Imperator Mar'gok help and tips please.

[-Doko-]

Main issue I see with this fight for normal (mainly talking if you were to pug this) is rune fortification, the shockwave + the add living for a much longer period of time just annihilates your healer's mana if they are not very well coordinated.

[Deleted]

Tank the boss corner to corner, moving him after every Nova. Ranged follow behind the melee. Ranged move for mine, get Branded to 4-6 stacks before getting it out of the raid.

If you step in 2-3 mines in Phase 1 or Phase 2, wipe. If someone triggers it more than once, kick them. If your healers are OoM at any point and mines were triggered earlier, then we've found the problem.

Anyway, make sure to have people run through the Force Nova. If Melee are in a corner of the room and get knocked back into a wall, they can run forward straight away and take a lot less damage. Save some DPS CD's for the first transition.

For the transition, have melee and most ranged on the Warmages, and 2 ranged on the Anomalies (We had a Boomkin and a Hunter on it). The second warmage should be on about 20% before the boss comes back.

Phase 3 is difficult, you have to let Branded stack higher before getting it out of the raid. Our guild handled the tank debuff by having the tank taunt the boss and run far away as soon as the boss spawns the add, then making the off-tank taunt the boss back after the boss applies the snare to the tank. Only one person has to move, and nobody should be in range of it, especially if you have a Monk, Bear or Warrior tank. Popping Devotion Aura at the start of Force Nova means you can mitigate damage from two of the three in this phase.

Second transition is by far the hardest part of the fight. We had our paladins chain Hands of Sac on the tank that took the melee add. We killed one Warmage, then the Reaver, then the second warmage. We kept the 2 ranged on the anomalies. With Hero and Pots, we got the second mage to about 30% before the boss came back. At that point, ranged should kill the mage while melee run back. Melee have to focus the add that the boss spawns and then cleave like their life depends on it. We had the tank with the debuff run away, and everyone had to dodge the balls while nuking adds while avoiding mines. With branded in this phase, use any and all defensive CD's to reduce damage and save the healers. Melee should also spread out , maybe even run back for the Force Nova. Ranged should also be spread.

When we got to 10% we had the tanks pop their final CD's and had everyone burn the boss. Hopefully some of these tips help.

[Pur1tas]

So I read a lot of people saying it is overtuned and he is harder in normal than most bosses are in heroic.

First of all I'd like to say that we are 1 week in and there would be absolutely 0 point in playing if every guild would clear 7/7 nhc and HC during the first week. I would quit the game if it was like that.

Second there is a reason why he is the endboss. He is supposed to be harder and I think he is supposed to be harder than the first 4 in heroic. There is also no way in comparing that to Garrosh flex as for garrosh flex people had like 535 to 545 of GS in comparrison to the 540 loot he dropped. Now we have 655 loot being droppt to groups of a gs of 630 and upwards (lets say 645 even). The difference is just a lot bigger.

The fight itself is not that complicated and it only takes practice by dps heals and tanks in order to minimize dmg taken, maximise dmg output and keep the healers at close to 100% mana until the first intermission hits. This is not hard of a task it only requires doging of mines, well handled Debuff, a Immerseus mechanic that everyone should know how it works (as we did this fpr 13 months) and an understanding on how important it is to remove adds in this raid tier.

Mechanic wise this fight is a lot easier than some fights in SoO the only difference is the changes for Healers have a huge effect on how the raid has to play. While during SoO healers could just make up for mechanic fails this is not the case anymore. As far as I am concerned the fight can be solo healed up to the first intermission where dmg starts to come in fast. In order to beat this fight you have to beat the mechanic and have some good dps that know what they are doing. This is just like Siegecrafter, Klaxxi or Malkorok 10m HC a fight were mistakes are not forgiven and will most certainly lead to a wipe.

[Kaiarra]

Would it be a fair assumption that if we don't have the DPS to kill Butcher HC, we certainly won't have enough DPS to kill Mar'gok on Normal? Those 2 are our choices of boss for tonight and we only managed to hit ~25% before enrage on Butcher HC last raid.

