More constructive / engaging leveling experience?

[Baconeggcheese]

So inspired by http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...0#post31897160 thread that's currently going on, I got to thinking *what could be an alternative to leveling that would really teach you useful things for cap that currently leveling doesn't*. The game is very much a current content game, and the old leveling experience is very dated / neglected and not very constructive for teaching new players the skills they'll need at cap to not be a burden on other players.

So I'm curious what kind of things you guys would like to see either happen to the current leveling experience to bring it up to date, and or alternatives to it that might help teach people the skills they'll need later on.

My initial thought is something that combines proving grounds with the way a boosted character is given select skills in small batches as they quest through the wod starting area.

Maybe have it give you the skills in those batches, and then have little proving ground rounds and you need to be able to get gold with those skills in those scenarios to progress to the next stage where it includes the stuff you previously learned but also adds the next batch of skills on top of it and progressively works each skill into the next round.

Something like that could give a large amount of xp (level in X hours) while simultaneously being very hard / unforgiving, which would give skilled / veteran players a challenging option to somewhat quickly level your characters since you don't really NEED a tutorial anymore, and new players would have this challenging learning tool as an option. Though probably it would be a good idea for you to NEED to have a 100 toon already (which you used your first boost on or your main as a veteran player) and potentially even have the achievement for gold proving grounds to do it on a new toon.

Further they could pull a gw2 and give you the option to down level when going to old zones for questing purposes, and if you do down level increase the rewards for doing those quests in old areas (gold or vanity, maybe the items get boosted to wod leveling quest rewards level and can benefit from the random blue / purple upgrades). This could scale with any level, so that you're no longer in the current situation where you hit level cap for the zone you're in after doing 1 1/2 quest hubs out of the 20 in the zone, and you could actually complete fully zones and quest lines without spending most of your leveling experience traveling.

I dunno those are some ideas I just pulled out of my ass real quick, what ideas do you guys think they could do to improve old content and make the leveling experience more constructive?

[Deleted]

I think you will never completely get everyone to like leveling and questing, but it shouldn't be an excuse to give players the choice to go around the leveling process.

One of the things they can do is to make more zones with more quests again. That way there is more variety. Even I, as someone who really likes leveling and questing, feel, that especially Draenor feels very linear. There are very few quests to begin with in a zone, and you basically always follow the same path. There should be moments, where you can decide, do I go to that zone or to that other zone? Have more zones with more quests, and have zones with individual quests for Alliance and Horde, like it was in TBC and Wrath. That way there is more replayability value. Other than that, just make quests something that attracts players. Players like it when what they are doing matters, especially storywise. Nobody likes to kill 10 wolves all the time. People want to be involved in big events with things that matter on a grand scale. And have lots of variety in the kinds of quests you're doing. I think WoD lacks a lot in that regard. I can't think of too many quests, that were fun to do in WoD. Cataclysm and MoP were much better in that regard.

[Baconeggcheese]

There should be moments, where you can decide, do I go to that zone or to that other zone?

Kinda like in wod, when you pick your outpost which is a major decision for how the zone plays out.

[Aigilas]

I think you will never completely get everyone to like leveling and questing, but it shouldn't be an excuse to give players the choice to go around the leveling process.

One of the things they can do is to make more zones with more quests again. That way there is more variety. Even I, as someone who really likes leveling and questing, feel, that especially Draenor feels very linear. There are very few quests to begin with in a zone, and you basically always follow the same path. There should be moments, where you can decide, do I go to that zone or to that other zone? Have more zones with more quests, and have zones with individual quests for Alliance and Horde, like it was in TBC and Wrath. That way there is more replayability value. Other than that, just make quests something that attracts players. Players like it when what they are doing matters, especially storywise. Nobody likes to kill 10 wolves all the time. People want to be involved in big events with things that matter on a grand scale. And have lots of variety in the kinds of quests you're doing. I think WoD lacks a lot in that regard. I can't think of too many quests, that were fun to do in WoD. Cataclysm and MoP were much better in that regard.

are you not the guy who advocated for free level 90 boosts ........... fairly sure that is just an excuse for people to get around the leveling process

[Sansnom]

I dunno those are some ideas I just pulled out of my ass real quick, what ideas do you guys think they could do to improve old content and make the leveling experience more constructive?

Old content? Nothing can be done. New content? They are already trying. The newer XP in WoW has already introduce "Storyline" quests where the quest is more challenging and more interesting. I think this is an interesting direction.

But the problem is that it does not teach tanking, healing, and how does it support groups? Personally, assuming the main purpose is teach people to play better so they can contribute more in a group, the actual role is not important, the most important thing is awareness.

In a group or a raid, the chances of someone just standing and push buttons is not very likely. People need to move out of bad goo, move into good goo, switching targets, interrupts etc. These can be incorporated and has already has done. There are already special buttons and change in abilities of the characters. So it is already happening. It is not going to happen for every quests but for the main story, it is and I find it quite enjoyable.

