Mythic Kargath Bladefist

[Sanji]

Hi

Last night we were progressing on Kargath. However we ran across some issues we could not solve. I'm hoping that some of you were able to give me some insight regarding some of these issues. We'll be going for him tonight once more.

I currently do not have the logs so i can't post any at the moment.

First our raid role composition. Keep in mind that this is going to be our raid composition for tonight, this is different from yesterday).
2 Tanks (Druid - Paladin)
5 Healers ( 2x Druid, Priest, Paladin and Shaman)
5 Melee DPS (2x Fury Warriors, Rogue, 2x Death Knight)
8 Ranged DPS (2x Frost Mage, 3x Hunter, Balance Druid, Shadow Priest, Elemental Shaman)

---

Our stand group would be as followed: 1 Tank, 1 Resto Druid, 1 Warrior, 1 Hunter, 1 Frost Mage.
We would mass pull everything to the end of one side, AoE them down and jump down. Although this is a little tricky sometimes because of the slow. Last night our prot warrior just couldnt do this without stampeding roar. Tonight we'll have 2x stampeding roar up there (First by the Gaurdian Tank himself and then by the Resto druid if needed).

On the platform, we try to take the full duration of the first two beserker rush with HoP, Immunities etc. This is mainly to help the stand group in killing the adds swiftly.

Platform group is pretty much, avoid all possible shit you can avoid and after the first two beseker rush, we kite the boss immediatly into the Fire Pillar if Beseker Rush. Regarding the cats, we nuke them down with only ranged DPS on em. We kite them as often as we can into the Fire.

We try to rotate CDs on the background every now and then as the fight is pretty stable in terms of damage taken if everyone avoids as often as they can.

The biggest problem is though that we are losing out on a lot of Croud favor. The amount we get from the stands is already gone by the time we go up to the stands again. I'm not sure how we are losing so much. Could it be because that we did clear the whole stands (instead just cleared half of it).

Are we doing something fundamentally wrong or do we just need more practice? We were also thinking of keeping up the cat until the next cat comes up to reduce the rate we lose croud favor as we get 10% each time the cat is set on fire.

Thanks in advance.

[Pur1tas]

Hi

Last night we were progressing on Kargath. However we ran across some issues we could not solve. I'm hoping that some of you were able to give me some insight regarding some of these issues. We'll be going for him tonight once more.

I currently do not have the logs so i can't post any at the moment.

First our raid role composition. Keep in mind that this is going to be our raid composition for tonight, this is different from yesterday).
2 Tanks (Druid - Paladin)
5 Healers ( 2x Druid, Priest, Paladin and Shaman)
5 Melee DPS (2x Fury Warriors, Rogue, 2x Death Knight)
8 Ranged DPS (2x Frost Mage, 3x Hunter, Balance Druid, Shadow Priest, Elemental Shaman)

---

Our stand group would be as followed: 1 Tank, 1 Resto Druid, 1 Warrior, 1 Hunter, 1 Frost Mage.
We would mass pull everything to the end of one side, AoE them down and jump down. Although this is a little tricky sometimes because of the slow. Last night our prot warrior just couldnt do this without stampeding roar. Tonight we'll have 2x stampeding roar up there (First by the Gaurdian Tank himself and then by the Resto druid if needed).

On the platform, we try to take the full duration of the first two beserker rush with HoP, Immunities etc. This is mainly to help the stand group in killing the adds swiftly.

Platform group is pretty much, avoid all possible shit you can avoid and after the first two beseker rush, we kite the boss immediatly into the Fire Pillar if Beseker Rush. Regarding the cats, we nuke them down with only ranged DPS on em. We kite them as often as we can into the Fire.

We try to rotate CDs on the background every now and then as the fight is pretty stable in terms of damage taken if everyone avoids as often as they can.

The biggest problem is though that we are losing out on a lot of Croud favor. The amount we get from the stands is already gone by the time we go up to the stands again. I'm not sure how we are losing so much. Could it be because that we did clear the whole stands (instead just cleared half of it).

Are we doing something fundamentally wrong or do we just need more practice? We were also thinking of keeping up the cat until the next cat comes up to reduce the rate we lose croud favor as we get 10% each time the cat is set on fire.