We get to the Fortification phase on Mar'gok, then start losing people to the damage from the triple nova/wrath.

[Anzen]

we only managed to hit ~25% before enrage on Butcher HC last raid.

I just wanted to chime in here since it seems a very real possibility. You know Butcher always enrages when he hits below 30%, it's like part of his mechanics and doesn't matter what DPS you do. If you mean he beserked at 25% then I wouldn't bother trying to do either boss

[seam]

Would it be a fair assumption that if we don't have the DPS to kill Butcher HC, we certainly won't have enough DPS to kill Mar'gok on Normal? Those 2 are our choices of boss for tonight and we only managed to hit ~25% before enrage on Butcher HC last raid.

We get to the Fortification phase on Mar'gok, then start losing people to the damage from the triple nova/wrath.

I think your dps would be too low for the transitions/getting stuff down in mine to make things easier for the healers.

Not saying you couldn't do it, but it'd be much harder.

[PessimiStick]

Normal mode Mar'gok is harder than every boss in Heroic except for Mar'gok (obviously). He's probably slightly overtuned in that respect, but it's not like he's unbeatable, and it feels ok to have the last boss be difficult as far as I'm concerned.

[Deleted]

The difficulty ramp from the previous boss to this is too steep. Most guilds are 6/7 normal and 6/7 heroic by now. It's easier to do 6/7 heroic than kill the last boss on normal. That's the definition of bad difficulty scaling.

[Anzen]

Normal mode Mar'gok is harder than every boss in Heroic except for Mar'gok (obviously). He's probably slightly overtuned in that respect, but it's not like he's unbeatable, and it feels ok to have the last boss be difficult as far as I'm concerned.

The difficulty ramp from the previous boss to this is too steep. Most guilds are 6/7 normal and 6/7 heroic by now. It's easier to do 6/7 heroic than kill the last boss on normal. That's the definition of bad difficulty scaling.

I'm sorry but I can't see this being true at all. Please point out any guild that is 6/7 normal and 6/7 heroic that can't kill Mar'gok normal.

[Lolretadin]

Flex garrosh was easier when people would do it in 520 ilvl? Because that's the gap now if you'd have a 635ish team and endboss drops 655 loot.

Heroic is tuned for iLvL 630, so I would believe that Normal would be tuned for 620 or so.

[Pur1tas]

Heroic is tuned for iLvL 630, so I would believe that Normal would be tuned for 620 or so.

Heroic is not tuned for iLvL 630 as stated by blizzard I think today or yesterday. Normal is tuned for 630

[PessimiStick]

I'm sorry but I can't see this being true at all. Please point out any guild that is 6/7 normal and 6/7 heroic that can't kill Mar'gok normal.

We wiped more times on Normal Mar'gok than we did on any heroic encounter. 5 wipes on H Butcher, some because of bad strategy. 7 wipes on N Mar'gok. We're 7/7 and 6/7 after 2.5 raid days.

[Torched]

Heroic is tuned for iLvL 630, so I would believe that Normal would be tuned for 620 or so.

"Highmaul Normal has been tuned around you having 5 man Heroic dungeon gear, where Highmaul Heroic was tuned around having Highmaul Normal gear; A natural progression."


That´s a quote from Blizzard themself on the front page of mmo-champion.

[Wilderness]

Heroic is tuned for iLvL 630, so I would believe that Normal would be tuned for 620 or so.

That was an assumption that many of us had (I know I did) because of something said at Blizzcon in 2013, and that during beta testing people were normalized to 630 ilvl. But that was proven false once the raids released, and Blizzard stated that explicitly recently as well, as someone already quoted.

Would it be a fair assumption that if we don't have the DPS to kill Butcher HC, we certainly won't have enough DPS to kill Mar'gok on Normal? Those 2 are our choices of boss for tonight and we only managed to hit ~25% before enrage on Butcher HC last raid.

