[Prot] WoD/Legion Alpha Discussion

[trystero]

Was I missing something there or did he really not upgrade KB and use it on progress?

[sexybeast]

Was I missing something there or did he really not upgrade KB and use it on progress?

One of the things that's been said yes. However it did seem like a scape goat if you ask me. He mentioned 3 tanking it during progress (impregnator) and was shot down by the others. But they felt the need to kick people even though what killed them in the end was tacts.

[celinamuna]

Yay drama.

P.S. At guilds that level, can they also not afford to purchase upgrades for their tanks ?

[Kazuchika]

Yeah, but who's going to spend over 100k gold on upgrading KB to 3/3 just to make it a side-grade option?

100k? Bloods have already plummeted to 1k gold here. Buying the upgrade pieces outright is absolutely stupid.

[Sarenas]

Oh well, just look at his armory: eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/twisting-nether/Treckie/advanced
KB is not upgraded.

On a side note: Seems like Method forgot that Treckie was king in SoO, and one of the main reasons they got WF Garrosh.

</end drama>

[Kazuchika]

On a side note: Seems like Method forgot that Treckie was king in SoO, and one of the main reasons they got WF Garrosh.

I'm not sure what that has to do with him not being completely prepared for progression but okay.

[celinamuna]

I'm not sure what that has to do with him not being completely prepared for progression but okay.

If guild did not believe that that was enough preparation i'm sure they could've purchased upgrade kits for him, no ?

I'm sure someone would notice this before paragon got world first.

[TwentyTwelve]

If guild did not believe that that was enough preparation i'm sure they could've purchased upgrade kits for him, no ?

I'm sure someone would notice this before paragon got world first.

I'm not really up to date with the whole method drama and tbh dont want to be - but i would say it was more than just his prep in items - Treckies always played the safe routine of being the best meat shield and whilst it works as after all, he is a tank... prot pallys just have way too much potential in terms of their ability to do a crap ton of damage i.m.o and Method finally caught up to it.

Was the same in the previous raids.

[sexybeast]

I'm not really up to date with the whole method drama and tbh dont want to be - but i would say it was more than just his prep in items - Treckies always played the safe routine of being the best meat shield and whilst it works as after all, he is a tank... prot pallys just have way too much potential in terms of their ability to do a crap ton of damage i.m.o and Method finally caught up to it.

Was the same in the previous raids.

He topped the meters in the WF garrosh kill... And many other fights in MoP.

[Sarenas]

To not put more wood into the fire, I dont think it was the playing that got him kicked. I sense that it has to do with attitude / other stuff.

[celinamuna]

I'm not really up to date with the whole method drama and tbh dont want to be - but i would say it was more than just his prep in items - Treckies always played the safe routine of being the best meat shield and whilst it works as after all, he is a tank... prot pallys just have way too much potential in terms of their ability to do a crap ton of damage i.m.o and Method finally caught up to it.

Was the same in the previous raids.

Tbh i think it's the same trend in all "TOP" guilds. From the side view he's still above absalom, and to the same degree, both him and sloot are below some of the forum regulars (be it lazel, or jello, or even me in SoO)

[Jaydenkor]

Made a thing about the effects of Seraphim. Thought I'd cross post here.

This is from a 640 paladin.

TLDR at bottom third.:

Seraphim
+1000 to all stats, and bonus armor (as prot)

Effects:

AP (From the Mastery and BA increase)
- Currently increases AP by ~26%. This is from the effectively +1000 strength, and then the +9% AP from the mastery increase.
- This boosts the current max hit of WOG by ~50% (from 17.5 to 25.5k base 3 holypower, no resolve, no bastion stacks)
- And obviously, this boosts dmg. Unclear by what exact %.

Due to paladins getting +5% haste, it gives me 1050 Haste rating.
Haste - ~11% faster holypower gain and active mitigation use.

Crit - ~9% more crit (a 9% increase in dmg, and healing/absorb outputs.)

Parry - ~6% more parry, eg 6% less melee dmg taken.

Mastery - ~9% more mastery, This has several effects
- 4.5% less physical damage taken during SOTR (activive mitigation)
- ~7% more (Bastion is currently around 20%, so 27%) healing towards WOG (stacks 5 times max)
- ~9% more block = -3.5% less dmg taken from enemy melees.

Multistrike - ~15% more multistrike - a 4.5% increase in healing received (from anything including my own heals)

Versatility
- a 7.5% increase in damage and healing
- a 3.85% decrease in damage taken

Bonus Armor
- a 7.31% increase in armor mitigation. Translated, I take ~15% less physical damage.


TLDR:

Damage Out:
- An AP increase of ~25%
- ~11% more haste = more attacks
- ~9% Crit
- a 7.5% increase in dmg (Versa)

Damage In:
- ~11% more haste = more active mitigation uptime
- ~6% parry
- +4.5% better SoTR (Active Mitigation)
- ~9% block = -3.5% melee dmg taken
- 7.31% increase in armor = -15% physical dmg taken.