Thanks in advance.

So for the improvement you are suggesting for the cat it would make it even worse if I don't missunderstand. You should kill the cat as fast as possible to minimize the number of times you set the cat on fire. In addition I would suggest putting the balance druid into the ranks as he can just pull almost the whole thing with starfall and has a lot less time needed to ramp up his aoe in comparrisson to a frost mage.

We are progressing on kargath at the moment and we did not have huge issues with crowd favor (we were at like around 60 most of the time). The problem for us really seems to be that:
1. The cat lives forever. Like srsly 4-5 times set on fire and it is still living I have no clue why as I am a healer
2. People die cause of stupid shit like getting hit by fire zones or walking into pillars, getting knocked into pillars. Just stuff that is easy to doge
3. Pillars despawning right as we are about to kite a cat or kargath into it.

I do not suggest to expect more than the 50% buff for favor to be up for a long time as if there are the favor reducers in the crowd you will loose a lot of it. If you get the 50% buff going for some time between two rank phases I think this is about it considering on how chaotic the fight might become and how little extra favor you will gain from kiting kargath during the later phases.

Last but not least I have to mention again on how important it is to kill the cat as fast as possible in order to minimize lost favor and avoid people needing to kite it and essentially do nothing for long phases during the encounter.

PS: I got a question on how well people doge abilities in your raid? do you think you need 5 healers? We played with 5 and as a shaman I feel utterly useless in this fight, especially as there should be almost no incomming dmg except in the ranks and even there it should be minimal.

[Lifire]

Stand Group:

Any Tank (I prefer Paladin for double-freedom and moving consecration + Seraphim/Hammer)
2x Warrior (Good short-duration damage and mobility)
1x DK (Good short-duration damage, backup grip if unable to gather, good mobility)
1x Resto Druid

The idea up top is to clear as much as possible until you get knocked down by the running dude (w/e his name is) or if you cannot handle the damage in case you all took bomb damage etc.

Bombers drop the bombs and you get slowed so what you want to do is continuously move especially as mobs are dieing, use roar/freedoms only if needed (its good for the tank so he can keep chain pulling)

Keep ranged down, better damage, good immunities for kiting (Deter/IceBlock) and damage on the cat

Berserker Rush

We had 2 paladins so we bopped the first 2-3 (whenever I was down I bopped) and then just instant kited them into the pillars (when no immunities were up) because it wasn't too necessary

Good practice is to be right next to the new pillar so that you have less pilllars up throughout the fight and also, allowing melee to hit the boss

Cat

Kill it immediately by kiting it into fire, don't wait - no need and it's a pointlessly annoying mechanic. Keep in mind it also fixates on melee

Dealing with Favor

- If you are losing a lot of Favor it's commonly due to people standing in every bomb possible, fixed by shaping up individual raid awareness (and of course clearing a lot of mobs in the stands so there is less movement needed for a while)
- Try and clear 1 1/2 to 2 full sides up top so that you get a huge chunk of favor
- During Rush if he ever dies it's an unnecessary risk, just kite into the pillar 2-3seconds before the immunity runs out for safety

-----------------------

Overall it's the first boss with a few forgiving aspects, healing cooldowns should be completely on the fly and used as required since all damage in the fight is controllable/personal.

Hope I gave you some tips, check out some kill POV's it always helps to see different guilds do the fight different ways

[Deleted]

Hi,

I would send the Moonkin + the two warriors to the stands; ravager + dragon roar + bladestorm + starfall just murders the grunts.

Next thing is: 5 Healers is overkill in my opinion. We went there with 4 healers and even that was easily manageable, to the point were I often did not bother to move out of the flame jet in order to increase dps.

Then I have a question: How do you manage to take the full berserker rushes? To my knowledge, and after a short test yesterday Kargath immediately switches targets if you BoP his fixate, or if the fixate uses an immunity? We always kited him immediately into the fire; and even then the dmg was easily enough. Sure; most of the fight the favor was only between 25 and 50; but at the end we were nearly full (97%).

