Level 100 Talents

[Deleted]

I'm sure that the ShR doesn't auto attack. Not benefitting from poisons or slice and dice and isn't as good a dps cooldowns as people are saying it is.

[fierydemise]

I'm sure that the ShR doesn't auto attack. Not benefitting from poisons or slice and dice and isn't as good a dps cooldowns as people are saying it is.

It doesn't auto attack but its still a very effective dps cooldown for sub and assassination because of how well it synergizes with their other major cooldowns. Also even without auto attacks and poisons it mirrors ~50% of damage for assassination and sub.

[Deleted]

It doesn't auto attack but its still a very effective dps cooldown for sub and assassination because of how well it synergizes with their other major cooldowns. Also even without auto attacks and poisons it mirrors ~50% of damage for assassination and sub.

That's fine, but it doesn't double one's dps for the duration as others have implied.

[PessimiStick]

It doesn't refund, it simply bugs and won't execute the Eviscerate/Envenom when you land. Been there since Alpha.

That is absolutely not my experience as Combat.

If there are sufficient targets (seems to be 3), using a 5 point DfA will land me with 5 CP almost 100% of the time. I will drop to 4 on the way up, and then hit 5 on landing (presumably the eviscerate generates a CP from ruthlessness since it's a 5 pointer). The buffed Eviscerate is definitely going off. I've been using an MfD/DfA build in Heroics for a couple days, and the AoE is insane. DfA, 5 point Evisc, MfD, 5 point Evisc. Spikes to 70k+ DPS sometimes. My gut feeling is that Ruthlessness is behaving inappropriately with DfA and proccing the free CP off of every target it hits on the way up, and off the Evisc target on the way down.

There is also still the long standing bug where the evis at the end doesn't trigger which has existed since the ability was added and remains unfixed although it is somewhat rare.

Yeah, I didn't mean to imply that it never happens. Wouldn't be surprised if the bug with DfA CP is similar to the Thrash Blade shenanigans. BF hits counting as real attacks that proc other abilities and whatnot.

[fierydemise]

That is absolutely not my experience as Combat.

If there are sufficient targets (seems to be 3), using a 5 point DfA will land me with 5 CP almost 100% of the time. I will drop to 4 on the way up, and then hit 5 on landing (presumably the eviscerate generates a CP from ruthlessness since it's a 5 pointer). The buffed Eviscerate is definitely going off. I've been using an MfD/DfA build in Heroics for a couple days, and the AoE is insane. DfA, 5 point Evisc, MfD, 5 point Evisc. Spikes to 70k+ DPS sometimes. My gut feeling is that Ruthlessness is behaving inappropriately with DfA and proccing the free CP off of every target it hits on the way up, and off the Evisc target on the way down.

DfA has been proccing 2+num_targets combo points since about 6 weeks ago. I'm pretty sure its a bug but Blizzard has never confirmed what the intended behavior is (despite repeated questions) so I have no idea.

There is also still the long standing bug where the evis at the end doesn't trigger which has existed since the ability was added and remains unfixed although it is somewhat rare.

[Eazy]

What's the best time to cast Shadow Reflection? 5 points + rupture on a boss -> Shadow Reflection -> Vendetta -> Envenom (+Envenom if 10 points from anticipation)?

[Thra]

What about venom rush in combat spec? Deadly poison is replaced with instant poison and I'm not sure if it works.
And if it does, what about blade flurry? Does it apply instant poison to all targets?

I have only used VR and only been combat (since hitting 100). I feel if you are going to play combat it's the only choice.

On Trash you are generally given a constant 3 targets to poison = 15% energy regen.

Blade Flurry with the Draenor perk lets you hit everything in range, meaning on trash you will always have 3 stacks of VR (given there is 3+ targets).

On single target, yes it doesn't reach its full potential. But most boss fights have adds that you can poison, and while they are alive and poisoned you get a stack of VR. I just turn Blade Flurry on when adds are close, get a stack, go back to Single Target.

[Tedj]

That's fine, but it doesn't double one's dps for the duration as others have implied.

I did not imply that. It does not use your auto attacks. It does boost your damage substantially because of it's perfect synergy with ShD, for Subtlety, since it mimics your ambushes and applies it's own Find Weakness debuff (only for itself) which will translate into a lot of damage if you take into account the eviscerates too.

What's the best time to cast Shadow Reflection? 5 points + rupture on a boss -> Shadow Reflection -> Vendetta -> Envenom (+Envenom if 10 points from anticipation)?

I haven't played much Assassination yet but I'd assume if you want to maximize your damage you should pool your energy to maximum before using it, have 5 CP Rupture on the target, and macro your Vendetta and ShR together - they both have 2 minutes CD and ShR is not in the CGG.
The real question is if it mimics empowered Envenom, and if it does, you should not spam Envenom, but use Envenom and spam Mutilate/Dispatch afterwards to take advantage of that 30% increased damage. I've read somewhere all the things it mimics, but I didn't pay attention to anything except Subtlety.

[Eazy]

I haven't played much Assassination yet but I'd assume if you want to maximize your damage you should pool your energy to maximum before using it, have 5 CP Rupture on the target, and macro your Vendetta and ShR together - they both have 2 minutes CD and ShR is not in the CGG.
The real question is if it mimics empowered Envenom, and if it does, you should not spam Envenom, but use Envenom and spam Mutilate/Dispatch afterwards to take advantage of that 30% increased damage. I've read somewhere all the things it mimics, but I didn't pay attention to anything except Subtlety.

Well, does Shadow Reflection mimic Rupture also?

[Tedj]

Well, does Shadow Reflection mimic Rupture also?

It does. I've seen my targets with rupture from it. It mimics every offensive ability (FoK too, etc) but I don't know if it mimics the empowered part of Envenom.

[Greylan]

Do you use your Vendetta first, or ShR first then vendetta so the copy gets its own Vendetta? Can it even get its own Vendetta? Order of operations for ShR and Vendetta confuse me a bit, I guess it will depend on if it mimics it or not, losing that 1 gcd when you ShR then Vendetta feels like it hurts.

[intrinsc]

If I'm doing CMs or heroics I just stick with Lemon Zest to not have to wait for yet another CD to come off before bosses, etc. During progression, however, I'm going to play around with SR because you tend to have some very specific burn phases and I'm sure it would be a pretty good CD for those situations.