[6.2.3] Discipline Priest Discussion

[Pearl1717]

Yes it definitely makes sense. Many disc priests don't use mindbender anymore (which does a fair amount of dps) and many, such as myself don't use a whole lot of offensive penances (which does even more damage). Plus there are many healers out there who are terrible raiders and don't do dps for the sake of dps (such as yours truly...). It's also normal ranks, so theres that too. If I were youI'd just take it and be happy knowing you're actually being a better contribution to your raid group than most people :P

[PosPosPos]

Right, but that's the thing, pretty much everyone should be able to maintain 10K dps, so it shouldn't be a 98% ranking if everyone's doing it. I'm not saying that 10k is high; I'm saying that 10K isn't high, and am wondering why, at 10k, I get such a high rank. Does that make sense?

Unfortunately, not many disc priests subscribe to the offensive playstyle.

Some do it for the right reasons, e.g. keeping Penance as a very strong single target burst heal, using the 2/2 pc combo, underhealing which opens up a lot more opportunities for a full defensive penance; while others do it blindly for a variety of bad reasons, like erroneously thinking that atonement is still weak this tier when it's not(due to 2pc), or they copy blindly off top players and their playstyles without considering the difference in strategy, player skill and raid composition.

I have had several disc priests on the same server come up to me asking why there's a huge difference in hps while having 10k extra dps, and aside from the fundamentals like low CPM, they are blindly firing off defensive Penance without taking into account they are overhealing encounters and thus just sniping other healers, or picking into Solace with a low uptime when Mindbender would serve them better.

[Pearl1717]

Unfortunately, not many disc priests subscribe to the offensive playstyle.

Some do it for the right reasons, e.g. keeping Penance as a very strong single target burst heal, using the 2/2 pc combo, underhealing which opens up a lot more opportunities for a full defensive penance; while others do it blindly for a variety of bad reasons, like erroneously thinking that atonement is still weak this tier when it's not(due to 2pc), or they copy blindly off top players and their playstyles without considering the difference in strategy, player skill and raid composition.

I was actually gunna give the offensive penance playstyle a go this week on farm cause I'm always up for testing new things, but then we skipped most of it to kill Xhul. Pos, do you generally use MB or solace nowadays?

[shanthi]

My general philosophy has been to keep Penance on cooldown...if there's someone at low health, who's health pool I can re-fill, or a tank is currently taking a lot of consistent damage, I'll pour it into that person defensively. If there isn't any good defensive opportunity right then or in the very near offing, I'll pour it into the boss or an add. The HPS loss is mitigated a bit by the value of either an extra stack of Evangelism or the value of not having to Smite for that stack. Plus the DPS value, especially on a high-priority add.

[PosPosPos]

I was actually gunna give the offensive penance playstyle a go this week on farm cause I'm always up for testing new things, but then we skipped most of it to kill Xhul. Pos, do you generally use MB or solace nowadays?

I haven't used Solace in a long, long time. The last time I used it was in early BRF prog.


As a mini-background overview of sorts:

Offensive Penance build is a lot simpler and more straightforward than defensive Penance, because you always just fire it off on the boss/add instead of having to pick targets for the heal; yet at the same time you can note the drop in triage healing when you do that. Thankfully, my co-healers are always extremely on the ball when it comes to triage, so it's a playstyle that really works out well for me.

As such, I only use defensive Penance as a primary method of casting the spell during emergencies(much like any disc priest would use flash heal), special healing absorbing mechanics like Tyrant/Fel Lord/HFA prog.

Edit: Tekc and Dorfie have some really good offensive Penance logs you could look over as reference. Tekc balances between both playstyles, while Dorfie seems more firmly in the offensive line.

[Deleted]

I haven't used Solace in a long, long time. The last time I used it was in early BRF prog.


As a mini-background overview of sorts:

Offensive Penance build is a lot simpler and more straightforward than defensive Penance, because you always just fire it off on the boss/add instead of having to pick targets for the heal; yet at the same time you can note the drop in triage healing when you do that. Thankfully, my co-healers are always extremely on the ball when it comes to triage, so it's a playstyle that really works out well for me.