[Deleted]

Kinda like in wod, when you pick your outpost which is a major decision for how the zone plays out.

It really isn't a big decision at all. In almost all zones it changes nothing. Only in Gorgrond you get different quests, but it in turn makes Gorgrond such a tiny zone with only so few quests to begin with. And I don't know if players have noticed this, but when you pick one side in Gorgrond, the quests that you miss out on, at least some of them, you'll get as bonus objectives. The same in Talador. Depending on what building you pick in Talador, you get 3 different quests at the beginning. That's it. And you'll always get the other quests as a bonus objective. In Arak, you'll get a short questline that is different, not more than 5 quests or so. And in Nagrand, it changes nothing at all. This is not the same as being able to pick between Nagrand and Blade's Edge, or being able to pick between Shadowmoon or Netherstorm, or being able to pick between Fjord and Tundra, or being able to pick between Icecrown and Storm Peaks.

Icecrown and Storm Peaks were so beautiful. The amount of content these two zones had together. The amount of variety there was in those zones. Compare that to WoD Nagrand. Nagrand doesn't even come close.

- - - Updated - - -

Old content? Nothing can be done. New content? They are already trying. The newer XP in WoW has already introduce "Storyline" quests where the quest is more challenging and more interesting. I think this is an interesting direction.

Wait. How? WoD is the most uninteresting in terms of story. How did the expansions before that not have "storyline" quests. Even Vanilla had that.

[Sierra85]

everyones tastes are different when it comes to leveling.

I hated mop leveling, enjoyed WoD, loved vanilla & tbc, enjoyed WoTLK

theres people who have reverse opinions of mine. Blizz generally do a pretty good job at trying to make everyone happy. So really just do whatever you want and find the best way to level up that suits you.

[Huntermyth]

let's see.

a troll hunter ( main, lvl 100 )

a troll druid ( main alt, lvl 100 )

an orc warlock ( lvl 97 but will stay as 97 for a long time, reasons below )

an undead rogue ( lvl 90 )

a bloodelf dk ( lvl 90 )

a bloodelf paladin ( lvl 90 )

a human paladin ( lvl 90, double agent tool )

first days of wod was extremely good in terms of leveling ( not considering the unstable servers etc ) because everything was new and storyline was great so i had no boredom or complaints when i was leveling my main. druid, almost the same. changed all the outpost choices and it was really interesting to see the alternate ways of leveling. add some ashran, random bgs, heroic dungeons, lfr / normal raids ( don't have much time anymore due to real life issues ) and everything is set. but after that ?

tried to level my lock but i could not stand the gorgrond quests. frostfire is ok though, can't complain. anyway, waited for a massive rested bonus and passed gorgrond as fast as possible. then talador. omg, i couldn't stand questing at talador either ! i was blaming myself because when i could log in in a very very limited time in those 2-3 days a week, it looked like i was wasting time trying to level my lock out there.

then i decided to ( at least ) finish the entry quests to draenor on all my alts ( ok maybe not my human paladin but why not if i enjoyed leveling ) so they could stockpile garrison resources and do some casual missions. you know what ? i could barely get my rogue to his garrison and i was overwhelmed already, i couldn't even imagine to get olin umberhide !

tl;dr : i can't level any of my toons because of dull quests. anyone else out there like me ? many alts waiting at 90 ?

[Sansnom]

Wait. How? WoD is the most uninteresting in terms of story.

I was expecting people to say MoP took that category. Jokes aside, it is personal. Of all the story quests I did, I liked WoTLK the most and Cata the least. I really did not bother with the whole Deathwing thing.

I think WoD is good. Have not done the Horde side so cannot say how they did. I do think they could have done something better. Garrosh for example.

How did the expansions before that not have "storyline" quests. Even Vanilla had that.

They all did. But which each one, Blizzard did something new that make it a bit more interesting.

WoTLK, the Wrathgate was interesting. Nothing like that happened before. It was the start of the Phasing tech they developed.

Now, I feel more of the main story line quests is getting close to include solo dungeons. Again this is a combination of the phasing and scenarios. Again this was not possible in the past. It allows for "dramatic events" to be incorporated, like cities on fire, world changing to reflect the progress of the story.

I suppose it is like watching a movie in the cinema or at home. In the cinema, you watch the movie at the same place as everyone. If you was late, or visit the bathroom, you missed it. Too bad.

At home, everyone watches at the own progress.

So I think Blizzard is working in the direction where part of the world changes according to the person's own progress but eventually everyone comes to the same ending.

[Baconeggcheese]

Every time I make a thread I'm reminded that people don't read the OP if its more than 1 sentence long.

[Kokolums]

I started a thread about 3 weeks ago describing how I would turn leveling into its own progression path.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-3rd-of-an-MMO