Why was mythic highmaul so hard compared to mythic SoO?

[L3fty]

You also really need to take into account that Highmaul is HALF the size of SoO. That is quite a huge difference in terms of ramping up difficulty gradually.

Personally I don't think Highmaul mythic is much harder than HC* SoO (pre nerf) was. Bosses like Norushen and Nazgrim are the equivalent of Karg at/Twins. The difference being instead of slightly more difficult but not crippling fights like Galakras/Shamans, in Highmaul you are instantly hit with a Malkorok equivalent with Bracken/Tectus.

I haven't seen Koragh or Imp Mythic, but a smart bet would be that hey are not far from Siege crafter and Garrosh. I think guys saying Mythic is considerably harder are not really analysing the full picture.

[birdyy]

He means Heroic SoO in 5.4 thats why he said oct 2013...

[Buildapanda]

You also really need to take into account that Highmaul is HALF the size of SoO. That is quite a huge difference in terms of ramping up difficulty gradually.

Personally I don't think Highmaul mythic is much harder than GO SoO (pre nerf) was. Bosses like Norushen and Nazgrim are the equivalent of Karg at/Twins. The difference being instead of slightly more difficult but not crippling fights like Galakras/Shamans, in Highmaul you are instantly hit with a Malkorok equivalent with Bracjen/Tectus.

I haven't seen Koragh or Imp Mythic, but a smart bet would be that hey are not far from Siege crafter and Garrosh. I think guys saying Mythic is considerably harder are not really analysing the full picture.

But how is that fair? The reason SoO was much easier was because we had the 8 bosses on mythic to farm every week. With Highmaul? Where exactly are we supposed to get the mythic gear to down the bosses?

He means Heroic SoO in 5.4 thats why he said oct 2013...

yeah lol, not sure if stupid or ld

[Snuzzfizzle]

I haven't seen Koragh or Imp Mythic, but a smart bet would be that hey are not far from Siege crafter and Garrosh. I think guys saying Mythic is considerably harder are not really analysing the full picture.

Blackfuse and Garrosh were both much harder than anything in Highmaul Mythic, especially on 10m Heroic.

[Raxxed]

You also really need to take into account that Highmaul is HALF the size of SoO. That is quite a huge difference in terms of ramping up difficulty gradually.

Personally I don't think Highmaul mythic is much harder than GO SoO (pre nerf) was. Bosses like Norushen and Nazgrim are the equivalent of Karg at/Twins. The difference being instead of slightly more difficult but not crippling fights like Galakras/Shamans, in Highmaul you are instantly hit with a Malkorok equivalent with Bracjen/Tectus.

I haven't seen Koragh or Imp Mythic, but a smart bet would be that hey are not far from Siege crafter and Garrosh. I think guys saying Mythic is considerably harder are not really analysing the full picture.

Heroic SOO and Mythic SOO are completely different.

Heroic was tuned the as top difficulty, and comparitive to Mythic Highmaul. (as it should be)
Mythic SOO on the other hand was tuned incredibly leniently.

[Tradu]

But how is that fair? The reason SoO was much easier was because we had the 8 bosses on mythic to farm every week. With Highmaul? Where exactly are we supposed to get the mythic gear to down the bosses? yeah lol, not sure if stupid or ld

Garrison missions and super fun time RNGesus better versions of your current items.

[Makabreska]

But how is that fair? The reason SoO was much easier was because we had the 8 bosses on mythic to farm every week. With Highmaul? Where exactly are we supposed to get the mythic gear to down the bosses?

Nowhere. It has been always like this, first raid of the expansion may be the most difficult due to be wearing mostly blues from the dungeons. After that the ilvl difference in later raids is much lower.

Also Mythic SoO was kinda misleading. Mythic was supposed to be THE hardest difficulty but in that case it was nerfed to the ground so everyone could down Garrosh before WoD.

[Buildapanda]

Heroic SOO and Mythic SOO are completely different.

