Assassination Vs. Sub - PvP!

[seraphbreak]

Might have to switch over to mutilate.. sub is really not dishing out the damage in BGs with our current gear. Granted I am using a dagger and slow offhand that I got from a strongbox, do things get better with 2 daggers in sub?

[Tedj]

Might have to switch over to mutilate.. sub is really not dishing out the damage in BGs with our current gear. Granted I am using a dagger and slow offhand that I got from a strongbox, do things get better with 2 daggers in sub?

I don't think you will notice such difference from that. The majority of your Subt damage comes from Ambushes and Eviscerates along with Rupture and Internal Bleeding (Kidney Shot) ticks plus some additional damage from advancing your bleeds with Multistrike.

Thing is that Subt's in a great spot for bursting, given that it really only happens once per minute. When you're waiting for that you should be controlling , peeling and getting ready for your next burst window (prepare cooldowns, the situation, etc). When waiting for your CD's, the biggest pressure you can keep up seemed to be by abusing re-stealth and continuously interrupt the other team's tactic or game play with garrotes and cheapshots, gouges, kidneys, blinds and kicks. You can keep some damage rolling if you Rupture players here and there and some Hemo's too.

I've found that I'm particularly fond of Venom Rush in 3s because no only it gives me more energy for my burst windows, but it gives me quite some regen, especially when I keep poisons in more than one target (pets, you can just FoK for it), allowing me to peel and build up a situation for the next burst window easier.

This is however, for arenas, especially 3v3 where you set up bursts with someone else. For BG's I'd say you have 2 different play styles: You can be the sneaky burst rogue who's controlling everything while his team helps taking enemies down with insane burst every 1 minute (seems rather fast for a BG), or you can choose to go Assassination or Combat and be one of those sustained DPS'ers. Personally, I prefer the burst and sneakiness of Subtlety.

[Vehemence]

I'm playing Sub with a Slow MH, it's not easy, because I have to keep an eye on all my bleeds constantly and the Hemorrhage instant damage has been nerfed.

[Tedj]

I'm playing Sub with a Slow MH, it's not easy, because I have to keep an eye on all my bleeds constantly and the Hemorrhage instant damage has been nerfed.

Just don't. Get a dagger and be happy.

[Vehemence]

Just don't. Get a dagger and be happy.

But it feels so wrong, and what's wrong with having Subtlety having choice whether you want to use daggers or a slow MH weapon? Why did they had to nerf the hemorrhage damage?

Daggers for Assassination
Slow weapons for Combat
You can do either in Subtlety

??? What's wrong with this? I quit in pandaria and came back for Draenor so I was a bit shocked after all these years of playing Subtlety that way.

[Anium]

idk man, been trying everything. always feels like i'm walking among juggernauts. ferals, glad warriors, dks, ret pallies, any healer. full 675 geared as well. sub still takes setup for burst meanwhile everyone else is frontloaded. i find myself kiting and restealthing instead of being able to go toe to toe with cooldowns. we're definitely not 1v1 champs atm.

lol but a rogue isn't supposed to go toe to toe and faceaggro everything, ofc you're going to fail like that. You gotta be sneaky man...
and you're def 1v1 champs.

[Gentlepenguin]

lol but a rogue isn't supposed to go toe to toe and faceaggro everything, ofc you're going to fail like that. You gotta be sneaky man...
and you're def 1v1 champs.

nowhere is that defined. in fact they claimed that they wanted rogues to be able to brawl a couple years back. this was the case in cata throughout mop. now we can't, with no real explanation. they nerfed our self-healing in wod beta and just left it that way. the best enchant right now is a bleed. we need multiple cooldowns to reset a fight.

it's better in arena at least, but in bgs even i target rogues just because they're easy.

[TheShultz]

Am I the only newb that went anticipation with assassination? With MfD I am constantly losing out on CP 2-3 at a time.

That's how I like to play too, I felt like the flexibility it provides is too good to pass up.

[willtron]

That's how I like to play too, I felt like the flexibility it provides is too good to pass up.