My suggestion would be to maximize your stand-team and avoid stupid mistakes that lead to deaths.

If it helps: The logs of our kill yesterday

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...xD3fba#fight=9

Note the high dps of the people in the stands; One of the warriors died at the beginning; but the other one has 38k dps with only an itemlevel of 640. Maximizing your stand-team should be your priority: -> more grunts killed/less times hit by the engineers/bileslingers -> more favor

- - - Updated - - -

Stand Group:



Berserker Rush

We had 2 paladins so we bopped the first 2-3 (whenever I was down I bopped) and then just instant kited them into the pillars (when no immunities were up) because it wasn't too necessary

Good practice is to be right next to the new pillar so that you have less pilllars up throughout the fight and also, allowing melee to hit the boss

Cat

Kill it immediately by kiting it into fire, don't wait - no need and it's a pointlessly annoying mechanic. Keep in mind it also fixates on melee

Same question to you: Does BoP-ing work and not make him switch targets? I thought that was fixed?

Plus: to my knowledge the cat never fixates melee. At least in our tries it never did.

[Pur1tas]

So the cat did fixate meeles for us but this might be because they were to far away from the boss. Meeles also got fixated by Kargath once just as they came down back from the stands.

I think standing besides the NEW PILLAR might be a problem as if kargath hits it right before a cat might enter there is little time to adjust positioning. So the people getting chased by the cat should position in a way to get the cat into the next pillar while you could kite kargath into the pillar the cat was in first or possibly a 3rd pillar.

[Lifire]

BOPs worked (Wednesday) I don't know if it was fixed recently but in Heroics/Normals I did on alts over the nxt days Thursd/Satuday it worked fine

You can just Detterence/Dispersion/IceBlock etc - I think Bubble resets threat but that is that

Yeah I saw a melee get fixated once too, guess it's a range thing but being the first boss I think people disregard a few things since a first boss is often very forgiving

New pillar strategy is just to reduce fire void zones/pillar annoyance - The cats came so infrequently it was quite redundant and a pilllar was always available

Once we used the BOPs and got to max Favor we bloodlusted (its not ideal, but we didn't care to lust on the pull on a boss like this and used it simply when we had max favor/3minutes up again) - of course BL on the pull is more overall DPS imo as alwys

Once the BOPs ran out or we had only 1 left, we just started kiting into fire immediately - we had max favor and just to remove the annoyance of kiting for melee and we always had a backup BOP just incase

Boomkins are definately a good choice for upstairs along side WW but we found it good with a DK for damage/grip

Either way it's fine, use Warriors DKs Boomkins WW - whoever is smart enough to not get stuck in bombs and rip

[Sanji]

Alright,

Thanks for all swift replies. Greatly appreciated.

First of as recommended we'll try to go with the following stand group instead; Tank (Gaurdian or Protection Pala), Resto druid, Death Knight for Mass Grip, Balance Druid with unglyphed starfall (to help pulling) and Fury Warrior. We wont exclude the option to send in another Fury warrior instead of the Death Knight.

We will also drop a healer to go 4 healing it instead. Also, we will kill the cat immediatly and will hammer more on people not to stand in bad shit. If we have a possibility of soaking the Beserker Rush with Immunity that doesn't restrict movement, we'll do it such as HoP and Deterrance.

We'll also lust on pull instead.

Anything to add/correct?

BTW Is it possible to avoid the Iron bombs?

[CptAwesome]

The way the crowd buff works isn't linear. You get a lot more of it later on in the fight so you shouldn't waste cooldowns on the first 2 rushes, just drop him straight into the fire like you would on normal/heroic mode. On the 3rd rush you can start delaying things to stack the buff, also note that positioning is very important, people need to be prepared for the rush. Have them stand close to the fire when it is coming then you can sit in the immunity until the last second then take two steps to light him up. This is particularly important for mages who can't move while ice blocked. Also note that the favour gain here is not linear either, you gain a lot more of it the longer you can kite him. We had mages use ice block then get HoP, gives a HUGE buff stack and everything else will melt.

Don't be tempted to sprint around with kargath chasing you, that will just get sleepy people killed. You have 4 HoPs, just stand still, use them then drop him in.