We get to the Fortification phase on Mar'gok, then start losing people to the damage from the triple nova/wrath.

Its probably a fair assumption. It might be doable, but you'd all have to do the mechanics of Mar'gok perfectly. We beat the Butcher's enrage by 7 seconds, we didn't pre-pot b/c it was our 1st pull but still, and the 2nd transition was still tough getting everything down. We killed both Warmages though, and a lot of people here are saying you can just ignore the 2nd one during that 2nd transition and that would probably make that go much easier.

[Cirque]

Drop a healer if at all possible. The HPS requirements on Imperator seem steep, but the fact of the matter is that there's actually relatively little unavoidable damage, and a large part of the unavoidable damage is better dealt with by killing the source quickly than bringing an extra healer.

The only sources of damage that are genuinely unavoidable are pulsing AoE from Abberations, Warmage Fixates, Force Nova, Arcane Wrath, and Volatility Anomalies. Abberations do by far the most of this unavoidable AoE, and Volatile Anomalies are much easier to deal with if you simply kill them at a steady pace. It really is a fight where you want to bring only as many healers as absolutely necessary.

Are you actually for real? Have you healed this fight at all? There is a lot of unavoidable damage happening, it's just that you can limit the way it IS happening to you. Managing how much damage is actually incoming is what wins you this fight.

- Positioning
- Fortified adds - these need to die faster than fast. Paste dps meters on that one to motivate people to stop fucking around
- Mages - also need to die really fucking fast.
- Nova's can be stampeded through to minimize damage, also blinked to completely negate all damage
- Adds should be killed carefully and not brainlessly aoe'd
- Traps should never even be touched, one accidental set off = a death and lots of mana wasted. If you use bigWigs have people Emphasize trap spawn time
- Watch for healers trying to whore HPS, spread healer cooldowns. You don't really need to perfectly plan them, but make sure there is no yolo HotW Tranqing going on that is then to make matters worse being sniped by a Revival. At the same time make sure healers are not afraid to use them. Sitting on your Nature's Vigil and only using it twice during the entire fight is equally stupid and will drain everyone's mana.

Like with all progress fights, your healers and your dps alike have to learn the mechanics correctly and healers in specific will learn to plan their mana during the fight. If your raid fucks up that is how your mana will run dry, but if everyone plays correct you will find healer mana to be completely fine. During our "progress" of 10 tries ish we'd be OoM at last phase, but at our kill I had so much leftover mana I just went full yolo heal mode at the end just to dry myself to 0 mana before the boss actually dies.

We had our ranged just stack up and continuously move as a group. One ranged guy would be marked and we'd basically follow him. We never detonated traps, ever. The boss was mostly in the middle. The raid moved according to the tank debuff that roots.

[Kaiarra]

I just wanted to chime in here since it seems a very real possibility. You know Butcher always enrages when he hits below 30%, it's like part of his mechanics and doesn't matter what DPS you do. If you mean he beserked at 25% then I wouldn't bother trying to do either boss

As in he massacres us all horribly because we take over 5 min to kill him, not the frenzy he gets below 30% hp... going by peoples replies I will tell my DPS to sort their shit out for next week if they want to make any progress. :P

[Skarzog]

My guild managed to clean up the first 6 heroic bosses in at most 1-3 pulls each. Normal mode Imperator took us I believe 10 pulls. And we spent all night working on heroic, hopefully we will get him today. Like most people here I find the bosses rank Normal<Heroic<Normal Imp<Heroic Imp. That just does not seem correct to me whether he is an end boss or not.

I think the mechanics are fine. Your raid should be punished if people step in mines or don't handle the brand correctly. I think the adds have probably too much health in that fight. In particular killing the Warmages takes so long, and this is coming from a group that 1 shot Heroic Butcher with socials/friends in the group barely in heroic dungeon gear.

I think the fight is fine, the only issue is it feels like the add health pools are a bit too large.