Fix For Hearthstone Rush

[dak1]

Raise players health to 40.

It's really the only thing that's going to fix zerg at this point as there's just too many cards that would have to be adjusted otherwise.

Maybe some people enjoy 4th turn game over zergs, but it seems to take a lot of the skill out of the game.

[May90]

One of the appealing features of Hearthstone to many people is that the games are quick, so you can, say, play a couple of games in your break in the afternoon. Making games longer will likely make them more strategic, but also repel the people interested in fast and unpredictable games.

Also, I've yet to see a single rushing deck that can't be easily held with a proper deck. While there are definitely cheesy games out there, ultimately a well built deck will grant you an advantage over a rusher relying only on your unlucky draft.

[Super Kami Dende]

Sounds like someones never played Card Games before.

Rush decks are in every Card game pretty much ever. Do you know the best way to stop rush decks? You make decks that beat rush decks and play them when everyone else is playing Rush decks.

[Mormolyce]

I've often thought about this, but not only would it really disrupt the meta it might still not be enough to stop rush decks. If you can't clear the board an extra 10 HP won't save you. I think the game needs a bit more AoE and certain cards need to be adjusted.

Sounds like someones never played Card Games before.

Rush decks are in every Card game pretty much ever. Do you know the best way to stop rush decks? You make decks that beat rush decks and play them when everyone else is playing Rush decks.

Or nerf 'em.

Most of the major nerfs so far have been aimed at rush and rush-enabling cards, like Leeroy, buzzard and undertaker.

[Super Kami Dende]

I've often thought about this, but not only would it really disrupt the meta it might still not be enough to stop rush decks. If you can't clear the board an extra 10 HP won't save you. I think the game needs a bit more AoE and certain cards need to be adjusted.



Or nerf 'em.

Most of the major nerfs so far have been aimed at rush and rush-enabling cards, like Leeroy, buzzard and undertaker.

Stopping a legitimate card game strategy because your super cool mid-range->max mana legendary deck doesn't work against them is just childish.

"oh no I can't get out my I-WIN cards before I'm beaten. Nerf everything and make the game slower!"

[xenogear3]

That heal 8 bot is already annoying enough.

[Deleted]

Raise players health to 40.

It's really the only thing that's going to fix zerg at this point as there's just too many cards that would have to be adjusted otherwise.

Maybe some people enjoy 4th turn game over zergs, but it seems to take a lot of the skill out of the game.

>hearthstone
>skill

you wot m8?

Really now, this game has so much fucking RNG, especially since the advent of GvG. Even if it's not RNG it's those broken cards like the mech warper. Coin warper, then another warper and then the rest of your hand. GG, if the opponent isn't a priest with auche + circle or a pala with equality + pyro, it's a game over by turn 4.

Cards that are actually very nicely designed get overshadowed by this overpowered cancer. You see, Hobgoblin is one of those powerful but balanced cards. It is mid-late game combo card. It can give you immense value but it is almost always played on the same turn with your 1-attack minions, which means you're not really getting use of it until turn 5-6. Because of this, you CAN actually counter it. You can get equality consecrated. You can get flamestriked. Shadowflamed, holy nova'd, whatever mass removal answer there is. And this is why it's balanced, thus rarely played.

[caractacus]

You need the availability of rush decks to keep the late game decks in check, While it isn't strictly true you could look at it like this - Rush beats control, control beats mid range and mid range beats rush. So it gives the game an element of rock, paper scissor.

If you are consistently losing by turn 4 to rush decks you need to look at your deck or your play style.

[Deleted]

I've often thought that this might be a good idea. Rush decks would still exist - rush decks are simply the fastest decks in the meta. Just those decks would also be a little bit slower, rather than having games be decided by opening hands. I'm of the opinion that control is how the game is truly meant to be played, even rush decks should have to make trades. A more control oriented meta leaves more room for strategy and for the fun of big cards slugging it out against one another.

[Mormolyce]

Stopping a legitimate card game strategy because your super cool mid-range->max mana legendary deck doesn't work against them is just childish.

"oh no I can't get out my I-WIN cards before I'm beaten. Nerf everything and make the game slower!"

I dunno man, you kind of sound like a butthurt rush player here. "Nuh uh it's legit!!!".

We all know certain rush decks need adjustments.

- - - Updated - - -

You need the availability of rush decks to keep the late game decks in check, While it isn't strictly true you could look at it like this - Rush beats control, control beats mid range and mid range beats rush. So it gives the game an element of rock, paper scissor.

