No more HaT proc pre fight?

[Deleted]

I went with

Premed - Ambush - Rupture - Ambush - Snd(3-4pts) - SD+SR+Coin

on the opener tonight. It still does not feel good. Even with heroism, I find myself energy starved for SD. If I wait to pool my energy beforehand I lose out completely on my scales of doom and archmage buff. Nothing I do feels very good for the pull, idk.

Are other people using the same opener? Are you pooling before SD+SR?

This is where we could find going Shadow focus a little more advantageous now over subterfuge as the initial FW buff will be lost due to getting up rupture + SnD just use backstab as your builder. You will have used less energy setting up so should allow you to pop SR+SD+Trinket with a good amount energy and time left on Hero/lust and pre pots?? Can someone confirm this?

[Iuffy]

I have been trying premed-snd-ambush-hemo-dance- rupture with first 5 combo points. Yes this is with subterfuge but i dont feel the need to use the 3rd ambush on the pull now, too energy starved for what comes after. Also not like you would need the extended FW uptime since you are dancing immediately after. Most of the benefit of subterfuge comes from the vanishes anyway, not the opener.

[Deleted]

I have been going

Premed ( wait for 3rd cp, it is like 1 second barely felt) - SnD - Hemo - Ambush x 2 - Rupture - BS until Evis - Refresh SnD - Build Cps for Rupture - SR/Rupture/SD macro continue as normal.

It feels ok. Not sure if it is wrong or anything just what i am doing atm since no more HaT pre combat.

[Garnier Fructis]

Am I the only one that's totally happy with this? I absolutely hated having to rely on healers for 20 seconds while everyone else in the raid is sitting there ready to pull.

[Deleted]

Wait it was totally working for me yesterday, when did this change go live ?

[Deleted]

Wait it was totally working for me yesterday, when did this change go live ?

About 9 server time, I noticed when was on imperator. Wondered why wasn't getting any procs

[Ryme]

Call me the black sheep, but I like it - the constant bitching to my healers to pre heal was getting tiring for both sides. Plus, it was stupid the burst attainable by starting with 10 cps and a near full SnD.

[Mormolyce]

I thought they did that ages ago.

I presume because it's OP in PVP, building CPs while in stealth.

Also because it's kind of awkward incentivising rogues to beg healers for hots to get their CP up OOC. And they WANT you to start fights with no resources.

[Deleted]

Have anyone played around with a new opener, and got decent results?

I tried: Premed > Ambush > SnD > Hemo > Ambush > SR+SD > Rupture

[Deleted]

Just another tiny wincy step towards Sin => Sub

ITs going the right way blizz!

[Jarvid]

Am I the only one that's totally happy with this? I absolutely hated having to rely on healers for 20 seconds while everyone else in the raid is sitting there ready to pull.

No, I'm happy about it as well. Didn't want to bug my healers about it, but not using it while it was available felt like a waste on the other side.
Especially as I'm in a lot of random raids as my guild is somewhat inactive.

[Deleted]

I felt bad about having to constantly ask my healers for it since they didnt remember every fight and i felt like i was just being a nuisance to them. But i guess on the mythic bosses where it mattered they did it so i guess no harm. I guess this will be back in like 2 patches or next xpac

[Noxina]

I went with; Premed about 5 sec before pull - SnD - Ambush - Hemo - BS to 5cp - rupture - SR/SD macro - old rotation.

In the end I feel the dps was somewhat the same, just the burst got really nerfed. But then again, not sure about the dps as it happened right before our first Imperator attempt, so don't have any other tries on the same fight to compare it to.

Will this hit Sub hard, as in - will Assasin be "better" compared to Sub now? I sometimes feel Sub is too much to keep track of, atleast on progress.. Yes I am lazy, and I hate combat. (I play a rogue for daggers, if I wanted to dualwield some big weapons I would go DK or warr!)

- - - Updated - - -

Oh and I agree that removing this was good. Hated to make my raid wait for me to get healers to get enough crit procs so I could get ready..

[Instructor Soki]

What? People don't know how to optimally open without pre-fight CPs?
The Rogue community is slipping.

[Deleted]

I'm going Premed - Garrote - SnD (4pts) then SD makro, ambush to 5 - rupture - normal rotation.
However I think MfD has become a lot more attractive, so you can more or less open as before (5 pts SnD - premed - ambush - HaT proc - rupture -SD).
In both cases I'm trying to waste as little trinket and proc uptime as possible.
Unfortunately MfD is really annoying to use on fights where you can FoK, because you will CP-cap in no time.
Personally I'm not at all ok with this change, it has been like this for quite some time, they even hotfixed the issue where you could not eat OOC, so they must have been well aware of it. And as far as bugging healers goes I had no problem what so ever reminding them with a macro and getting my pre-pull heals. Once I had explained the importance no one was bothered. Might help that I know and play with those guys for years, idk.

[Ryme]

If you're running MfD it will be worth revisiting the old concept of waiting at 4 cps to allow HaT to proc you over to 5. Which is also optimal with some conditions with anticipation, but I would imagine will always be ahead without.

[Oggiva]

I just assumed the healers were giving no fucks as usual, so I used the opener I usually do when I don't have any combo points:

premed+snd -> garrote -> coin/SR/dance/ambush -> ambush -> rupture.

I guess they have just prepared me for this day.

Glad the change is finally here. Been waiting for it for a while.

[Noxina]

A bit unrelated; but when do I use FoK over BS, at 2 or 3 targets? Like every rogue I ask have a different opinion on it..

[Ryme]

Simulation suggests 2 targets, in practise I'm unsure which is probably where you're getting the differing opinions - even in simulation they're close though, I take it as a judgement call.

[badaku]

Am I the only one that's totally happy with this? I absolutely hated having to rely on healers for 20 seconds while everyone else in the raid is sitting there ready to pull.

Same here.. It's a nerf but it's still good news