Raid lootsystem

[Deleted]

Hello my fellow MMO-Champion folks,

my guild is deciding wether we should change our lootsystem. Currently we use RCLootcouncil. Our officers decide wether a person gets an item or not and people can click 'BiS'/'Major Upgrade'/'Minor Upgrade'/'OS'. We, as officers, see their current item level on that specific slot and we have the stat priority in front of us. This worked out very well till about 2 weeks ago, then RCLootCouncil started bugging out and I was the only one who could see the loot and the other officers were unable to see it.

Because of this, we are thinking about changing our lootsystem to DKP. Any thoughts about the positive and negative sides of using this method? I'm quiet unfamiliar with it :S.

Things I came up with:
Positive points:
- Attendance gets rewarded
- Personal failure gets punished (-DKP)

Downsides:
- Stimulating of individual gearing, instead of gearing up as a team.
- People might save their points for sockets/WF instead of jsut good upgrades.
- Loot doesn't go to the person who needs it the most, but to the one who is willing/able to pay the most of the raid.

Any thoughts about this? Any thoughts about other (perhaps not mentioned by me?) lootsystems?

[Deleted]

If you've used Loot Council so far and people have been fine with that, I think you should stick with it, you don't need an addon for it since you can do those things manually.

[Purple Spy]

Ive always preferred a good loot council without any extra systems or addons, but its rare to find a highly competent loot council who knows every class and a raid who is willing to follow their lead (giving agility weapons to the melee dps over the hunters in BC? Might seem weird at first, but Shivering felspine was BiS until kj for ret and arms, so our LC was giving them to us, and the raid was fine with it)

Honestly i think what works best for most is to just have ms/os rolls, with a sort of loot council that can veto and say things like, youre just getting a socket out of this, but its a 20 ilvl upgrade for this guy, so were gonna give it to him (side note, i despise the warforge/socket system they have now)

[Karumai]

We've always had PM with MS/OS since WoD. Never had problems, not even in PUGs.

Of course we do debate a little if the it's a major upgrade to one and only a minor to the other, but that's about it.

[Deleted]

Thanks for the input so far ! I like the LootCouncil myself too, but the other officers seem to like DKP more, but I do not see the value over a good LootCouncil. Perhaps there are some DKP enthusiasts out there who can list benefits ?

[lordsphinx]

edit: TL;DR- Biggest benefit of DKP over loot council is drama. It's inevitable that Bob is gonna get butthurt that Joe got that M WF socketed BiS trinket. The simple upgrades are never dramatic... it's when something is a HUGE upgrade for two people that gets messy.

We use a modified zerosum DKP system in our guild. The very basics (starting with a base 100 DKP per player @ start of xpack):

- + 5 DKP for being on time to raid
- + 5 Bonus DKP for being early
- - 10 DKP for being late
- -50% DKP for not showing
- All items are bid (no fixed prices)
- All wins are then redistributed to the raid (zerosum)
- -10% Decay at the end of the night

Pros:
- Reward Attendance / Punish poor attendance
- Even gearing
- Very cut-and-dry. No drama.

Cons:
- More complicated than Lootcouncil
- Weird circumstances come up that need handling (2 of the same item fall off the boss. Can you charge two people different amounts for the same thing? What about dual wield 1 handed weapons?)
- Someone changing mains @ raid leader request gets messy. If they keep their DKP, then they are suddenly thrown into a different loot pool (leather vs mail). If they don’t keep it, they’re less likely to accept the forced change.

At the end of the day, if we had a consistent group that was moving from MoP to WoD, then we would be using loot council. As it is, we recruited hard to get up to the number needed for mythic, and had more new people than existing raiders. This would have made loot council a drama fest, so we went with DKP. All in all, no drama to speak of, but it can get very complicated.

[Deleted]

There is no benefit in DKP! If you already use a lootcouncil, keep doing it. If your addon bugs, delete the addon.

This is how we do it:

When loot drops, everybody who wants the item posts what he is currently wearing in that slot and wants to replace. Officers discuss in a seperate chatchannel, considering Itemlevel-boost, value of the sec. stats for the classes/specs, performance/attendance and only when in doubt: number of items already gotten.

DKP systems lead to lots of disenchanted items that would have been a (minor) upgrade, because people try to save points for their BIS stuff. This hurts the raid as whole!

The only advantage of DKP is that nobody can cry about loot-distribution. It's the lazy way and holds your raid back.

[Deleted]

Once again thanks alot for all the input. We will discuss about it with your input =)!