Also, for the stands group, you need to be aggressive on using cooldowns up there the first time. It is by far the hardest run because you have none of the crowd buff. If it's becoming an issue, tell them to use their dps potions up there.

It's been mentioned by other people but I will just reiterate; kill the tigers. Kite them into fire immediately and EVERY ranged dps you have should be on them. They don't hurt people if they run through them so if you can kite it over the melee for a few dots and cleaves, that helps but this is mostly a job for the ranged dps. As with the stands, the first is the hardest and people should play accordingly.

Lastly, no you can't avoid the iron bombs. You can only reduce the amount you get by killing bombers in the stands.

[Sanji]

Thanks for the info, i'm sure it will help a bunch. Hope to get a kill tonight.

[PessimiStick]

We wont exclude the option to send in another Fury warrior instead of the Death Knight.

You probably won't need to do that.

Our DK has world #5 on Kargath right now from doing stands, and the top 6 are Balance x3, Unholy x3.

[DakonBlackblade]

Your loosing favor because youre leaving too many of the big mobs alive on the stands, they use a skill that reduces favor by 1% every 5 secs or so, if you dont kill all of them or almost all of them when you go up your favor drains pretty quickly, wich is why trying to gain favor by prolonguing kites is a waste of time on the start of the fight since you loose all your favor in like 10 secs. Actualy never prolongue the kites its a needles hassle, just kite him into the fire straight away, youll get favor from killing mobs in the stand and setting tigers on fire.

Try to get the tiger to go into the fire 3-4 times before killing it, you get a lot of favor from doing that and if your ranged ppl is dotting/doing some damage to the tiger hell die naturaly by the 3rd or 4th fire and youll loose almost no DPS on Kargath himself.

Another thing to understand here is that the favor bar gives you bufs at 25,50,75 or 100 favor, anything in beteween does nothing so a 87% bar bufs your damage just as much as a 75% one, so dont save cds and stuf waiting the bar to grow a little bit more if its not gona go up to the next tier of buf.

[Eetabee]

I would be careful with immunities. We did it last Thursday and we tried ice block, deter and hop and all of them reset the rush to a new target (according to them, I was in stands 75% of the fight so I wasn't paying attention to rushes). It's not needed anyway. Just tell all your members to stay alive while killing the right targets and you'll win. If people try to be kite heroes and it kills them, grats on zero favor.

[sexybeast]

I would be careful with immunities. We did it last Thursday and we tried ice block, deter and hop and all of them reset the rush to a new target (according to them, I was in stands 75% of the fight so I wasn't paying attention to rushes). It's not needed anyway. Just tell all your members to stay alive while killing the right targets and you'll win. If people try to be kite heroes and it kills them, grats on zero favor.

We did it on Thursday and had no issues with HoPs resetting at all

[Wilderness]

I can't confirm if immunities still work or not, but we did it last night without using them. It didn't feel like there was a need to - if someone was able to take a little longer kite path to the fire then great, but mostly we just kited him straight in, and did not keep up other fire pillars when it wasn't going to be necessary to kite his charge into it. You do need to make sure your ranged are on the ball with the cats, because they have a decent chunk of health so they have to be killed as quickly as you can.

It sounds like you'll be changing up the group you send into the stands, which was the first thing that jumped out at me when I read the OP. We did it with 2 warriors and a DK, but I can see how nice a boomkin would be up there as well. The grip helps, so your warrior/dk/boomkin should do very well.

We 4-healed it, and I don't think you need 5. Its a fight that is about personal awareness, trying to avoid damage as much as you can, and focusing on your priorities. The other thing is just make sure that your 5 people who are getting tossed into the stands stack on top of each other on top of the boss so that the rest of your melee can continue to dps during the chain whirl without being accidentally too close. Don't let them hang back and lose uptime on the boss because of that.

[Kantalope]

We noticed that clearing out the stands with a DK and moonkin raised our favor more than anything, and I'm not even sure we'll be using immunities going forward as it just isn't worth it for the meager returns. I did notice Kargath resetting on some H/N runs throughout the week, but I'm not sure if it was caused by HoP or deterrence.