gameplay experience (like in Painkiller, say), then I'm all for that as well, not much point in trying to be thoughtful in an admitted turn-your-brain-off kind of game, pass the shotgun.

Essentially, it isn't fixing anything. There's little inherently misogynist with the "hero saves damsel" trope, it's just tired and worn. When writers complained about Mario saving the Princess instead of, say, a golden wrench, it misses the point of the whole thing.

[Sj]

Interesting. Apparently moot has ties to Gawker through his girlfriend's PR company. Lost the webpage when my phone's browser crashed (lol IE) and I didn't catch which chan offshoot it was on.

[Addiction21]

As a woman... Milo just hurt me deep inside...this is the ammo they needed and he just gave it to them.

And the replies to that are golden. I've been in the escapist thread reminding people its the content. He has done some work but never forget gamers are the most stubborn people walking the planet and they will call you on your BS. That is a bs twit and he is getting what he deserves.

Also Liana K. has done some videos and they are good. I cant post links since im new (lurking for years and years) but its on her youtube. Also a long talk with Sargon of Akkad you can find it on his tube channel.

Great talks worth a watch.

[Lyese]

Interesting. Apparently moot has ties to Gawker through his girlfriend's PR company. Lost the webpage when my phone's browser crashed (lol IE) and I didn't catch which chan offshoot it was on.

Huh. That is an interesting tidbit of info.

[Wildberry]

Interesting. Apparently moot has ties to Gawker through his girlfriend's PR company. Lost the webpage when my phone's browser crashed (lol IE) and I didn't catch which chan offshoot it was on.

Post Here

The above lays it out pretty clearly.

On an unrelated bit, Milo just tweeted: "If you guys can't see that she's deliberately being provocative, there's no hope for any of you. I give up. Nero out. #GameGate"

[Durandro]

As a woman... Milo just hurt me deep inside...this is the ammo they needed and he just gave it to them.

https://twitter.com/Nero/status/513055406118436864

Dead link. What did he say?

He's also not very kind towards transgendered people. But I mostly let him off (since its undoubtably a position of ignorance) so long as he doesn't bring it into the Gamergate debate and sticks to facts. If he doesn't, then he can be safely pushed to the side until he learns to behave.

[Sj]

Showing her connection to Gawker: http://www.forbes.com/pictures/eihl4...lory-blair-25/

Confirmation of relationship: https://twitter.com/yourpalmal/statu...08043146969088


God this shit runs deep.

[Wildberry]

He's also not very kind towards transgendered people. But I mostly let him off (since its undoubtably a position of ignorance) so long as he doesn't bring it into the Gamergate debate and sticks to facts. If he doesn't, then he can be safely pushed to the side until he learns to behave.

Do we really have to bring Milo's opinion of transgendered people up? If we're "Letting him off" wouldn't it be better to just not post it?

[Theendgamelv3]

I dont think this is a good approach. We already seen what she can do when she is backed into a corner, we should press on the journalist side of things. Let 4chan clean up their own house, and if they do wrong we have to call them out on it. We cant be lumped in with wrong doing at this point because that is how we're going to lose ground. They want us to lose ground so they can be on top again. Keep writing devs, keep ignoring their antics and their sites, and keep supporting good guys like Liana K or The Excapist. Sure Liana wrote for Polygon but read her article on archive, then if its good, GIVE HER PAGE VIEWS! i know we dont want to support polygon but hear me out, maybe if they see that Liana's article gets more page views than say a Social Justice article, they will be willing to adopt that kind of press. its a long shot, but its worth a try.

Fight their negativity with positivity, dont fill this movement with hatred of the opposition thats how we lose. They need to look like the bad guys that they are here. Gamers should dictate the market not them. Gamers matter, not the gaming press. Gaming is young so they see it as an easy target for their little movement. They want to infect us like they have everything else, but they underestimated one thing. We have spent our whole lives saving the world, fighting tyrants, destroying gods, and helping the innocent. They will lose because they underestimated just how many people are really gamers. They will lose because we have the numbers, and we have the right to not be lied to anymore.

You're getting me wrong here. I am not saying being negative, which is why I am saying be responsible. If you let Zoe Quinn get away with this, who is next? Show off the censorship that is happening because in the end you say "we see what she can do", but her friends are the same exact journalists that people are against.We have seen what they can do. What she can do, they can do. They are sadly tied together IMO cause they are friends. If one of them has a problem, she can help them out. Remember this, it isn't just 4chan, Reddit has been accused of censorship as well. It isn't about Zoe Quinn, it is about censorship, Zoe just happened to be apart of it again. If it was someone else, just replace their name with Zoe Quinn with what I said. All I am saying again is fight censorship responsibly. These people should not have the power to control what we can say.

