Illogical "pro-life" arguments

[Daelak]

Seems to me that in order for the "pro-life" movement to gain credibility and logical consistency is for them to publicly advocate the arrest, charging, and sentencing of women that elect to have an abortion for first degree murder, a charge that carries the death penalty in some states. As well as charging all medical personnel involved with the procedure as accessories to murder. Since they like to use the words murder, killing, holocaust, I would assume they would all be behind giving teenage girls and single mothers the chance of a life without parole.

Thoughts?

[AndaliteBandit]

Where's the controversy about fertility clinics? I've yet to read about a fertility clinic doctor being assassinated, fertility clinics being protested, or legislation being introduced with the intention of shutting down most of the fertility clinics in the state. Is there a 48-hour waiting period before the fertilized eggs are discarded? Is a transvaginal ultrasound required? How many "crisis" fertility clinics have opened that pretend to be fertility clinics, but actually bombard visitors with misleading information intended to discourage them from pursuing fertility treatments?

[Reeve]

Seems to me that in order for the "pro-life" movement to gain credibility and logical consistency is for them to publicly advocate the arrest, charging, and sentencing of women that elect to have an abortion for first degree murder, a charge that carries the death penalty in some states. As well as charging all medical personnel involved with the procedure as accessories to murder. Since they like to use the words murder, killing, holocaust, I would assume they would all be behind giving teenage girls and single mothers the chance of a life without parole.

Thoughts?

I think they'd very much like to do that, if the Supreme Court hadn't already ruled that they can't.

[pateuvasiliu]

Don't you get a bigger sentence if you kill a pregnant woman?

Yet abortion is legal.

How does that work?

[Rukentuts]

Don't you get a bigger sentence if you kill a pregnant woman?

Yet abortion is legal.

How does that work?

Because she didn't elect to have that fetus violently terminated?

[Agnar]

Don't you get a bigger sentence if you kill a pregnant woman?

Yet abortion is legal.

How does that work?

Hypocrisy I'm guessing.

[AndaliteBandit]

Don't you get a bigger sentence if you kill a pregnant woman?

Yet abortion is legal.

How does that work?

It's illegal to terminate a woman's pregnancy against her will, which includes by her death.

[Activi-T]

Don't you get a bigger sentence if you kill a pregnant woman?

Yet abortion is legal.

How does that work?

The lack of choice on the woman's behalf. Humans aren't logical, I don't know why we are pretending we are.

[Garnier Fructis]

Hypocrisy I'm guessing.

There is no hypocrisy. It comes right back to the heart of the matter - choice. The choice to keep or abort rests solely with the woman. Killing a pregnant woman is two crimes rolled into one: killing her, and killing her fetus against her will.

[pateuvasiliu]

Because she didn't elect to have that fetus violently terminated?

But the fetus is a separate organism and is not a person. Via abortion, it has no rights.

To use the pro choice logic, it's a bundle of cells no different from her hair. Why do you get an extra sentence for killing a bundle of cells?

[Rukentuts]

Via abortion, it has no rights.

She does, and she has to consent. No consent, no abortion.

Same reason you can get jailed by ignoring consent on any medical procedure.

[Symphonic]

It's illegal to terminate a woman's pregnancy against her will, which includes by her death.

But does the unborn baby count as a second count of homicide or does it just count as something different?

[AndaliteBandit]

But the fetus is a separate organism and is not a person. Via abortion, it has no rights.

To use the pro choice logic, it's a bundle of cells no different from her hair. Why do you get an extra sentence for killing a bundle of cells?

Because you do not have the right to terminate her pregnancy against her will. Pretty simple.

[pateuvasiliu]

She does, and she has to consent. No consent, no abortion.

Same reason you can get jailed by ignoring consent on any medical procedure.

But she's dead. There's no consent anymore.

The fetus dies because she died, not because I did a surgical procedure.

No different from heir hair cells dying, as per pro choice logic. I don't get extra days in prison because she wasn't bald when she died and her hair cells died too.

So why do I get extra sentence for the fetus dying?

[Rukentuts]

But she's dead. There's no consent anymore.

Except this is wrong. You can't just do anything with a dead body that you please.

[AndaliteBandit]

But does the unborn baby count as a second count of homicide or does it just count as something different?

This depends on the viability and the state. If it would be illegal in her state for this woman to pursue an abortion at her stage in pregnancy, it's probably going to get counted as a double homicide.

[Xisa]

She does, and she has to consent. No consent, no abortion.

Same reason you can get jailed by ignoring consent on any medical procedure.

That doesn't really hold water, as consenting to have someone kill a child isn't legal, and the legal ramifications for killing a pregnant mother are similar to this.

[pateuvasiliu]

Except this is wrong. You can't just do anything with a dead body that you please.

I am not.

The fetus is dying as a result of her dying. I'm not specifically targeting the fetus. I shot her and that's it.

[Seegtease]

Because she didn't elect to have that fetus violently terminated?

This effectively means it's only a human if the woman decides that it's a human (after all, you can't be charged with manslaughter without a... man to slaughter). If she later decides that it's not human, she can, of course, kill it off herself. And if anyone thinks this makes sense, there's no hope.

[AndaliteBandit]

But she's dead. There's no consent anymore.

The fetus dies because she died, not because I did a surgical procedure.

No different from heir hair cells dying, as per pro choice logic. I don't get extra days in prison because she wasn't bald when she died and her hair cells died too.

So why do I get extra sentence for the fetus dying?

Is it legal to rape corpses?

You legally retain bodily autonomy to some degree, even in death.