Enhancement 6.0 Thread

[Schmilblick]

Enhancement is still the crappiest melee in PvP, too bad for this nice class :/

[Nitwit]

According to the simcraft profile, hardcasting LB @ 4 and even 3 stacks is above LL and SS?

4 yes, but only ever so slightly - not enough to concern yourself over (like 5 dps difference having it in or out). The 3+ stack isn't a hardcast because it's used with Ancestral Swiftness (makes it instant) - condition is just there to ensure your instant LB is getting some moderate benefit from the improved maelstrom perk.

What we need is an actual finishing move rather than Lightning Bolt. Right now, we tickle our enemy until we just happen to proc enough MW stacks to hit Elemental's filler spell.

Enhancement's T17M profile LB DPE is ~31.3k compared to elemental's T17M LB DPE of ~20.5k (~52-53% stronger). They're not the same ability.

Also, your perception of how hard each ability hits relative to the others seems to be a bit outdated. Back in beta build 16689 when LB scaled with 114.404% SP and improved maelstrom weapon scaled up to +100% damage (i.e. 5-stack LB was ~73.3% stronger than it is currently), and Stormstrike hit for 192% weapon damage (23.2% weaker than current), lava lash hit for 312% weapon damage (22% weaker than current), and frost shock hit for 36.594% sp (~52.5% weaker than current), that was a more appropriate description of things, but nowadays we're mostly back to MoP enhancement where suboptimal priorities aren't very detrimental in comparison to optimal ones, and hardcasting lightning bolt is only a modest (~2-3% perhaps) dps gain over just ignoring it and chucking them out at 5 stacks.

A lot of these complaints about how much "emphasis" was placed on hardcasting lightning bolt are kind of amusing because of that fact. Yeah, it's slightly more of a deal than it was in WoD, but it's still not terribly important. Used to be, but not anymore.

[Hekili]

Enhancement's T17M profile LB DPE is ~31.3k compared to elemental's T17M LB DPE of ~20.5k (~52-53% stronger). They're not the same ability.

It's the same spell, used to different effect. Yes, it hits harder (esp. with the MW perk).

That doesn't make it look or feel any better that we use our iconic specialization abilities to simply build up and cast something that Elemental is spamming. It's a matter of personal preference. I'd rather have a real, unique finisher than Elemental's filler.

As an aside, one could've argued that Elemental has the same issue, with LB generating LS stacks to cast Earth Shock, but there's no overlap with Enhancement since Enhancement doesn't have Earth Shock anymore.

[nazrakin]

4 yes, but only ever so slightly - not enough to concern yourself over (like 5 dps difference having it in or out). The 3+ stack isn't a hardcast because it's used with Ancestral Swiftness (makes it instant) - condition is just there to ensure your instant LB is getting some moderate benefit from the improved maelstrom perk.

Ah, I see. I was wondering what that AS conditional was about, I didnt know LB still benefited from the perk. If its that minuscule a difference then I'm fine with the current design.

- - - Updated - - -

It's the same spell, used to different effect. Yes, it hits harder (esp. with the MW perk).

That doesn't make it look or feel any better that we use our iconic specialization abilities to simply build up and cast something that Elemental is spamming. It's a matter of personal preference. I'd rather have a real, unique finisher than Elemental's filler.

As an aside, one could've argued that Elemental has the same issue, with LB generating LS stacks to cast Earth Shock, but there's no overlap with Enhancement since Enhancement doesn't have Earth Shock anymore.

I do agree with this. Strictly from a cosmetic perspective, I think it would be nice for MSW to built up to something more class defining for Enhancement, which is what they've done with a lot of other classes.

[Ald]

Hell yes, replace it with Stormblast!

Or even a buffed up Stormstrike. Why on earth we're forced to use a casted filler spell from another spec as our finisher is beyond me. Yes, yes it's instant but that not the point. Give me some thunder based melee attack for my maces so i can be Thor damn it!

[wordup]

Well it's not looking good with the buffs to all these other classes despite us still being propped up barely by PE/EM as of right now, 100 might be rocky at best for us sadly without the big gear to beef us up.

[Aesthetics]

Well, an AE cap and no buffs to single target. Interesting.

Enhancement

Fire Nova now has a maximum of 7 novas that can be triggered if more than 7 targets are affected by Flame Shock.
Maelstrom Weapon should no longer incorrectly persist after the Shaman has switched to a different specialization.

[wordup]

Well, and AE cap and no buffs to single target. Interesting.

Enhancement

There goes what little niche we had, sad day.

Definitely crunch time to get feedback from devs because all the information I have and others have provided is looking dreadfully grim, and all I ever see on twitter feeds is complaints from other classes about relatively minor things, whilst we are getting dangerously close to the old "too bad to justify a serious raid spot" days.

[Aesthetics]

There goes what little niche we had, sad day.

Definitely crunch time to get feedback from devs because all the information I have and others have provided is looking dreadfully grim, and all I ever see on twitter feeds is complaints from other classes about relatively minor things, whilst we are getting dangerously close to the old "too bad to justify a serious raid spot" days.

I'm pretty anxious to see if they roll out ANYTHING for enh prior to WoD's launch, that's an actual buff.

[Deleted]

There goes what little niche we had, sad day.

Definitely crunch time to get feedback from devs because all the information I have and others have provided is looking dreadfully grim, and all I ever see on twitter feeds is complaints from other classes about relatively minor things, whilst we are getting dangerously close to the old "too bad to justify a serious raid spot" days.

I didn't want that niche. That cap actually fixes fire nova in a lot of situations, numbers were like crazy on big pulls. I could easily pull out 10 times as much damage as everyone else on big aoe pulls. The alternative would've been to nerf fikre nova damage to its crappy state where it deals no damage in most aoe situations. Now we have solid numbers at lower number targets and still good numbers at 7 targets.