Healing:
- An AP (spellpower) increase of ~25%
- 9% Crit (Towards WOG, SS, level 90 talents and SoI Healing)
- ~7% Better Bastion stacks (Somewhere around an additional 25% boost to my average WoG Cast)
- ~15% MS - a 4.5% increase in healing received
- a 7.5% increase in self healing/absorbs (Versa)

[Deleted]

Tbh i think it's the same trend in all "TOP" guilds. From the side view he's still above absalom, and to the same degree, both him and sloot are below some of the forum regulars (be it lazel, or jello, or even me in SoO)

This is a pretty valid point. What people don't seem to understand (a point that I've driven home pretty frequently) is that just because someone is in a Top 10 guild, that doesn't automatically make them the best in their spec.

[sexybeast]

You've gotta also bare in mind that not all tanks play to rank high like all dps do. Tank damage is great and yeah it's a friggin laugh when we do smash the actual dps in the guild, or when we do rank but not all tanks do play to rank.

[LuisKA]

There's no need to be the absolute best to be in a top guild either. I do think endurance and a relaxed mood goes a longer way. Being at ~90%+ performance is no rocket science, but keeping your cool and still perform at the same level after countless hours in front of the screen is much harder.

My experience is nowhere near that level but I feel my guild lags behind much more because of stupid arguments and people tilting to wipes than for that extra little push in player skill.

[Xothic]

There's no need to be the absolute best to be in a top guild either. I do think endurance and a relaxed mood goes a longer way. Being at ~90%+ performance is no rocket science, but keeping your cool and still perform at the same level after countless hours in front of the screen is much harder.

My experience is nowhere near that level but I feel my guild lags behind much more because of stupid arguments and people tilting to wipes than for that extra little push in player skill.

Story of my life mate. Maybe us tanks are just built to withstand bullshit and wipes more then others? :P

[sexybeast]

Story of my life mate. Maybe us tanks are just built to withstand bullshit and wipes more then others? :P

I told a guy he should be embarrassed cause he failed to move out of the charge 4 times in a row in mythic twins (for fear of having another infraction due to language i wont say exactly what was said). Patience is not a virtue I hold when raiding.

[Deleted]

I told a guy he should be embarrassed cause he failed to move out of the charge 4 times in a row in mythic twins. Patience is not a virtue I hold when raiding.

I yelled at a guy hard enough on Imperator that he ninja-transferred 5 minutes later. I can sympathise.

[Xfighter]

You've gotta also bare in mind that not all tanks play to rank high like all dps do. Tank damage is great and yeah it's a friggin laugh when we do smash the actual dps in the guild, or when we do rank but not all tanks do play to rank.

Aye, fully agree with this.



P.S. When did I miss the memo for a bunch of the top ranking pallies rocking Harsh Words pretty exclusively just to rank? Yea I know "lolnormal/heroic", but still feel it's pretty lame, when I always viewed pushing ranks in the light of "push my self as hard as possible, while not actively hindering my group/healers", regardless of the difficulty of the fight or not. Using nothing but Harsh Words instead of SotR seems bleh IMO. I prefer the competition with others actually playing as tanks, vs those deciding to pretend to DPS still.

(Though to be fair, playing with veng in SOO to push DPS could be seen as "hindering" the group in the sense that some of the damage intake could threaten the boss attempt - IJ comes to mind, but at least then we had more self-sustaining situations than now)

[Deleted]

Aye, fully agree with this.



P.S. When did I miss the memo for a bunch of the top ranking pallies rocking Harsh Words pretty exclusively just to rank? Yea I know "lolnormal/heroic", but still feel it's pretty lame, when I always viewed pushing ranks in the light of "push my self as hard as possible, while not actively hindering my group/healers", regardless of the difficulty of the fight or not. Using nothing but Harsh Words instead of SotR seems bleh IMO. I prefer the competition with others actually playing as tanks, vs those deciding to pretend to DPS still.

(Though to be fair, playing with veng in SOO to push DPS could be seen as "hindering" the group in the sense that some of the damage intake could threaten the boss attempt - IJ comes to mind, but at least then we had more self-sustaining situations than now)

Using WoG instead of SoTR is not actively hindering your raid in normals/heroics. Atleast not if it's on farm for your guild and you are progressing or farming mythic.
I do it myself from time to time in our weekly heroic clears for random gear pieces and to be honest there is no boss that poses even a slight danger to a tank.

Also I'm sure the healers in my raid prefers it since they get to heal slightly more and maybe rank aswell.

As for doing it on mythic I could see myself doing it on Kargath since there is really no damage going out on the tanks and maybe twin Ogron but that's it for me.