A discussion about Skyrim's Civil War and who to pick.

[pateuvasiliu]

Stormcloaks against Imperials.

Who is right, who is wrong?

Who is the lesser evil?

Personally, I support Ulfric. Although he is supposedly racist ( he only treats argonians and dark elves like shit because they refuse to join the war effort and are eating away at his resources, so I can stand by that ) and wants to lead Skyrim with an Iron Fist, I think he has higher odds of keeping Skyrim stable than the Empire.

The thing with an independent Skyrim is that they can defend their lands. They are used to the cold and the beasts that roam the land whereas the Thalmor are not. I truly think the Nords could hold Skyrim for a long time against the Thalmor to the point where the elves would be unable to conquer it, since they'd be far from home and their supply lines.

Also worth noting that the Thalmor only have bases in skyrim because the Empire allowed them to and protects them due to fear of war starting again ( which the Thalmor want ). Doubt they'd be able to get a foothold in Skyrim without the Empire's protection.

On the other hand, an Empire controlled Skyrim would mean Nords sent to fight on foreign lands, where they lose their ability of resisting extremely low temperatures. Although the Empire is clearly stronger than Skyrim, I feel Skyrim has better chances of survival if it defends its own lands instead of committing troops to an Empire that has abandoned its provinces before, when it suited them.

[Darksoldierr]

I picked the Imperials, i see no reason of the revolution other than we dislike people who aren't nords.

[pateuvasiliu]

I picked the Imperials, i see no reason of the revolution other than we dislike people who aren't nords.

Well, during the Great War Skyrim was emptied of its warriors so they can fight in Cyrodiil, which left Skyrim weak and allowed the Forsworn to take Markarth, no?

Skyrim's troops have higher odds of defending their mountain passes than fighting on the green plains of Cyrodiil where their advantage is nullified.

[Paula Deen]

Ulfric has the right intentions but he is not thinking about the big picture, which is the problem. The Empire is protecting Skyrim from the Dominion, and the second the Stormcloaks win, the second Skyrim becomes Dominion turf. It is actually why I chose the Imperials, and still do to this day.

[Cerilis]

It's every time a hard choice. On one hand, I support Skyrim's independence based on the reasons you already stated and the freedom to worship Talos, but... Ulfric is quite the jerk, being racist and all. I think the High King could have been persuaded to support independence and didn't need to be killed.

On the other hand, I also don't like the empires elf-licking attitude. I'd wish there would be something outstanding in terms of what they really think of the Thalmor. Or someone explicitly stating that you helping the imperials also helps the cause of freeing the empire of the Thalmor or something.
Also, those guys tried to chop your head of in the beginning.

There should be a third choice: Jarl Balgruuf for High King! I like him. :P

[timberx]

The Imperials want Skyrim for its resources and men. Although he publicly boasts otherwise, Ulfric only cares about Ulfric. Both sides are detestable.

[Rixis]

There's a Skyrim Megathread still on the front page of this sub forum: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ussion/page440

[Verdugo]

On the other hand, I also don't like the empires elf-licking attitude.

They are licking their own wounds more than elf asses. Combating them in current state would end the Imperium.

[Faldric]

The ones who didnt want to execute me for no reason at all.

[Ratyrel]

The ones who didnt want to execute me for no reason at all.

While this is definitely a factor, both choices the game allows, suck. I agree one should be able to choose e.g. Balgruuf, who was actually a level-headed politician.

[Easo]

Neutral path - truce to combat dragons.
Though logically, if Nords win, Dominion WILL take over Skyrim. Guess what, Ulfric, you are not realy thinking ahead.

[Mehrunes]

It's clear the Imperium detests the Thalmor and is preparing for the next war, even though they allowed their embassy. Meanwhile, Ulfric thinks he is a valuable Thalmor agent who gave them crucial intel during the war between Empire and the Dominium. He also has killed a good High King for personal gain and thrown Skyrim into war, with a really shitty timing. So much love for Nords there. Plus, he's a racist twerp towards Argonians, Dunmer (although in their case, serves them right for their treatment of Argonians), Khajiit and to lesser extend any non-Nord.