[hellhamster]

Dang that Milo, I thought he grew as a person after this. I hope he didn't do irreparable damage, but he already probably did...

[draykorinee]

Dead link. What did he say?

He's also not very kind towards transgendered people. But I mostly let him off (since its undoubtably a position of ignorance) so long as he doesn't bring it into the Gamergate debate and sticks to facts. If he doesn't, then he can be safely pushed to the side until he learns to behave.

He said, you get your tit's out for a living what do you know. To someone who asked some questions about his journalism

[Addiction21]

Dead link. What did he say?

He's also not very kind towards transgendered people. But I mostly let him off (since its undoubtably a position of ignorance) so long as he doesn't bring it into the Gamergate debate and sticks to facts. If he doesn't, then he can be safely pushed to the side until he learns to behave.

Well that very long stream on Kotakuinaction that has Totalbiscuit (around the one hour mark) has Devi a transgendered developer comes in and she says something agree with. Its the facts not the person. I don't agree with the views but at least hes doing the work like a real journo.

He said some stupid shit and the replies were unanimously don't do that. I am going to wait and see because he is getting a real crash course in gaming culture. You say something stupid you are called out on it.

[Frozen Death Knight]

So I just got to know about this whole GamerGate thing and from what I've seen so far, I'm glad I missed out on a lot of it.

I knew gaming journalism could be shady, but this? This is on a completely different level of insanity.

[nextormento]

On an unrelated bit, Milo just tweeted: "If you guys can't see that she's deliberately being provocative, there's no hope for any of you. I give up. Nero out. #GameGate"

Proper ragequit! oneofus.gif

/seriousface: it was a low jab, and the husband sock doesn't help either...

[hrugner]

Yiannopoulos is a tabloid hack. Anyone linking his articles or praising his "journalism" never gave a fuck about ethical reporting.

I don't know enough about him or his boss to agree with the insults, but I do consider him one of many political groups attempting to split the gamer group into something more manageable, or court the gamer group and attempt to influence their opinions for some outside prupose. It's the risk of being a rising and diverse group that appears to be ignoring more useful triablism style divisions. It's actually really neat from an anthropological perspective, I've been looking for corollaries in other groups but I'm not finding anything as most off shoot groups like this usually get claimed by a religion or a country.

[Theendgamelv3]

Well that very long stream on Kotakuinaction that has Totalbiscuit (around the one hour mark) has Devi a transgendered developer comes in and she says something agree with. Its the facts not the person. I don't agree with the views but at least hes doing the work like a real journo.

He said some stupid shit and the replies were unanimously don't do that. I am going to wait and see because he is getting a real crash course in gaming culture. You say something stupid you are called out on it.

While it is true on what Devi said, it isn't the smartest thing to put anyone to put Milo or Adam Baldwin on a pedestal (not saying you are). If they say crap about transgendered or gays, it only helps the argument that gamers are bigoted. Remember that Adam Baldwin has said some pretty anti-gay things.

[Durandro]

Do we really have to bring Milo's opinion of transgendered people up? If we're "Letting him off" wouldn't it be better to just not post it?

I brought it up to let people know that he's already being treated with a degree of skeptism and we're not rallying behind him like the all conquering hero who can do no wrong.

- - - Updated - - -

He said, you get your tit's out for a living what do you know. To someone who asked some questions about his journalism

Eek. No wonder he deleted that then. That's pretty dumb.

[hrugner]

He said, you get your tit's out for a living what do you know. To someone who asked some questions about his journalism

Nice, what a piece of shit.

[Durandro]

Well that very long stream on Kotakuinaction that has Totalbiscuit (around the one hour mark) has Devi a transgendered developer comes in and she says something agree with. Its the facts not the person. I don't agree with the views but at least hes doing the work like a real journo.

He said some stupid shit and the replies were unanimously don't do that. I am going to wait and see because he is getting a real crash course in gaming culture. You say something stupid you are called out on it.

Right, I listened to that too. I agree with her stance in that I might disagree with his personal views but the facts are a seperate thing. I think Total Biscuit brought up the world "compentmentalise" or something to that effect. Which is something I struggle with at times.