As such, I only use defensive Penance as a primary method of casting the spell during emergencies(much like any disc priest would use flash heal), special healing absorbing mechanics like Tyrant/Fel Lord/HFA prog.

Edit: Tekc and Dorfie have some really good offensive Penance logs you could look over as reference. Tekc balances between both playstyles, while Dorfie seems more firmly in the offensive line.

Why havn't you used solace for so long? Do you have better synergy with MB? I've ran solace for the whole of hfc and not even tried MB.

[PosPosPos]

Why havn't you used solace for so long? Do you have better synergy with MB? I've ran solace for the whole of hfc and not even tried MB.

I value the added dps over 1 GCD every 60 seconds, as well as the mana gain using MB over Solace. I also am not blackmailed to having to keep a high uptime on Solace.

Also, Phylactery, especially the mythic version, hates Solace; or no-mana-cost spells in general, further skewing the balance in MB's favor.

[Deleted]

I value the added dps over 1 GCD every 60 seconds, as well as the mana gain using MB over Solace. I also am not blackmailed to having to keep a high uptime on Solace.

Also, Phylactery, especially the mythic version, hates Solace; or no-mana-cost spells in general, further skewing the balance in MB's favor.

I have not even factored that about Mythic Phylactery. I am really going to have to try MB now. Holy crap I think i'm about to convert to MB!

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if your playing MB, do you always try to use PI with it?

[PosPosPos]

I have not even factored that about Mythic Phylactery. I am really going to have to try MB now. Holy crap I think i'm about to convert to MB!

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if your playing MB, do you always try to use PI with it?

As much as possible, yes, together with Borrowed Time. MB also has no attainable haste cap(if it even has one).

[Djriff]

Max haste Ive been able to get is 110% for 24 swings of mb.

[Griimes]

Max haste Ive been able to get is 110% for 24 swings of mb.

holy shit

that feels like a crap ton to me.

[Overdispersion]

holy shit

that feels like a crap ton to me.

PI+BL+Berserk+Borrowed Time probably takes you up to those levels.

[Myllior]

PI+BL+Berserk+Borrowed Time probably takes you up to those levels.

You don't even need Berserk to reach it; with 1483 Haste rating, you've got 110% Haste with PI+BL+BT. Include Berserking and bump up the initial Haste rating to 1762 and then you've just hit 150% Haste. It's pretty funny.

[Djriff]

PI+BL+Berserk+Borrowed Time probably takes you up to those levels.

Ewww troll priests? I do try to line up PI and mb with lust for the maximum mana return. Although with DP mana is a joke atm.

[Azobank]

I've used offensive pennance a lot. Sometimes saved deffensive pennance for when I know incoming damage like felblaze flurry on Xhul'hrac or absorb mechanics like touch of harm on Velhari. But I've for wrong reasons, it was easier for me to play that way. Less to think about and don't have to hunt low health targets. I had a lot of overhealing on my pennance so decided I might aswell do damage with it instead.

Was when we were heading towards Mannoroth I realised I might have to look over how much damage I can do and since then I've sticked with mindbender purely for the extra DPS. I was surprised when I started looking at disc DPS. I knew atleast one (Jinze) who didn't log public and did more DPS on pretty much every fight. But without playing mindbender or intentionly do damage like holy nova HFA, Kormrok or use SWP I did more damage then the vast majority of public logging disc priests. Very few disc priests trying to do any damage on progress.

I'm currently wiping on Archimonde and have been extended for last two resets. For us the push is still very tight, sometimes we get dogs to P3 and sometimes we don't. My 12K DPS do difference in my raid. Same on Mannoroth we had problems pushing at the right time, on our first kill I did 14K DPS in P2 (P1). 14K doesn't sound a lot but all you trade is less overhealing. It's almost 14K free DPS. If shit hits the fan I don't have to change stance, loose resources or anything.

