Is arcane OP?

[Tobedeleted123]

I've been raiding in arcane for more than a week now and what I noticed is I am ALWAYS like few thousand DPS ahead of any other DPS in my guild. Sure, I do have nice gear compared to them (we haven't cleared heroic yet but I'm 660), but it's not enough to warrant such a difference. They've been saying it's because mage is too strong right now (as 2nd DPS is usually another arcane mage now, but he's a bit lower than me) which might actually seem pretty likely. I have arcane pretty much mastered, but ~8k DPS difference between me and the next non-mage DPS in raid? That gap being so insane makes me really think if arcane is balanced right now. What do you guys think?

[gtfo_my_internets]

8k gap sounds like you're playing with a bunch of bads.

What's your dps?
What's theirs?

Single target or multi?

Logs?


Need more info besides "i'm awesome and i play an arcane mage"


BTW, top single target arcane on heroic butcher is ~31k in 670ish ilvl

As a Ret I pull about 23.5-24k on the butcher in 649 ilvl, and people equally geared or slightly better pull about the same in my group. So if #1 on butcher for arcane mage is only 8k ahead of me in 670, I can't imagine you being 8k ahead of anyone who is above 650 in 660 gear unless they are not performing anywhere close to their potential.

[Stingray]

Arcane's balanced just fine for Mythic, where lots of movement is required. But normal mode, or earlier heroic bosses? Yeah, you should probably be beating most other classes/specs.

[Bryntrollian]

Arcane is in a decent spot but not necessarily op.


Do you have any logs to make a proper comparison ?

[Stingray]

BTW, top single target arcane on heroic butcher is ~31k in 670ish ilvl

Actually on warcraftlogs, the top arcane mage on heroic butcher atm is 36.9K (he's also #1 overall among all classes/specs). ilvl was 667.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

And by the way, the OP is Nyozu in these logs:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

[Deleted]

8k gap is more likely both gear and skill difference. Weapon is also huge difference in the dps. For comparison my upgrading my weapon from 630 staff to 670 wand+665 offhand yellded me aroudn 6k dps increase. Trinkets are also another very powerful slot.
But for the moment is normal to outperform some people with 8k dps. I will not be hubmle but yesterday i did 35k on butcher with 663 ilvl while another mage in my guild did 25k. I know he is good mage, i taught him myself, but he is wildly undergeared compared to me like 645ish (and he is frost huehuehue)

[Tobedeleted123]

8k gap is more likely both gear and skill difference. Weapon is also huge difference in the dps. For comparison my upgrading my weapon from 630 staff to 670 wand+665 offhand yellded me aroudn 6k dps increase. Trinkets are also another very powerful slot.
But for the moment is normal to outperform some people with 8k dps. I will not be hubmle but yesterday i did 35k on butcher with 663 ilvl while another mage in my guild did 25k. I know he is good mage, i taught him myself, but he is wildly undergeared compared to me like 645ish (and he is frost huehuehue)

Yeah don't you think 35k is a bit too much for 663ilvl? I've never seen any other spec do that kind of damage with this gear. That's why I'm wondering if arcane is OP right now or just really strong for fights like butcher, kargath and brackenspore and people should deal with it.

And yeah the logs linked by Stringray are mine.

[Stingray]

Brackenspore is just a special case since you can get Rejuvenating Spores which give extra mana regen (in addition to the haste that obviously everyone benefits from), and Arcane is the only DPS class that benefits from extra mana regen.

Balance-wise, Arcane really should be #1 (and I think it is) in standing-still, single-target fights, since that's about the only thing it excels at. You certainly won't be standing still in Mythic Kargath, though.

Don't think your issue is purely one of balance to begin with, though. You're just playing better and/or geared better than most everyone else in that raid. Look at the rankings to confirm.

[unbound]

I've been raiding in arcane for more than a week now and what I noticed is I am ALWAYS like few thousand DPS ahead of any other DPS in my guild. Sure, I do have nice gear compared to them (we haven't cleared heroic yet but I'm 660), but it's not enough to warrant such a difference. They've been saying it's because mage is too strong right now (as 2nd DPS is usually another arcane mage now, but he's a bit lower than me) which might actually seem pretty likely. I have arcane pretty much mastered, but ~8k DPS difference between me and the next non-mage DPS in raid? That gap being so insane makes me really think if arcane is balanced right now. What do you guys think?

Basically, you are pulling a great rotation (i.e. doing your job very well). The rest of your raid is pulling typical / average damage. So, in this case, less about the spec and more about the player...good job.

[NPI]

@Stingray: The only classes who can beat arcane mage in mythic Kargath are the ones who are thrown up so they can AOE. You have to move but not that much. Just don't stand too far away from boss, so he won't choose you.

[Stingray]

@Stingray: The only classes who can beat arcane mage in mythic Kargath are the ones who are thrown up so they can AOE. You have to move but not that much. Just don't stand too far away from boss, so he won't choose you.

Choose you for what? The movement is primarily due to Flame Gout, which doesn't even come from the boss, it comes from the pillars.

Besides that, on warcraftlogs.com there's frost mages who never touched a single add that are higher DPS than the highest arcane mage.

[Anzen]

> Asks if Mages are OP in the Mage forum.

I don't know what you expect.

[Deleted]

Why anyone would want to play arcane - It's BORING!

[Anzen]

Why anyone would want to play arcane - It's BORING!

In the words of the once famous Blatty - "Play To Win".

If Arcane is the best DPS, you play Arcane. Being the best DPS is fun for most people.

RIP Blatty xo

[Aggrophobic]

Brackenspore is just a special case since you can get Rejuvenating Spores which give extra mana regen (in addition to the haste that obviously everyone benefits from), and Arcane is the only DPS class that benefits from extra mana regen.

Balance-wise, Arcane really should be #1 (and I think it is) in standing-still, single-target fights, since that's about the only thing it excels at. You certainly won't be standing still in Mythic Kargath, though.

Don't think your issue is purely one of balance to begin with, though. You're just playing better and/or geared better than most everyone else in that raid. Look at the rankings to confirm.

Most caster specs excel at standing still and nothing else. Destro has just as "much" movement for expample.

[Deleted]

Arcane is as boring as Fire and Frost. Just in a different ways.
With arcane your game is slow and hard hitting. With frost is spam-dat-frostbolt/icelance-ohlookFFBproc. With Fire is plsplsplsplscritffs-CRIT-RAWR!-plsplsplsplsplscrit.
All three of them very engaging (/sarcasm).
Arcane just have a lot more control over its recources and its more of a player thing than RNG, while the other 2 specs rely a lot more on RNG for MS/Crit proc to reach its potential.

[Ham on Rye]

And by the way, the OP is Nyozu in these logs:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...pe=damage-done

OP casted Arcane Blast 9 more times and averaging 1,500 more damage per hit than the 2nd mage, and had 27 more Arcane Missiles hits averaging 300 more per hit than the 2nd mage.

[Wilderness]

Choose you for what? The movement is primarily due to Flame Gout, which doesn't even come from the boss, it comes from the pillars.

Besides that, on warcraftlogs.com there's frost mages who never touched a single add that are higher DPS than the highest arcane mage.

Its not at all useful to compare specs based on rankings on a fight that has a damage buff that will not be the same between different kills. If you look at the ranks of both Mythic and Heroic Butcher you see a pretty healthy mix of Arcane and Frost throughout the top ranks.

[Tobedeleted123]

Why anyone would want to play arcane - It's BORING!

For me it's the most entertaining mage spec there is. Fire is MUCH more boring, especially with no AT combo now.