Feeling forced into demo

[Jessicka]

I've played Aff since BC. I still play Aff and in HM as well as BRF I've been 90+ percentile on every fight, up to 96 and 99 on some. I pull top 3 DPS in my raid, and pull way over the DPS of similarly geared Demo and Destro locks. Point being, I think player skill can overcome playing another spec poorly or sub-optimally.

Sometimes they do just tune specs or talents so far apart that you can play one spec like shit and still outperform another played decently. Right now, there are a few classes and especially talents where that's the case; Warlocks are one of them, and SPriest 100 talents take it to extremes.

[Makabreska]

does anyone absolutely despise demonology and would much rather play Affliction/Destruction but feels forced to play the spec they hate anyway, because it just got buffed and now outshines Affliction a lot? Can they please nerf/buff Demonlogy/Affliction?

What about those players that love demo and despise affli like my guildies? You are playing pure DPS class, its only natural that spec strength shifts from patch to patch. Either roll with it or play inferior spec and try to make it work.

[Deleted]

Demo was my first and most loved spec in wow.
And that includes the Cata version.

Yes.

[Deleted]

What about those players that love demo and despise affli like my guildies? You are playing pure DPS class, its only natural that spec strength shifts from patch to patch. Either roll with it or play inferior spec and try to make it work.

technically its more extreme than that atleast it was in HM where you changed specs depending on the encounter.

[Yuna]

Aff is only 3k dps behind demo atm, if you do not raid mythic play whatever you want as long as you play it good.

It´s funny though that you only despise demo for it´s looks and that you might lose your xmog... should be your least concern if you are talking about performance and numbers and being forced to play one spec.

[Deleted]

Demo is best and most fun warlock spec by faar. I agree, cant be wors than be forced into destro.... And who cares about transmog/meta annimation during a boss fight -.-

[Deleted]

Aff is only 3k dps behind demo atm, if you do not raid mythic play whatever you want as long as you play it good.

It´s funny though that you only despise demo for it´s looks and that you might lose your xmog... should be your least concern if you are talking about performance and numbers and being forced to play one spec.

it makes perfect sense, I don't want it to deal more dps because I don't like it

[Deleted]

Demo is more complex than both Destro and Aff combined, hence Demo should be pulling ahead when played right. Why else have complex specs if they aren't rewarding?

[Deleted]

I don't get why people say destro is easy. Sure the base single target rotation is easy but maximizing destro's dps is all about using shadowburn and havoc properly and that takes plenty of skill and planning imo. Otherwise you just suck at destro.

Probably because it was by far the easiest warlock spec back in MOP for the mostpart.

WOD has made affliction easier than it by far imo though, the MOP revamp feels like it was built on DOT snapshotting which, once removed, leaves it with little going on bar haunting in procs, which is similar gameplay to destro but with less control and no havoc or little things like knowing when to hold on to a conflag charge for small movement.
Demo I'm not sure about, demonbolt feels like it simplifies a lot of the complexity demo used to have, you seemed to really need a feel for the spec to min-max fury spending since it was super flexible. I neglected demo after growing to loath it in Cata though, so I never really got deep into it's intricacies - hard to tell how much is difficulty and how much is just plain unfamiliarity.

Destro really doesn't feel much (if at all) less complex than the other two specs these days.

Demo is more complex than both Destro and Aff combined, hence Demo should be pulling ahead when played right. Why else have complex specs if they aren't rewarding?

Because rotation complexity hasn't correlated to damage output in years - complex rotations can be for people who just want an interesting playstyle, not because they want the class to be viable.

SB spam warlockery was strong at the end of TBC, Ret paladins were incredibly strong in ICC when the difference between an optimal and suboptimal rotation was minimal, arcane mages were great in Cata when their rotation was laughable.

Don't get me wrong, it's nice to think you're rewarded for executing a complex rotation with higher output, and you'll certainly psuedo-achieve that since buggering it up will probably be a hefty loss, but it's not a blizzard design choice that complex rotations give more dps, they made that abundantly clear over the years.