Heroic was tuned the as top difficulty, and comparitive to Mythic Highmaul. (as it should be)
Mythic SOO on the other hand was tuned incredibly leniently.

huh? Why would any sane/person with a shred of intelligence assume I'm comparing the difficulty of a raid from a past expansion in a current expansion.
I'm talking about 5.4 mythic non upgradable SoO

- - - Updated - - -

huh? Why would any sane/person with a shred of intelligence assume I'm comparing the difficulty of a raid from a past expansion in a current expansion.
I'm talking about 5.4 mythic non upgradable SoO

Nowhere. It has been always like this, first raid of the expansion may be the most difficult due to be wearing mostly blues from the dungeons. After that the ilvl difference in later raids is much lower.

That could be a reason, Wod is my first time playing at the beginning of an expansion, my first time raiding mythic was SoO.

[Tojara]

I'd say prior 5.4 SoO is harder than Mythic HM, but not by a whole lot. There were bosses in Highmaul that fit the difficulty curve of pretty much everything in SoO (remember, the first 8 in SoO had a pretty flat curve).

The only reason why I'd say that SoO is harder is because of the volume of bosses and the amount of truly difficult bosses. I raided 10 man in SoO, and honestly, there were only 2 truly difficult bosses for 10 man guilds in SoO, Siegecrafter and Garrosh. I assume for 25 mans it was Paragons and Garrosh. The only boss in Highmaul that compares to those 3 bosses in Imperator is my opinion, but he is every bit as difficult as one of those bosses were.

Obviously for the best of the best guilds this is a bit different. Butcher isn't a hard boss, just an extreme gear check and Ko'ragh is certainly Thok/Paragon levels of difficult for 10 man guilds.

It's just hard to compare. Again, personally I think Imperator is just as hard as Garrosh/Siegecrafter were for us, but SoO just took way longer to progress through because there were multiple bosses that hard and just way more bosses. If BRF has at least 2 Imperator level bosses, then it will without a doubt be harder than SoO in my opinion.

[Deleted]

They were, but the point was that in that conversion from old heroic to mythic Blizzard didn't put a lot of effort in tuning the bosses as tightly as possible as they did at 5.4 launch.
Add to that the item squish, item upgrades and mechanics that everyone is able to handle in their sleep after almost a year and you are left with an easier encounter

Now if you are talking about the difference in difficulty between 'old heroic 10/25' and new Highmaul Mythic, that could be explained by the 10 and 25 player brackets that made it impossible for blizzard to tune them very tightly.

[L3fty]

This is confusing. Mythic SoO was NOT the equivalent of Mythic HM because it was nerfed to the ground. That's the answer to that angle on the thread. It was nerfed to shit.

PRE NERF SoO is equivalent to Mythic HM in difficulty. How that is fair is not really something I can answer, the design team choose the number of bosses. I really think that is the biggest reason in people feeling it's more difficult than pre nerf heroic SoO.

I'd actually go as far to say Mythic Kargath and twins are easier than any SoO HC apart from perhaps Norushen.

[Deleted]

huh? Why would any sane/person with a shred of intelligence assume I'm comparing the difficulty of a raid from a past expansion in a current expansion.
I'm talking about 5.4 mythic non upgradable SoO

What in the world
but what
why

Mythic = 6.0
Heroic = 5.4
You cannot say 5.4 mythic, it does not exist. Achievement names changing from [Heroic: Garrosh Hellscream] to [Mythic: Garrosh Hellscream] are just for Blizzard's own convenience.

[Deleted]

Blackfuse and Garrosh were both much harder than anything in Highmaul Mythic, especially on 10m Heroic.

No, just no. Mythic Imp is much harder than both those bosses. I only did 10m hc (before it became mythic) in SoO and we've never wiped on any boss the way we are on mythic Imp.

[Deleted]

Because stat squished or "mythic" SoO wasnt tuned the way mythic HM is, I dont understand why you have so much trouble understanding that?

