Blizzard have saved elemental yet again

[Deleted]

Tiny buff, remember that shamanism only increases the base damage of the spell to begin with, so it's not a flat 34% buff.

Meanwile at DK's.

Meanwhile at Priests



Well, at least warriors were nerfed, that always makes me happy.

Scourge Strike was like 5% of their damage breakdown if that. You also omitted the 5% reduction in strenght, why would you do that? It's a tiny increase in ST DPS overall if any, and likely a nerf in AoE.

Guess Shamans whine about buffs as well.

[mrinvisable2]

I'd just like to point out to all the people complaining that Blizzard 'just buff Shamanism', that this is the entire point Shamanism is in the game. It's a dial they can fiddle with that will only effect Elemental and not have any unintended results on Enhancement Shaman or Resto Shaman. No point going 'Lightning bolt does 30% more damage for Elemental Shaman' and having to manage that 'unique dial' too, when you already one in the form of Shamanism. I don't really see why people think that is bad.



Indeed, this is vitally important in understanding why those changes happened. It shifts around Unholy's damage sources. But hay, the sky is falling and everyone needs to abandon the Shaman Ship because Blizzard hates us and wants us all to quit so they can finally get what they always wanted and delete the Shaman class

/s Am I doing this right?

*sigh*...

Well buff to shamanism is a joke now as almost in every patch it is bufed since wotlik. Problem with that is it has goten to point when it could be better than lvb and aost was in cata i think. But why cant buff lavaburst it does nothing compared to wotlik when it took 1/3 ore more of hp with cast. I am not dwmanding that but as we got new mastery and it could be time to buf lvb to more noticable

[Mordog]

Guess Shamans whine about buffs as well.

We are used to!

I am glad Blizz is Buffing us at least somehow.

But buffing LB seems wired.
A buff to Lavaburst would have been more logic...

[miffy23]

Lol the hysteria here is so amusing.
It almost feels like most high end raiding guilds are run by immature nolifers that bench their players based on class changes and Simcraft results, am I - oh.
Meanwhile, the more casual and mature raids are having fun on the classes they enjoy and clearing the same content ~~

I really don't see the issue, these are TUNING PASSES, take it in stride, jesus.

[Deleted]

A buff to Lava Burst is compounded by Ascendance. I'm pretty sure at this point the reason they don't buff Lava Burst is they are terrifying of breaking us in PvP. It would be very easy to turn the glass cannon we are now into a glass nuke.

I'm not entirely sure this would actually end up being the case, but I just think that Blizzard are erring on the side of caution to prevent us becoming RNG-Oneshotters from nowhere (Master procs, Flame Shock Ticks, Searing Totem hit, bunch of Lava Bursts in flight from Lava Surge spam and Multistrike procs (which can proc 2 extra hits remember) followed by an instant hit 20 stack Earth Shock. That kind of RNG damage output requires no cooldowns to signify it is coming to the enemy, and is pretty much uncounterable because it can all occur in the span on 3 GCDs. Ascendance just makes the likelihood of this kind of damage spike to happen much higher.

Lol the hysteria here is so amusing.

See, I do understand people being upset with the state of Elemental Shaman currently. Lots of people (including myself) get a major portion of their enjoyment from Raiding come through measuring their performance. Its much easier to measure your performance against your fellow raiders than against others of your own spec on a log site or something. I totally understand that point of view. I do take issue with people screaming from the heavens that Blizzard is screwing them over and making them lose their raid spot because they aren't number 1 though.

If you choose to raid in an environment where your performance is so closely monitored that you are dropped for someone sat in the wings if you don't keep up, then you should strive to make those improvements however you can, including - but not limited too - rerolling.

[Mordog]

A buff to Lava Burst is compounded by Ascendance. I'm pretty sure at this point the reason they don't buff Lava Burst is they are terrifying of breaking us in PvP..

I hate it when PvP "balance" effect my loved PvE....

[Deleted]

I hate it when PvP "balance" effect my loved PvE....

I do tend to agree, I also much prefer PvE to PvP, but there are many who feel the exact opposite and Blizzard has to cater for both.

[miffy23]

A buff to Lava Burst is compounded by Ascendance. I'm pretty sure at this point the reason they don't buff Lava Burst is they are terrifying of breaking us in PvP. It would be very easy to turn the glass cannon we are now into a glass nuke.