And if you're into OOG lore by MK, it doesn't matter if Nords would be able to hold Skyrim on their own (which is debatable). It weakens their primary enemy - the Empire - which would make it possible for them to achieve their goal of destroying the Towers. Which unmakes the creation (so that Elves can be pretty, pretty princesses Aedra again). Not exactly a fantastic outcome for Nords.

[Vankrys]

i am not picking the side who tried to execute me by decapitation. had alduin arrived 10 seconds later, there would be no more dragonborn (if only he knew ).

[Noorri]

I wouldn't pick a side if it hadn't been for my completionist nature. Since I "have" to pick I side with the Empire simply because of how Whiterun is treated by the different sides.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

While initially the Stormcloaks appear to be "the good guys", deeper inspection would reveal they aren't quite that. Ulfric is driven by pride, not goodwill. He's biased against the non Nordic peoples of Skyrim, even refusing to send desperate aid to Khajit caravans that were being raided within his borders will yet sending support to his Nordic kindred. The "outsiders" of Skyrim are treated as second class citizens within his realm. More importantly, he's breaking apart the Empire. The true enemy isn't the Empire, but the Dominion.

Tulius' hands are tied; everyone hates the Dominion, and he's among them. What Ulfric is doing is weakening everybody else when they all need each true to ultimately overthrow the elves. Tulius, also, doesn't pick-and-choose who's he going to help. Unlike Ulfric.

[pateuvasiliu]

Ulfric has the right intentions but he is not thinking about the big picture, which is the problem. The Empire is protecting Skyrim from the Dominion, and the second the Stormcloaks win, the second Skyrim becomes Dominion turf. It is actually why I chose the Imperials, and still do to this day.

The Dominion would have to first pass through Cyrodiil to get to Skyrim and they'd have to enter it by foot, through the mountains.

That ain't happening.

If they come by ship they will have no friendly harbor in half the continent. The Redguards hate them, the Bretons hate them. They can't invade Skyrim by ship and coming through the mountains means fighting Nords in their best environment.

- - - Updated - - -

There's a Skyrim Megathread still on the front page of this sub forum: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ussion/page440

This is a big discussion unfit for a megathread.

[carnifex2005]

Imperials because I can't side with a bunch of racist hillbillies.

[pateuvasiliu]

Imperials because I can't side with a bunch of racist hillbillies.

They aren't racist. The Argonians and Dark Elves are hobos/refugees from their homeland and they refuse to help Ulfric. Ulfric hates them because they don't pull their weight. They just happen to be Dark Elves and Argonians.

What's he supposed to do? Give them free food and shelter while he's having a war?

I wouldn't even allow them near Windhelm if it was I leading the Stormcloaks. I'm trying to run a civil war and if you don't help you can go freeze.

[GennGreymane]

Stormcloaks. Let Skyrim run Skyrim, since well... look at what the empire did to Hammerfell!

Also look at what Hammerfell did to the Elves! You mean to tell me the Empire gave up that easily?

[Val the Moofia Boss]

They aren't racist. The Argonians and Dark Elves are hobos/refugees from their homeland and they refuse to help Ulfric. Ulfric hates them because they don't pull their weight. They just happen to be Dark Elves and Argonians.

What's he supposed to do? Give them free food and shelter while he's having a war?

I wouldn't even allow them near Windhelm if it was I leading the Stormcloaks. I'm trying to run a civil war and if you don't help you can go freeze.

Did you know, that there was a Khajit caravan if some thirty or so traders (forgot the exact number, it's mentioned in a quest) that was attacked by High Elves, deep within Ulfric's territory, and what did he do? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Then, a couple of Nords - two - were assualted along the border at the extreme edge of Eastmarch. What did he do? He sent an entire battalion to travel several dozen miles on account of two nords.

Says alot, doesn't it?