[Resto] Druid Guide & Discussion (6.0.3)

[Hildrande]

Is there any way I can calculate the different stats in terms of raw throughput?

Yes. The easiest way is to check your tooltip values while switching a piece of gear, enchant or gem. You will need to multiply by the crit and MS coefficient though. The crit coefficient is 1+(character sheet crit % value, * 2 for Living Seed enabled heals and * 0 for glyphed Regrowth), for Multistrike it's 1+(character sheet MS % value*1.6).

The not so easy way is to jump into Hamlet's HealerCalcs, or start spreadsheeting on your own.

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But 500 Mastery for 12 seconds sounds a lot more appealing

500 Mastery is 500/88=5.7 percentage point of added Mastery, if you already have 20% Mastery it's 4.7% added healing. For 12 seconds. Not overwhelming.

Some of the top gold runs on Warcraftlogs use Mark of the Shattered Hand. Atleast for some fights - which is an idea, since we can switch weapons during combat, we can have 1 of each enchant type and swap in the spirit one whenever it's needed.

[Deleted]

Wild Growth, Regrowth (but only really on the tank), Lifebloom and any spell cast with the SotF bonus. Plus the fact that there's only room for 1, sometimes 2, Rejuvenations on a target, and if that's not enough, SotF+RaG gives you better options than the Rejuvenation talents. Swiftmend+doubled rejuv is more throughput than a single rejuv, for example

I think you have to compare spells with similar qualities though. Rejuvenation and Healing Touch are filler spells because they do a moderate amount of healing over a period of time. Wild Growth and Regrowth are throughput spells with different purposes and aren't a sustainable method of healing for a very long time (not that spamming Rejuvenation is either, but you're not going to be idling for ten seconds after casting WG).

I think Rejuvenation will really start to see effectiveness once raiding starts because people will be forced to think about their mana efficiency and so raid members will be sitting at health deficits for periods of time which is exactly where hots are very strong - And especially Rejuvenation because we now have potential for a lot more targets than previously.

[Deleted]

Hi there.

I've seen some top world Rdruid running Haste>Multi>Crit>Mastery. I clearly can get why they prefer haste over the other stats since they are mainly doing challenge modes, but why mastery is pushed behind crit and multi while all of these 3 are thoughtput stats ?

[Hildrande]

I think Rejuvenation will really start to see effectiveness once raiding starts because people will be forced to think about their mana efficiency

That's exactly what I'm thinking about +50% Wild Growths :-P

[nightfalls]

Hi there.

I've seen some top world Rdruid running Haste>Multi>Crit>Mastery. I clearly can get why they prefer haste over the other stats since they are mainly doing challenge modes, but why mastery is pushed behind crit and multi while all of these 3 are thoughtput stats ?

The guy explained why already, basically Mastery doesn't impact DPS.

[Deleted]

Oh right, that's actually pretty clever. Thanks for the answer.

[Squishes]

Makes sense if they're trying to maximize the CM's.. at least from what I remember of MoP CM's, I always tried to help with dps as much as possible and mastery does nothing for dps while those three that are being favored help both healing and dps.

Edit: and someone beat me to it XD

[Deleted]

That's exactly what I'm thinking about +50% Wild Growths :-P

Yes, but WG is on a ten second cooldown. What will you be doing for those ten seconds? Surely you'll be filling the time with some amount of HT or Rejuv, depending on the needs of the raid.

Also, you have to consider how inefficient Rampant Growth is. Yes, you can Swiftmend your Regrowth and yes, you can get free Regrowths, but if you ever have to use RG + SM + WG without a clearcast proc, the mana efficiency of WG drops because RG is expensive. Also, whenever you use Swiftmend on a HoT, you lose the remaining healing since Rampant Growth consumes it. This means that any time you can't use Swiftmend near the end of a HoT, you'll lose healing and mana

[Cirque]

I'd like to add a few things on the usage of Glyphed Regrowth vs Healing Touch. A guy on page 1 asked a question about it and I'd like to share my thoughts on the subject.

Basically: Glyphed Regrowth indeed replaces Healing Touch as it basically becomes the same spell, except it's more expensive yet faster. It's honestly a near-mandatory glyph for harder content (CMs) because it's the only way you can keep up with the often stupid damage incoming. Its increased crit chance obviously makes it heal for more, enabling you to keep up with the incoming damage, but it also gives you tons of Living Seeds. Does it mean you can remove HT from your bars? Obviously not, as you would run OOM if you'd consistently Regrowth over HT in every situation, but when you heal ~600 ilevel heroics and most CMs with most tanks, the only way to actually keep people, especially the tank, up, is through mass Regrowth spam. The HOT in that scenario is always wasted as you keep overwriting it. In general, the HOT is wasted as there's never a scenario where you'd opt to use Regrowth just for the HOT - except maybe through Omen procs. You use Regrowth when someone needs healing TODAY. If you could use Regrowth just for the HOT, 9 out of 10 times you'd have been better off and much more mana-efficient just using HT.

I honestly find it a mandatory glyph, especially when you do any kind of challenging content with solid incoming tank damage. The HOT is rarely going to be as good as the Living Seed/topping you can do. Swiftmendable is hardly an argument, as you should always have Rejuvenation running on the tanks (and with Lv100 talent Germination it's almost impossible to not have a Rejuv on the tank, even if you fuck up) and you will never Regrowth someone just to make it a Swiftmendable target anyway, you'd always opt for Rejuv in those scenarios.