I'm not entirely sure this would actually end up being the case, but I just think that Blizzard are erring on the side of caution to prevent us becoming RNG-Oneshotters from nowhere (Master procs, Flame Shock Ticks, Searing Totem hit, bunch of Lava Bursts in flight from Lava Surge spam and Multistrike procs (which can proc 2 extra hits remember) followed by an instant hit 20 stack Earth Shock. That kind of RNG damage output requires no cooldowns to signify it is coming to the enemy, and is pretty much uncounterable because it can all occur in the span on 3 GCDs. Ascendance just makes the likelihood of this kind of damage spike to happen much higher.



See, I do understand people being upset with the state of Elemental Shaman currently. Lots of people (including myself) get a major portion of their enjoyment from Raiding come through measuring their performance. Its much easier to measure your performance against your fellow raiders than against others of your own spec on a log site or something. I totally understand that point of view. I do take issue with people screaming from the heavens that Blizzard is screwing them over and making them lose their raid spot because they aren't number 1 though.

If you choose to raid in an environment where your performance is so closely monitored that you are dropped for someone sat in the wings if you don't keep up, then you should strive to make those improvements however you can, including - but not limited too - rerolling.

I just feel that this environment fosters this atmosphere, where tiniest changes that the majority barely feels cause massive drama in this tiny little bubble. We know that the game is impossible to balance 100% satisfactorily for everyone, it never has been (much more so in PvP, but still).

I also find it shocking that in 2014 people STILL whine with the "i know they don't care about my class" crap.

[Deleted]

A buff to Lava Burst is compounded by Ascendance. I'm pretty sure at this point the reason they don't buff Lava Burst is they are terrifying of breaking us in PvP. It would be very easy to turn the glass cannon we are now into a glass nuke.

I'm not entirely sure this would actually end up being the case, but I just think that Blizzard are erring on the side of caution to prevent us becoming RNG-Oneshotters from nowhere (Master procs, Flame Shock Ticks, Searing Totem hit, bunch of Lava Bursts in flight from Lava Surge spam and Multistrike procs (which can proc 2 extra hits remember) followed by an instant hit 20 stack Earth Shock. That kind of RNG damage output requires no cooldowns to signify it is coming to the enemy, and is pretty much uncounterable because it can all occur in the span on 3 GCDs. Ascendance just makes the likelihood of this kind of damage spike to happen much higher.

Honestly, Elemental would still be awful if it had increased Lava Burst damage. They have no survivability, no way to get people off of them and almost non-existent CC. What on earth should a Shaman do on live or at 100 if a Warrior charges him? Seriously, I want to know how this Shaman can easily kill this Warrior. And don't say that you can one-shot people as a Shaman. Lava Burst hits for 20k on people with 300k health pools at 100, and mastery damage falls off hard. Actually look at numbers before saying that Ele will be big one-shotty monsters if they get a bit more damage on their core ability and main damage CD. If the stars align and you get a Lava Burst with 2 multistrikes, followed by a Lava Surge with another 2 multistrikes, multiple mastery crits and a 20 stack Earth Shock/Fulmination Crit, you might do about half the hp of a guy? Ferals can do that much while you're stunned. You've constructed some sort of bizzare hybrid where we have 5.3 Lava Burst damage and live Mastery Damage, when both of them are nowhere near that strong at level 100

So yeah, back to the warrior. You could Thunderstorm him, but he could have another charge, as well as a million other gap-closers. A feral can just sit on you and make you bleed to death. Having no mobility is a death sentence in PvP, and they know this. Why do you think the original Shaman Ashran item was a buff to Reincarnation?

I'd just like to point out to all the people complaining that Blizzard 'just buff Shamanism', that this is the entire point Shamanism is in the game. It's a dial they can fiddle with that will only effect Elemental and not have any unintended results on Enhancement Shaman or Resto Shaman. No point going 'Lightning bolt does 30% more damage for Elemental Shaman' and having to manage that 'unique dial' too, when you already one in the form of Shamanism. I don't really see why people think that is bad.