While this is true, it doesn't mean that all three are properly balanced at the moment.

[Ryme]

With hindsight, I wish all spells were either hit minion XOR hit face, then balanced mana wise around that. It's too late for such a large change now, but honestly I think this would resolve so many issues people have with the game.

[kaiadam]

If you raised health pool to 40, after a couple of months, people will start complaining about cheap rush decks using cheap cards like yeti and sludge belcher being too toxic.

Currently, rush is actually in a bad spot, with mech decks - which are honestly more midrange than rush - being the only remotely fast decks in the top tier.

[Mormolyce]

If you raised health pool to 40, after a couple of months, people will start complaining about cheap rush decks using cheap cards like yeti and sludge belcher being too toxic.

Frankly Sludge Belcher is OP and should be adjusted as well.

[Sarevokcz]

If you raised health pool to 40, after a couple of months, people will start complaining about cheap rush decks using cheap cards like yeti and sludge belcher being too toxic.

Currently, rush is actually in a bad spot, with mech decks - which are honestly more midrange than rush - being the only remotely fast decks in the top tier.

Cant take seriously any list, that has oil rogue, freeze mage and aggro mech shaman as tier1, while consistently good decks like handlock or CW tier 2... its a good thing its only a snapshot and not actually resembling real strenght in the meta. Also one would have to wonder why people rpefer to play mech mage, when oil rogue or aggro ench shaman are about as cheap to craft (hint: because they are figured out decks, there was huge hype about the new aggro mech shaman... that died about a week later, when people figured how to play against it..)

[Super Kami Dende]

I dunno man, you kind of sound like a butthurt rush player here. "Nuh uh it's legit!!!".

We all know certain rush decks need adjustments..

I play priest control. I find Rush decks to be some of the easiest decks to play against.

[Deleted]

If the meta is rush-minded, then tweak your decks untill you start beating them up.
If the meta is control-minded, then tweak your decks untill you start beating them up.

If you face a lot of aggro decks, then build your decks around it! Put in more AoE, cheap minions that clears 2 of those most of the time (shielded mini bot, zombie chow, amani berserker). Even put in low mana taunts. Pyromancer with cheap spells for excellent removal.
Don't just stick to the traditional decklists - Tweak your own, until you feel comfortable against whatever you face all the time.

It's really not that hard.

That said, I hate facing control decks aswell. I hate playing it too, as it's MOSTLY just face, face, face.
My Ramp Druid is doing pretty well against aggro decks. Especially if I can Swipe on turn 3(with coin) or 4.
I like the longer games, where you got some time to think about awesome plays, or just in general have more plays than just 1.

[kaiadam]

Cant take seriously any list, that has oil rogue, freeze mage and aggro mech shaman as tier1, while consistently good decks like handlock or CW tier 2... its a good thing its only a snapshot and not actually resembling real strenght in the meta. Also one would have to wonder why people rpefer to play mech mage, when oil rogue or aggro ench shaman are about as cheap to craft (hint: because they are figured out decks, there was huge hype about the new aggro mech shaman... that died about a week later, when people figured how to play against it..)

I'd imagine the rapid meta adaptation is why this particular list is updated every week, summarizing the snapshot of what happens at high legendary ranks - which, as far as I've seen, is very insightful and accurate. I suppose you don't have to take the list seriously, but that's your choice ...

I mean, it'll probably not align very correctly with your own experiences especially if you aren't playing at a very high level. Back when I played starcraft, or wow arena, despite being in masters league/gladiator, my personal results would differ greatly from the generally accepted balance ratios (notable example being my PvZ winrate was like 35% when pros had over 55%), but I still would recognize that overall, at that point, the pros were correct and I was probably just doing something flat out wrong.

[shammypie]

With hindsight, I wish all spells were either hit minion XOR hit face, then balanced mana wise around that. It's too late for such a large change now, but honestly I think this would resolve so many issues people have with the game.

So if you let that warrior stack 30 armor he 1 shots you with shield slam? Priests have a 2 mana 5 damage nuke. Hunters are still hunters and everyone hates them

[kaiadam]

There used to be a warrior card in alpha called recklessness that destroyed all your armor and gave your hero that much attack. Needless to say, it was removed for the greater good.

[Deleted]

4th turn game over zergs

Pretty much this.
And you can't do anythig.
Unacceptable, the only ppl who defend this kind of style are those are used/enjoy to play every cards at 1/2/3 mana cost.