SUB pve

[Twix]

Is it better to dance right at the start of a fight or wait until find weakness debuff is gone then dance?

[Regen]

Wait until find weakness is down. Maximizing dps in sub basically comes down to maximizing find weakness uptime (like waiting until it's fallen off to put it back up) and what you use during it.

[Deafyx]

Many people have talked about in the Simcraft thread, so head over there and check it out.

10 points
slice and dice @9s pull counter
tricks
ambush
rupture
dance + trinkets
ambush
evis
premed
evis

continue shadow dance normally

not refreshing rupture if <2s left on dance when it falls off, instead opting for ambush - arcane torrent ambush

example here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dg4m...ature=youtu.be

Jdance is 6/7 Mythic atm.

[Deleted]

Is there something I dont understand or why is he using S&D at 9 seconds pull timer?
Even if he uses the time to gain CP via HaT he will only get 4 in the best scenario. This would lead to CP capping when using ambush?

[Deleted]

He will gain 3 combo points from HaT and then get 5 after first ambush.

[Bromosapien]

I use a similar opener as Jdance.

SND ~5-6 seconds before pull
Prepot
Ambush
Rupture
Macro:
-Shadow Dance
-Shadow Reflection
-Lucky double-sided coin
Eviscerate
Premeditate
Eviscerate.....

At <2 seconds on FW pool 70+ energy
Vanish
Ambush
Ambush
Eviscerate
Preparation
Continue...

[DakonBlackblade]

If you dance at the start fo fight youll miss the pull cause youre there dancing, dont dance in a fight man take it more seriously

[shaithis]

If you dance at the start fo fight youll miss the pull cause youre there dancing, dont dance in a fight man take it more seriously

What the man said. Also, the answer is yes.

[Deleted]

Dance on opener.

Stealth
SnD
Premed
Ambush
SR
Rupture
Dance

After first dance, use it as normal when it comes off Cd providing FW isn't up

[Deleted]

Can i ask , how is Jdances opener better than actually using the full duration of FW from the first ambush before popping SD?

Don`t get me wrong, i`ve started using the same opener as Jdance, and it definitley seems to increase my opening burst by a margin, but i can`t figure out why.

Is it purely so trinkets line up better if you pop SD that bit earlier?

[Deafyx]

Can i ask , how is Jdances opener better than actually using the full duration of FW from the first ambush before popping SD?

Don`t get me wrong, i`ve started using the same opener as Jdance, and it definitley seems to increase my opening burst by a margin, but i can`t figure out why.

Is it purely so trinkets line up better if you pop SD that bit earlier?

Trinkets/Prepot/Coin etc.

[DakonBlackblade]

What does he mean by Arcane Torrent Ambush ?

[jsz]

What does he mean by Arcane Torrent Ambush ?

Blood Elf Racial

[DakonBlackblade]

Blood Elf Racial

Lol of course, never been a BF I keep forgetting about theyre racials.

[Deleted]

Dance on opener.

Stealth
SnD
Premed
Ambush
SR
Rupture
Dance

After first dance, use it as normal when it comes off Cd providing FW isn't up

He is right. You should use SR before Rupture and Dance after. Don't use the Rotation of that JDance guy. 6/7 is not really hard anymore and i've watched his Stream a few times. He is not a good sub rogue player.

[Tdub90]

I was always under the impression that you don't dance till after the FW from your opening ambush is about to fade. Vanish when the Dance FW fades, premed Vanish when that one does. That's 40 seconds of FW. Your dance will be coming up shortly after the second vanish FW. Why you would ever want to clip FW is beyond me.

[Skarzog]

I was always under the impression that you don't dance till after the FW from your opening ambush is about to fade. Vanish when the Dance FW fades, premed Vanish when that one does. That's 40 seconds of FW. Your dance will be coming up shortly after the second vanish FW. Why you would ever want to clip FW is beyond me.

I think the idea is if you have heroism/lust up, then squeezing in a few more Ambushes/Eviscerates into the short window where your trinket procs and potion are all running at the same time is a bigger damage increase than the few extra seconds of FW.

Without herosim/lust, that's a little harder to call.

[Deleted]

I was always under the impression that you don't dance till after the FW from your opening ambush is about to fade. Vanish when the Dance FW fades, premed Vanish when that one does. That's 40 seconds of FW. Your dance will be coming up shortly after the second vanish FW. Why you would ever want to clip FW is beyond me.

You really need to dance after the second gcd because you want to have your dance with your scales of doom trinket procc which only lasts the first 10 seconds after the opener. You also dont want to delay your first Dance + SR to get the most uptime out of the fight.

[Tdub90]

I think the idea is if you have heroism/lust up, then squeezing in a few more Ambushes/Eviscerates into the short window where your trinket procs and potion are all running at the same time is a bigger damage increase than the few extra seconds of FW.

Without herosim/lust, that's a little harder to call.

You really need to dance after the second gcd because you want to have your dance with your scales of doom trinket procc which only lasts the first 10 seconds after the opener. You also dont want to delay your first Dance + SR to get the most uptime out of the fight.

Yeah that makes sense. So then it's really a matter of priority when you are under the effects of BL/Hero and trinkets vs a regular mid fight CD rotation. First pull going into dance asap vs max FW uptime without clipping.

[Oobers]

Using SD immediately also lets it benefit partially from Master of Subtlety. Only stealth and vanish grant the buff, not SD.