Four things. First, this "buff" was them reverting a stealth nerf in the last patch. Secondly, if they have to use this "unique dial" any more, there is a very real chance that Lightning Bolt will outdamage Lava Burst. Thirdly, why not give it to enhancement? They're in a crappy enough situation as it is, being the least mobile melee because they have to hardcast a Lightning Bolt. Since there is no way Blizz is going to redo any of the god awful mechanics this close to xpac release date, why not give them a little extra damage?
Finally, I'm mad because Elemental (And enhancement and resto, I guess) have so many problems that make them a chore to play, and the answer to these glaring flaws isn't a review of the class. It isn't a look to see why the community is annoyed. No, it's the thing they've done since WotLK. It's the laziest possible change. "Elemental Shamans in a poor spot? Roll 2d20, increase Shamanism by that amount and call it a day".

[mrinvisable2]

A buff to Lava Burst is compounded by Ascendance. I'm pretty sure at this point the reason they don't buff Lava Burst is they are terrifying of breaking us in PvP. It would be very easy to turn the glass cannon we are now into a glass nuke.

I'm not entirely sure this would actually end up being the case, but I just think that Blizzard are erring on the side of caution to prevent us becoming RNG-Oneshotters from nowhere (Master procs, Flame Shock Ticks, Searing Totem hit, bunch of Lava Bursts in flight from Lava Surge spam and Multistrike procs (which can proc 2 extra hits remember) followed by an instant hit 20 stack Earth Shock. That kind of RNG damage output requires no cooldowns to signify it is coming to the enemy, and is pretty much uncounterable because it can all occur in the span on 3 GCDs. Ascendance just makes the likelihood of this kind of damage spike to happen much higher.

Problem is that lava burst does so low dmg that full ascendance cant do anything to player who is standing still not to mentione silencing or stunning or polymorphing fearing and bye ascendance, or pvp bonus was that during ascendance we are imune to silences or interupts cant remember.
but still after ToT or during ToT lavaburst was nerfed so hard and with squish and even more nerfs now its just pointles and we could go back to pre lavaburst just spaming LB, atleast LvB was short ter cast time, they increased its cast time to fix haste capping but with reforge gone that shouldnt be a problem as we will get worst itemisation of raid gear i predict.
And Ascendance as CD isnt that impresive anymore with mastery change, lvb nerfs, castime increase, destroyed echo of elements, but it atleast isnt as bad as Enha ascendance who is just almost not even worth to pres and save maybe for some movement.

[miffy23]

Honestly, Elemental would still be awful if it had increased Lava Burst damage. They have no survivability, no way to get people off of them and almost non-existent CC. What on earth should a Shaman do on live or at 100 if a Warrior charges him? Seriously, I want to know how this Shaman can easily kill this Warrior. And don't say that you can one-shot people as a Shaman. Lava Burst hits for 20k on people with 300k health pools at 100, and mastery damage falls off hard. Actually look at numbers before saying that Ele will be big one-shotty monsters if they get a bit more damage on their core ability and main damage CD. If the stars align and you get a Lava Burst with 2 multistrikes, followed by a Lava Surge with another 2 multistrikes, multiple mastery crits and a 20 stack Earth Shock/Fulmination Crit, you might do about half the hp of a guy? Ferals can do that much while you're stunned. You've constructed some sort of bizzare hybrid where we have 5.3 Lava Burst damage and live Mastery Damage, when both of them are nowhere near that strong at level 100

So yeah, back to the warrior. You could Thunderstorm him, but he could have another charge, as well as a million other gap-closers. A feral can just sit on you and make you bleed to death. Having no mobility is a death sentence in PvP, and they know this. Why do you think the original Shaman Ashran item was a buff to Reincarnation?




Four things. First, this "buff" was them reverting a stealth nerf in the last patch. Secondly, if they have to use this "unique dial" any more, there is a very real chance that Lightning Bolt will outdamage Lava Burst. Thirdly, why not give it to enhancement? They're in a crappy enough situation as it is, being the least mobile melee because they have to hardcast a Lightning Bolt. Since there is no way Blizz is going to redo any of the god awful mechanics this close to xpac release date, why not give them a little extra damage?
Finally, I'm mad because Elemental (And enhancement and resto, I guess) have so many problems that make them a chore to play, and the answer to these glaring flaws isn't a review of the class. It isn't a look to see why the community is annoyed. No, it's the thing they've done since WotLK. It's the laziest possible change. "Elemental Shamans in a poor spot? Roll 2d20, increase Shamanism by that amount and call it a day".