Letting fire nova scale up to 7 was a nice fix.

Any1 here knowing how to play a monk/feral/rogue/warrior and has a beta account?
I'd like to do some premade gear level (+set bonus) testing, log that data and provide it via twitter to Rygarius and co. They won't believe we have that shitty single target dps until we provide data. They don't accept simulations.

[Jimmyx]

Now, since enhancement is the weakest single target melee dps on 100 and we also lost our aoe niche I have no clue wat's the point in playin' this spec in Wod

[Deleted]

Now, since enhancement is the weakest single target melee dps on 100 and we also lost our aoe niche I have no clue wat's the point in playin' this spec in Wod

Well i believe we have to prove them how bad enhancers are on sustained dps. That's why i'd like to give them that data. Beta ends on monday, so we have only 3 days time to provide lvl 100 data before raid content.

[Jimmyx]

Well i believe we have to prove them how bad enhancers are on sustained dps. That's why i'd like to give them that data. Beta ends on monday, so we have only 3 days time to provide lvl 100 data before raid content.

Blizzard will realise that and buff enha a few weeks after WoD launch... after we lose our raidspots or reroll to another class I'm absolutely sure about it.

[DrakeWurrum]

Blizzard will realise that and buff enha a few weeks after WoD launch... after we lose our raidspots or reroll to another class I'm absolutely sure about it.

No. They always wait a tier at least to fix issues with Enhancemenet. 'swhat happened back in Cata for the first tier. We just have to deal with the being the underdog class all over again.

[Deleted]

No. They always wait a tier at least to fix issues with Enhancemenet. 'swhat happened back in Cata for the first tier. We just have to deal with the being the underdog class all over again.

Elemental was that bad, but enhancers started pretty solid in 5.0 and 5.1.

Gamebreaking was 5.2 where they, for some reason, nerfed and nerfed and nerfed enhancers, so they were the worst dd ingame. I still have no clue about this.

Was the same in 5.4, where they nerfed enhancers althoguh they were hit very very hard by that RPPM nerf.

I mean, i know why they do that kind of stuff. They don't test enhancers, they take data of very short fights, where fire elemental makes us look a lot stronger than we really are. Fire elementals makes us look strong - for 1 minute. After that, it's simply gone and we drop and drop and drop, just like now. On Juggernaut, i was 3rd after 1 minute and 10th after 2min on testing. If it was 3 min, i would've been 13 and if it would've been 5 minutes, i would've been last place for sure.

But as long as enhancers shine on short wipes and short fights, we get nerfs that aren't justified at all.

And you know - it sucks!!!!!!!!!

[Jimmyx]

Elemental was that bad, but enhancers started pretty solid in 5.0 and 5.1.

(...)

And you know - it sucks!!!!!!!!!

Amen! You told exacly what I think

[Jelz]

At this point we should Hope for an spec or class overhaul.
Since it did not happen during beta (most probably because of lack of time, they already told that they were short on time on a lot of things).

It could happen at some point during the Xpac. The fact is: If we were to be shitty for 1 or 2 tier, who will suffer to be the underdog of all dps spec meaningwhile.
Not me I can't, a class must provide 3 things : gameplay enjoyment - "Theme" attraction - and finally be competitive.

I'm still torn between maining or not my enhancement for WoD. But dunno what to play if not.

[Satori]

Fire Nova "nerf" is irrelevant outside of trash pulls

[wordup]

I didn't want that niche. That cap actually fixes fire nova in a lot of situations, numbers were like crazy on big pulls. I could easily pull out 10 times as much damage as everyone else on big aoe pulls. The alternative would've been to nerf fikre nova damage to its crappy state where it deals no damage in most aoe situations. Now we have solid numbers at lower number targets and still good numbers at 7 targets.

Letting fire nova scale up to 7 was a nice fix.

Any1 here knowing how to play a monk/feral/rogue/warrior and has a beta account?
I'd like to do some premade gear level (+set bonus) testing, log that data and provide it via twitter to Rygarius and co. They won't believe we have that shitty single target dps until we provide data. They don't accept simulations.

Regardless of whether you wanted the niche or not (I personally did not in any way), it was still a niche and a role in which we shined far and above others, even if it was very difficult to abuse; and it also shows they are very closely watching our AoE whilst ignoring our frankly shocking single target.

The issue is far more that we really, really are doing quite poorly relative to the 4 other classes you mentioned in terms of raw single target, and in some cases (not all, but some) our cleave is worse. Now our utility is reigned in I can't actually find a solid reason not to play Feral or WW other than my personal love for Enhancement after all these years, and that is the very first time I have been at this point since I started playing it.

[Raiju]

I am not happy yet, but there's the possibility for blizzard (for once) to show they are actually paying attention to us now and exchange this aoe cap for some more respectable single target. Our aoe is still going to be strong, although any skill cap involved has been demolished come wod with the 6 target spread. Other AoE specs will be able to keep up with us too

I echo what others have been saying, with the LB's emphasis in our rotation it's time enhancement got its own ability to use as its finisher. I didn't mind when LB while being a comparable portion of our damage to our melee spells - was still just a sort of "filler", but in WoD as soon as you get that perk, LB becomes the thing you use to kill things while levelling. It's what is going to feel like the big hit in raids, etc. I know lightning lash is a popular suggestion but I feel like that would not help our aoe dependability right now.

The cap, IF WE GET COMPENSATED, is a good thing. I am holding out but at this point I will likely be rerolling to DK - something I'd decided only over the past couple weeks. Enhancements single target being more respectable could easily sway that back.