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  1. #1

    Technology going backwards in laptops?

    I saw some adds from best buy and dell today "specials on laptops" I'm like ok let's see:

    - 5400RPM HDDs
    - Single channel RAM (1 DIMM)
    - Pentium/Celeron grade CPUs, not even i3
    - Integrated GPUs not worth a damn

    Prices: 400-900$.

    Really? I paid 1600$ on my Dell 7 years ago and it has a Core 2 Duo 2.0Ghz, GeForce 8600M GT and 2GB of Dual channel ram w/ 5400RPM HDD. Later upgraded to 2.5GHz, 7200RPM then SSD and 4GB RAM. Even at quarter price RAM and HDD technology shouldn't be backwards up to a decade. Are those Pentiums and Celerons even at least dual core?

    Oh and read this:

    "500GB hard drive (5400 rpm) gives you lots of storage and fast read/write times." Really?

    http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/...439a31c367en02

  2. #2
    Elemental Lord Rixis's Avatar
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    There will always be shit components/laptops, the key is marketing them to the idiots. If they can sell shit at a higher price, they've earned that money

  3. #3
    Single channel RAM and single core CPUs though? It seems barbaric. Even smartphones are almost better equipped than that.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    Single channel RAM and single core CPUs though? It seems barbaric. Even smartphones are almost better equipped than that.
    your average joe isnt as clued up as us gamers on tech for setups. yeah, it's barbaric, they'd argue it's profit margins.
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    Fluffy Kitten Remilia's Avatar
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    Uhh... you might want to actually look at the thing.
    http://ark.intel.com/products/81074/...up-to-2_58-GHz
    And, you're talking about a $450 laptop...
    It's a budget product... not really something you're going to wow yourself.

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    Elemental Lord Rixis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    Single channel RAM and single core CPUs though? It seems barbaric. Even smartphones are almost better equipped than that.
    It's 8 gig of ram and a 2.58 Ghz processor. Bigger numbers are better numbers to the uninformed. It's like blindly accepting a 40 megapixel camera is awesome.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Remilia View Post
    Uhh... you might want to actually look at the thing.
    http://ark.intel.com/products/81074/...up-to-2_58-GHz
    And, you're talking about a $450 laptop...
    It's a budget product... not really something you're going to wow yourself.
    Oh, the number of cores is usually indicated for marketing so I assumed it was single core and they didn't want to mention it. Well, I guess the CPU isn't barbaric then. RAM and HDD are still out of place though.

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    Fluffy Kitten Remilia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    Oh, the number of cores is usually indicated for marketing so I assumed it was single core and they didn't want to mention it. Well, I guess the CPU isn't barbaric then. RAM and HDD are still out of place though.
    Not really. You'll find most RAM to be single channel because it saves space which allows for smaller form factor due to it being soldered on. The one you linked has dual channel capability. The N3530 can only handle 8GB per RAM stick and the laptop has the ability to expand to 16GB which means that there's a 2nd RAM slot. For most user, the dual channel on a low end laptop is the least of their concern in terms of performance.
    5400RPM again, cost and power usage.
    This isn't performance we're looking at for $450. It is a low budget laptop, hell mine is only $750 or so and I replaced the HDD with an SSD. I don't expect it to be amazing but it suits my need for what it is.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    Oh, the number of cores is usually indicated for marketing so I assumed it was single core and they didn't want to mention it. Well, I guess the CPU isn't barbaric then. RAM and HDD are still out of place though.
    A 500GB HDD and 8Gb RAM are out of place on a budget laptop? I think your expectations are unreasonable. Not unexpected considering the hyperbolic tone of your original post.

  10. #10
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    Oh, the number of cores is usually indicated for marketing so I assumed it was single core and they didn't want to mention it. Well, I guess the CPU isn't barbaric then. RAM and HDD are still out of place though.

    Not sure why you expect better for $450?

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    Immortal Stormspark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baar View Post
    Not sure why you expect better for $450?
    I got an AMD A10 quad core with 8gb and a 1TB hard drive for $499. It has integrated graphics roughly equivalent to the R7-250. It runs WOW on a mix of good/high settings with reasonable performance (30-40fps, 60 indoors). Keep in mind that AMD integrated graphics are almost 4x more powerful than Intel integrated graphics. With an Intel laptop you have to have a dedicated GPU to get any gaming performance and that is more expensive (though it also performs better). But in the $400-$500 price range, AMD is the only option if you want to run games at all.

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    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akaihiryuu View Post
    I got an AMD A10 quad core with 8gb and a 1TB hard drive for $499. It has integrated graphics roughly equivalent to the R7-250. It runs WOW on a mix of good/high settings with reasonable performance (30-40fps, 60 indoors). Keep in mind that AMD integrated graphics are almost 4x more powerful than Intel integrated graphics. With an Intel laptop you have to have a dedicated GPU to get any gaming performance and that is more expensive (though it also performs better). But in the $400-$500 price range, AMD is the only option if you want to run games at all.

    http://ark.intel.com/products/81074/...up-to-2_58-GHz

    That laptop also has a quad core.


    Would like to see the model you speak of, to price it.