Your issue is that you're expecting perfect PvP balance to be goal, when PVE balance tuning is the priority, and PvP is looked at thereafter, and on a much softer level (as in: tune down the more OP ones has priority).

Newsflash: this system has always been, and will always be, an utter nightmare, if not completely impossible to balance properly in PvP. ESPECIALLY with the changes they throw into the class system every other major patch.

It's not so much a lazy change, as it is the moft efficient way for them to slightly tune without messing up even more in the grander scheme of things.

I'm finding it hard to believe that after 10 years people still get upset at these things, it's in the nature of the flawed system to begin with, and it's never going away.

[Deleted]

Your issue is that you're expecting perfect PvP balance to be goal, when PVE balance tuning is the priority, and PvP is looked at thereafter, and on a much softer level (as in: tune down the more OP ones has priority).

But perfect PvP balance is a goal. PvE balance can be brought by literally just having 1 spell do all the damage (is that fun? no, but that != balance). Buffing Lightning Bolt helps PvE performance without massively impacting PvP like a 20% increase to Lava Burst (a chance that wouldn't be too far off from 30% increase to Lightning Bolt looking at your damage breakdown) would do.

[Frolk]

This is why we cant have anything nice, ppl FUCKING BITCH andWHINE when u get BUFFS. Would it be better to NOT get buffs?

[Deleted]

So they have made steps to make elemental a bit more useful. Nice of them to leave enhance below the piles of turds in the floor

[Emophia]

Soo... How much harder will LB crit compared to LvB now?

[Triggered Fridgekin]

Everyone is talking about LB but what about that buff to EB? Is it enough to bring it up from being a 'meh' spell or has it already made that ascension in a past hotfix?

EB is probably my favorite talent of that tier simply for the fact that it gives me another button to push on a regular basis and play chance on the buff it gives so I was kind of sad panda when I used to hear it sucked in beta.

[Zeerus]

As bad as we are, I will never abandon my shaman. I've been a shaman since day one, elemental since TBC, and I don't ever plan on leaving him. Hell, at least we aren't hunters...

[Deleted]

Your issue is that you're expecting perfect PvP balance to be goal, when PVE balance tuning is the priority, and PvP is looked at thereafter, and on a much softer level (as in: tune down the more OP ones has priority).

Newsflash: this system has always been, and will always be, an utter nightmare, if not completely impossible to balance properly in PvP. ESPECIALLY with the changes they throw into the class system every other major patch.

It's not so much a lazy change, as it is the moft efficient way for them to slightly tune without messing up even more in the grander scheme of things.

I'm finding it hard to believe that after 10 years people still get upset at these things, it's in the nature of the flawed system to begin with, and it's never going away.

And I find to hard to believe that you play Shaman with what you're saying. Ele has a plethora of problems at the moment, and these are relevant for both PvE and PvP.

Lack of mobility, low utility and low damage affect both and can be felt by everyone that plays the class. T17 is a movement heavy tier, and movement is central in PvP. Utility is a core factor in composing a raid and is also a requirement in PvP. And the damage is low for both. Mastery does nothing at 100, Lava Burst doesn't hit hard at all, Lightning Bolt has a long-ass cast time but you have to be standing still to use it, LB hits about as hard as LvB, so using your DPS cooldown isn't much of an increase... All of these effect both PvE and PvP.

The problem is that they are tuning Shamans instead of recognizing that they fucked up in a ton of aspects. Extra damage on Lightning Bolt isn't going to make Ele not shit at DPS. Things that would make them better in both PvP and PvE are the same changes, and they can be implemented without making the spec OP, because it's shit at 100 currently.

[Darksoldierr]

I honestly tought the +20% EB damage was for enhance, as of now EB hit nothing compared to how it was.

[Blithe]

Blizzard has no idea what they're doing with this class regardless of whether it's an improvement or reduction. You could give the reins to some random player in this class section and they'd still do a better job at class design than them, it's beyond retarded at how bad they are at this. We've been apart of this game for almost 10 years and we still feel as if we're an unfinished project.