SoO had been out for a long time and had multiple nerfs already on top of item upgrades, and the stat squish + "mythic" addition wasnt tuned around SoO to begin with.

[Buildapanda]

This is confusing. Mythic SoO was NOT the equivalent of Mythic HM because it was nerfed to the ground. That's the answer to that angle on the thread. It was nerfed to shit.

PRE NERF SoO is equivalent to Mythic HM in difficulty. How that is fair is not really something I can answer, the design team choose the number of bosses. I really think that is the biggest reason in people feeling it's more difficult than pre nerf heroic SoO.

I'd actually go as far to say Mythic Kargath and twins are easier than any SoO HC apart from perhaps Norushen.

Mythic is the new name for heroic mode, any past reference to a heroic encounter should be called mythic, because well, all achievements say i did it on mythic.

I don't understand how it's confusing? Here have a look at this chart if you're confused.

[Tojara]

Kargath is probably the easiest entry boss they ever did for a hard mode that I can think of in recent memory. I'd still say Twin Ogron on Mythic is equal to pretty much any of the first 8 bosses in difficulty from my 10m heroic experience prior to the 6.0 patch. You just had to do 7-8 Twin Ogron Mythic level bosses in SoO before the difficulty actually stepped up some.

Tectus/Brackenspore were a lot like Spoils/Malkorok, Ko'ragh was your Thok (for 10 man anyway), and Imperator was your Siegecrafter/Paragons/Garrosh (depending on 10 or 25 man). Butcher is truly incredibly easy with the pool party strategy and the gear required, so I don't know where to actually put him.

[Tradu]

Mythic is the new name for heroic mode, any past reference to a heroic encounter should be called mythic, because well, all achievements say mythic.

I don't understand how it's confusing? Here have a look at this chart if you're confused.

[IMG]http://www.wowjuju.com/uploads/gallery/category_16/gallery_2_16_58657.jpg[IMG]

It wasn't called Mythic when we killed it, so no, it's not Mythic. Do you talk about killing Spine of Deathwing Mythic as well? Lich King Mythic? At the time they were Heroic, so that's what they're called. Just because Blizzard changes the raid difficulty names later doesn't mean we have to use the new names for things that happened before the names were changed.

[L3fty]

It's confusing because you are not being clear on what version of SoO you are referring to. I don't need a chart thanks.

Can you answer clearly - is this about PRE NERF SoO or POST NERF SoO?

This could be an interesting thread if you knew wtf you were asking about.

[Buildapanda]

It wasn't called Mythic when we killed it, so no, it's not Mythic. Do you talk about killing Spine of Deathwing Mythic as well? Lich King Mythic? At the time they were Heroic, so that's what they're called. Just because Blizzard changes the raid difficulty names later doesn't mean we have to use the new names for things that happened before the names were changed.

You're just flat out wrong.

http://www.wowhead.com/achievements?filter=na=mythic

SoO is the only legacy raid to have mythic labeling.

It's confusing because you are not being clear on what version of SoO you are referring to. I don't need a chart thanks.

Can you answer clearly - is this about PRE NERF SoO or POST NERF SoO?

This could be an interesting thread if you knew wtf you were asking about.

I gave plenty of info in my op to answer the question, was 5.4.8 released in oct 2013? 6.0? How could I have been raiding with the extra upgrades and pre expansion patch in oct 2013.

[Tradu]

You're just flat out wrong.

http://www.wowhead.com/achievements?filter=na=mythic

SoO is the only legacy raid to have mythic labeling.

I never said the others had their achievements relabeled. But Heroic got renamed to Mythic, right? So the WotLK/Cataclysm Heroic stuff would be Mythic as well, right? And there is a very clear distinction between SoO Heroic and SoO Mythic. SoO Heroic = highest difficulty version of SoO in 5.4, SoO Mythic = nerfed to shit highest difficulty of SoO in 6.0.