  13. #13
    Immortal Stormspark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baar View Post
    http://ark.intel.com/products/81074/...up-to-2_58-GHz

    That laptop also has a quad core.


    Would like to see the model you speak of, to price it.
    http://smile.amazon.com/Lenovo-15-6-...=1&*entries*=0

    Price has gone up since I got mine...it was $499. They keep running out of stock and the price seems to go up every time. The Intel is a faster CPU, but the integrated graphics are TERRIBLE compared to the A10-7300 and will have to run at much lower settings as a result.

    I would've preferred to have an FX-7600P (over 2x more powerful than the 7300 GPU-wise), but I couldn't find a laptop with that in the time I had, sadly. I'm impressed with how well the 7300 performs in WOW though.

  14. #14
    Actually, some laptops run dual channel memory even with only one DIMM. I do not know how and why, but it's not stopping them.
     

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    Pit Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akaihiryuu View Post
    I got an AMD A10 quad core with 8gb and a 1TB hard drive for $499. It has integrated graphics roughly equivalent to the R7-250. It runs WOW on a mix of good/high settings with reasonable performance (30-40fps, 60 indoors). Keep in mind that AMD integrated graphics are almost 4x more powerful than Intel integrated graphics. With an Intel laptop you have to have a dedicated GPU to get any gaming performance and that is more expensive (though it also performs better). But in the $400-$500 price range, AMD is the only option if you want to run games at all.
    Willing to bet that CPU you have isn't even a true quad core. Probably 2 cores, 4 integers.

    EDIT: Just say your post of the laptop. yep I was right. It's just about as powerful a low voltage notebook i3 as well. Funny how marketing gets people.
    Last edited by Arbiter; 2014-09-22 at 07:44 PM.

  16. #16
    Fluffy Kitten Remilia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tetrisGOAT View Post
    Actually, some laptops run dual channel memory even with only one DIMM. I do not know how and why, but it's not stopping them.
    1st time hearing that but if it's there I call it magic.

  17. #17
    Immortal Stormspark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbiter View Post
    Willing to bet that CPU you have isn't even a true quad core. Probably 2 cores, 4 integers.

    EDIT: Just say your post of the laptop. yep I was right. It's just about as powerful a low voltage notebook i3 as well. Funny how marketing gets people.
    The graphics are FAR better than what you will get in an Intel notebook, unless you've got a dedicated GPU. And you probably aren't going to find a laptop with a dedicated GPU for that price. Yes, the Intel CPU's are better on the CPU front. But that means exactly jack if the integrated graphics can't handle the games. I did some shopping around before I got that one, the cheapest I could find with a dedicated GPU that would perform decently in games was around $900. Yes, the $900 one would've significantly outperformed the one I got, but I didn't want to spend $900 for a machine that is only used at most 2 days/week. The fact is, if I had gotten a laptop with an i3 w/hyperthreading in that price range, it would have Intel HD graphics, which would NOT run WOW on the settings I currently run on on the AMD.

    Kaveri/Steamroller is really an improvement over the earlier AMD generations. No, they aren't up there with Intel in IPC yet, but their integrated graphics are FAR FAR FAR better. No, I wouldn't recommend an AMD for any machine with a dedicated GPU. But if you are using the integrated graphics, it's a great deal. It was by far the best OVERALL (CPU AND graphics) performing laptop in my price range. At $600 it's probably not so good of a deal, and you could find something better with a dedicated GPU. But I didn't pay $600 for it, I paid $499 for it. And yes, I know that Intel is much better for high end/enthusiast level hardware. My home machine has a 4770k and a 780ti.
    Last edited by Stormspark; 2014-09-22 at 08:14 PM.

  18. #18
    Over 9000! ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesclaypool View Post
    I saw some adds from best buy and dell today "specials on laptops" I'm like ok let's see:
    That's your problem, right there. Seriously. Forget "nerds vs. average users". Forget the "Windows vs. Mac vs. Linux" Wars. Set aside all software and hardware partisanship. Dell and Best Buy suck, plain and simple.
    "In today’s America, conservatives who actually want to conserve are as rare as liberals who actually want to liberate. The once-significant language of an earlier era has had the meaning sucked right out of it, the better to serve as camouflage for a kleptocratic feeding frenzy in which both establishment parties participate with equal abandon" (Taking a break from the criminal, incompetent liars at the NSA, to bring you the above political observation, from The Archdruid Report.)

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    That's your problem, right there. Seriously. Forget "nerds vs. average users". Forget the "Windows vs. Mac vs. Linux" Wars. Set aside all software and hardware partisanship. Dell and Best Buy suck, plain and simple.
    I've had nothing but good experiences with Dell's Business Laptops.

  20. #20
    Fluffy Kitten Remilia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ringpriest View Post
    That's your problem, right there. Seriously. Forget "nerds vs. average users". Forget the "Windows vs. Mac vs. Linux" Wars. Set aside all software and hardware partisanship. Dell and Best Buy suck, plain and simple.
    Dell's monitor has been very good.
    Their Ultrabooks last I remember has also been very good.
    Prebuilt PC I don't know much about but probably meh.

    Best buy I don't know much about.

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