[Shadow Fox]

I love being a BM hunter... But SV is just sooo muuuch better in every aspect aside from leveling / solo'ing... >,<!

[Deleted]

Demo is more complex than both Destro and Aff combined, hence Demo should be pulling ahead when played right. Why else have complex specs if they aren't rewarding?

why does arcane mage have the most simulated dps then?

and demo is not as complicated as some demo lovers make it out to be, it's rather simple tbh, harder than the other specs for sure tho

also using your logic a good player should only ever play one spec then from now on?

[PickleballAce]

It wouldn't be so bad if we weren't Life Tapping two or three health bars away for some reason.

[Zevoa]

does anyone absolutely despise demonology and would much rather play Affliction/Destruction but feels forced to play the spec they hate anyway, because it just got buffed and now outshines Affliction a lot? Can they please nerf/buff Demonlogy/Affliction?

Please no please.

[Bluesftw]

Demo is more complex than both Destro and Aff combined, hence Demo should be pulling ahead when played right. Why else have complex specs if they aren't rewarding?

demonology with demonbolt is about as complex as arcane mages in wotlk...

also i'd like to make compeling counterpoint to glyphed demon form wings - if it dosnt fit your transmog , you're transmoging wrong items ^^

[Deleted]

they're purple and I use the challenge mode set, they're no longer green for some reason.. and they still lack proper animations, they're wings for god's sake

[Deleted]

Don't hate it, it's an OK spec. I'm just glad warlocks are decent in brf

[Jessicka]

they're purple and I use the challenge mode set, they're no longer green for some reason.. and they still lack proper animations, they're wings for god's sake

They're purple and I'm using T8.5, they fit perfectly. Now if only ToC didn't use melee swing animation.

The specs, and talents, clearly need better balancing against each other. I don't know why people are opposed to that.

[Deleted]

Demo is more complex than both Destro and Aff combined, hence Demo should be pulling ahead when played right. Why else have complex specs if they aren't rewarding?

that is a gross exaggeration, if you really nitpick the specs, you would see that they arent as different as you make them out to be, infact demo has a lot of similarities with destro, oddly enough it is afflic that is the spec that stands out of all 3 specs. to call demo more complex than destro and afflic combined is like saying it more difficult to pee using your left hand when right handed when all you need to do is "open the floodgates" and you're done.

[Deleted]

Best aspect would be if they all were equally complex, and equally viable, but with different mechanics thus generating 3 more distinct playstyles.

[Deleted]

Best aspect would be if they all were equally complex, and equally viable, but with different mechanics thus generating 3 more distinct playstyles.

I disagree vehemently.
I think there's a great deal of appeal in having variety of complexity. Having a spec as easy as arcane mage was (I have no idea how it is these days), can justify having a john madden feral spec on the class, since anyone who doesn't want that complexity can opt out of it, but it's there if someone wants engaging gameplay.

If you only get one degree of complexity across the class then you run the risk of it being forced to be tuned at a low level since blizzard usually seem to want people to be able to get SOMETHING out of a class, regardless of the players skill level.

Variety in that is pretty vital imo, similar to how LFR is necessary to ensure that Heroic (well, Mythic now) can exist without being tuned incredibly low.

Whether you want to reward players for the extra complexity is another thing. Years ago I'd have said yes, these days I'm not so sure - picking complexity because you like complexity has started growing on me, though minmaxing options to differentiate between a bad, good and great player are a good way of adding that complexity without making the core rotation a complete nightmare, from things like knowing that chaosbolting on CD isn't how you play destruction well, to knowing when to pre-cast havoc to game an extra cast on an add that would otherwise die before it came off CD.

Which isn't to say distinct playstyles aren't important too - I think warlock specs have been creeping a little too close to each other over the course of MOP and WOD, but I don't think variety in complexity is any less important.