As disc priest I'm not a damage battery to unleash for free kill. But you're usually four healers. If noone is in risk of dying do damage. Together we did 47K boss-DPS in P2 on Mannoroth, that's equivalent to what a DPS in my raid did to the boss. 14K is nothing but 47K is noticeble, but to get 47K we all have to chip in our free globals. Much focus on hunting down every HPS. If me healing more results in the raid bringing one less healer I really should up my game and focus on that. But until then I should do as much damage I can without putting anyone else in danger.

It depends on a lot of things, your healer team, your raid and players enjoy playing different. But hunting HPS never got to me. Maybe a rant but I'm very surprised over the lack of damage, last two resets a coupple priests really tried thou.

[Pearl1717]

So I haven't actively pursued getting gold on challenge modes yet this expansion but I am going to be trying to do that soon. I was wondering from any of you that have gotten 8/8 gold as disc, what talents/glyphs/stat prio and all that did you go with. Also would it be advisable to get 630 gear, or would it not make much of a difference using hfc gear.

[PosPosPos]

So I haven't actively pursued getting gold on challenge modes yet this expansion but I am going to be trying to do that soon. I was wondering from any of you that have gotten 8/8 gold as disc, what talents/glyphs/stat prio and all that did you go with. Also would it be advisable to get 630 gear, or would it not make much of a difference using hfc gear.

If you are not trying to push realm first timers, your standard raiding set and stat priority is more than sufficient to do it with. If you are, Haste/Crit rather than Mastery/Haste is better.

There are two major approaches when it comes to disc healing(specifically for fillers), the first is Clarity of Will mainly and the second is Flash Heal mainly.

I personally use the Flash Heal playstyle for the added mobility, but CoW is better if you are running a high-sustain tank(cough Blood DKs cough) or need to preshield the tank/group before a difficult pull. In either case, you still will find the need to use both at some point.

T15 - Spectral Guise is default talent, allows you to drop combat on-demand to drink, but Desperate Prayer is also a good choice if you are just going for gold and not realm first.

T30 - Angelic Feather is the default talent, but Body and Soul can work on the CMs that don't require invis pot.

T45 - Mindbender is the default talent for the added dps to push timers, but Surge of Light can work if you are running the Flash Heal playstyle.

T60 - Void Tendrils, although generally you aren't expected to CC much anyway.

T75 - Power Infusion is the default talent, as CMs are all about mass pulling and popping CDs. That goes for all roles.

T90 - Halo is the default talent since you are most probably going to run Mindbender anyway. Still, you wouldn't use this line very often, if at all.

T100 - Even as I run the Flash Heal-heavy playstyle, I still have Clarity of Will slotted. CoW tanks, Flash Heal to top up other party members if they take damage.

Glyphs: Penance, Weakened Soul(Defensive)/Reflective Shield(DPS), Fade(Defensive)/Inquisitor or Smite(DPS)/Fear Ward(mostly for BSM if lacking interrupts/stuns)

Tips: Bring along a good supply of health, instant mana, invis and intellect potions, as well as some mana food if you don't have access to a mage. Prepot intellect on trash pulls that are difficult. Prepot mana on the easier trash pulls so you don't have to sit as much. If mana isn't a problem, then pot intellect. Unless you need to invis, always keep your potion timers on CD. Nag at people to health pot so you spend less time healing and more time dpsing.

[Djriff]

Didnt they change reflective shield to only activate on a shield you have? I dont know what kind of damage you took as a healer in cms but for me its been very little.

[PosPosPos]

Didnt they change reflective shield to only activate on a shield you have? I dont know what kind of damage you took as a healer in cms but for me its been very little.

That's why if you have nothing better to do, go step in fire to min max your dps. 2 seconds off Weakened Soul isn't that gamebreaking in CMs anyway.

[Djriff]

True it wont but stepping in fire isnt going to do anything to the boss if its an environmental effect.