[Hildrande]

This means that any time you can't use Swiftmend near the end of a HoT, you'll lose healing and mana

No.

For example: If you cast rejuv, Swiftmend, rejuv directly after one another you have paid for 1 SwM and 2 rejuvs and that's exactly the healing you are getting. If you manage to find a partially ticked rejuv to eat instead of a fresh one it's all bonus.

If you can use Regrowth on the tank and have it not overheal it's not that an expensive heal. But to use Rampant Growth effectively you will need to get skilled at tossing around Rejuvenations to eat.

[Drusin]

you will never Regrowth someone just to make it a Swiftmendable target anyway, you'd always opt for Rejuv in those scenarios.

I do this for emergency situations. With Lifebloom running and a Rejuv on the target you regrowth, and swiftmend from what I've seen will always consume the regrowth over the rejuv, and at the time you have the Sotf buff (I do CM's as RaGr+SotF) then you just chain them RG+SW+RG+SW this is in the most horrible of situations though not something you'd do constantly.

[Asrialol]

No.

For example: If you cast rejuv, Swiftmend, rejuv directly after one another you have paid for 1 SwM and 2 rejuvs and that's exactly the healing you are getting. If you manage to find a partially ticked rejuv to eat instead of a fresh one it's all bonus.

If you can use Regrowth on the tank and have it not overheal it's not that an expensive heal. But to use Rampant Growth effectively you will need to get skilled at tossing around Rejuvenations to eat.

Why would you want to use SotF on Rejuvenation, thogh. Germination is better for that.

Just because you talent Rampant Growth doesn't mean you shouldn't be casting Rejuvenations where it's needed. If they're not topped off once it's about to expire, being able to Swiftmend them for SotF is indeed a nice bonus.

I fail to see where Rampant Growth outshines Germination in a raid setting, unless there is a special mechanic in the fight, similar to Valithria, etc.

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I do this for emergency situations. With Lifebloom running and a Rejuv on the target you regrowth, and swiftmend from what I've seen will always consume the regrowth over the rejuv, and at the time you have the Sotf buff (I do CM's as RaGr+SotF) then you just chain them RG+SW+RG+SW this is in the most horrible of situations though not something you'd do constantly.

Swiftmend will always consume the Regrowth, indeed. Doesn't matter if Rejuvenation has 1 second left and Regrowth has full duration.

[Drusin]

I fail to see where Rampant Growth outshines Germination in a raid setting, unless there is a special mechanic in the fight, similar to Valithria, etc.

We will probably end up swapping talents between fights (hopefully). I personally prefer the RaGr+SotF style of healing but will use whichever works best for the fights.

[sgtcook]

Note: Wild Growth is the only spell we have that has a haste breakpoint. Not sure if this is intended, but if you're stacking haste you should easily reach this breakpoint which is 900 haste.

Still work ?
Someone tested this in WoD ( LIVE ) ?

[Hildrande]

Still work ?
Someone tested this in WoD ( LIVE ) ?

Did some testing now and indeed WG is not well-behaved. With 0% haste you get 7 ticks - none at start and then one each second for 7 seconds. The last tick is approximately 2/3 as strong as the first.

As soon as you get more than 0% haste you get an 8th tick, with the same value as the 7th tick. It's not a partial tick, it's a full tick. That's where the problem is. The same happends after you get more than 1/7=14.29% haste, a 9th tick with the same value as the 8th tick.

This means not only that WG has a breakpoint at 14.29% (and at 2/7, 3/7 etc) but also that it will heal for more than it should. Maybe something like 10% more if you are just above a breakpoint.

If you have say 24% of your healing from Wild Growth getting to that breakpoint may be important enough to use lower ilvl haste gear, and once you are at it other stats may give more overall healing output than haste.

[Deleted]

They probably cba fixing it with the way the ticks decrease for WG. I'd imagine it's a code-clusterfuck of epic proportions at this point.
I just checked if I'm > 14.29%; turns out I'm at 13.37% haste :]

[Hildrande]

With the haste buff I believe the breakpoints will be 8.85% and 22.45%.

[theburned]

btw you havent mentioned anything of the real pros of going dream of cenarius... and it is very relevant atm with the restricted mana..

It has to be useful for pretty much every fight where you spamming rejuvs gets you nowhere, and also when HT will be too slow, low damage phases pretty much, also gives you something to rely on once you reach critcal levels of mana.

[Deleted]

Even when I'm OOM, I can damn near spam HT and LB/Rejuv with my 1400ish spirit and Shadowmoon enchant. It's not worth it for that purpose. The only place I can see justifying DoC is in easy heroics to speed it up, or with a powerful group going for gold CMs. In hard content where time isn't an enormous concern, Nature's Vigil is simply too good to pass up, and you won't have enough time for Wrath-spam to make DoC worthwhile. You need to be able to cast that almost exclusively in order for it to be a sensible consideration over NV.

[Deleted]

Literally spamming DoC in a heroic group (full of morons) I ended up doing around 5% of the group damage.
Gonna keep an eye on NV damage over the next few days. It's still ingame, not part of the tooltip anymore (unless I'm missing something).