But then the burst you get with 5cp -> Vendetta, Shadow Reflection -> Envenom -> MfD, Envenom is pretty tasty

[Gentlepenguin]

But then the burst you get with 5cp -> Vendetta, Shadow Reflection -> Envenom -> MfD, Envenom is pretty tasty

i believe you're supposed to use shadow before vendetta.

[Karry]

His statement still stand. MFD is king in PVP. There are so many situations were you could can just MFD and heal and run away or as he said for the insane burst that Muti can do.

[Sikplays]

I leveled as MUT and then pvped at 100 then switched to Sub, I had to go back. the damage i can pull from Mut is just to fun. I think in season two that sub will take the lead though, I have a video on my youtube(shamelessplug) youtube.com/sikplays one video is where i 2v1ed two hunters as mut and I dont think i would have been able to do it as sub

[Chimpyman]

hey silkplays whats your armory. you dont have it on your youtube or stream

[Packing an i5]

I like mutilate but it still feels quite energy starved. I was playing with Zest and glyph of energy and shadow focus and if you use Feint and burst of speed you have to spend quite a bit of energy when going for resets, getting focused that could be used for damage.

(Now im using DFA because midair you can avoid being CCED plus close some distance. Still using energy glyph and Shadowfocus)

Sub will still have an easier time managing all the crap Rupture, snd, feint, bos because sub doesnt have to be on target to reapply Slice and dice for their regen they can do it whenever they have pts and they generate points passively too from Honor amongst theives> Seal fate.

Mutilate is still full of RNG )Dispatch Proc chance, Seal fate( and our cooldown vendetta Sucks balls.

[Deleted]

i thought id enjoy my rogue again in wod but nop i have more sucess ganking in wpvp on my dk than my rogue

[Vehemence]

I like mutilate but it still feels quite energy starved. I was playing with Zest and glyph of energy and shadow focus and if you use Feint and burst of speed you have to spend quite a bit of energy when going for resets, getting focused that could be used for damage.

(Now im using DFA because midair you can avoid being CCED plus close some distance. Still using energy glyph and Shadowfocus)

Sub will still have an easier time managing all the crap Rupture, snd, feint, bos because sub doesnt have to be on target to reapply Slice and dice for their regen they can do it whenever they have pts and they generate points passively too from Honor amongst theives> Seal fate.

Mutilate is still full of RNG )Dispatch Proc chance, Seal fate( and our cooldown vendetta Sucks balls.

Really? I have an easier time getting energy in Assassination than in Subtlety. Subtlety I need to remember everything, Rupture, Garrote, SnD, SD, etc
I can see where you're coming from though.

[Deleted]

assasination is best for me atm, its the best specc i think just due to the fact you dnt have to keep applying SND

[dak1]

assasination is best for me atm, its the besteasiest specc i think just due to the fact you dnt have to keep applying SND

Note the difference above.

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Really? I have an easier time getting energy in Assassination than in Subtlety. Subtlety I need to remember everything, Rupture, Garrote, SnD, SD, etc
I can see where you're coming from though.

Subtlety has arguably the highest skill floor (the amount of skill necessary to start having minor success) in the game. It's extremely unforgiving and has a very nuanced play style.

[Kortiah]

But it feels so wrong, and what's wrong with having Subtlety having choice whether you want to use daggers or a slow MH weapon? What's wrong with this?

Because "Subtlety" does not mean smashing people facing with a heavy mace, causing their nose to burst into a bleeding volcano. It's about, guess what, finding weaknesses, stabbing them behind their backs, and getting them to bleed from the inside.

[Vehemence]

Because "Subtlety" does not mean smashing people facing with a heavy mace, causing their nose to burst into a bleeding volcano. It's about, guess what, finding weaknesses, stabbing them behind their backs, and getting them to bleed from the inside.

If we're going to do wordplay then I could say the same about the half of the abilities and trees in this game. That makes no sense, hemorrhage was perfectly fine for all these years for Subtlety.