View Poll Results: Your stance on Evolution.

Voters
171. This poll is closed
  • Yes, evolution has happened as the accepted theory says.

    134 78.36%
  • Yes, evolution is real however a higher power designed this

    27 15.79%
  • No, evolution is not real but creationism has holes in it

    1 0.58%
  • No, Creationism is the truth.

    9 5.26%
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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Winter Blossom View Post
    That video was really interesting. Thanks for sharing it.
    Glad you enjoyed it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayhem View Post
    I swear to glob i have been shot 3 times in the night from sunday to monday and my friends took me to disneyland instead of the hospital because we had tickets. I even had fun until i passed out because of pain and loss of blood.
    Haha not that harsh, but conversations etc, you are fucking sure you had a conversation with someone, you mention it and they are like "what?"
    has happened more than once, there is a reason i stopped messing up with dreaming, was getting confusing as hell.

  2. #142
    A thread in which you are supposed to describe the opposite of your beliefs... I'll try?

    Assuming we still assume DNA to be real. And acknowledge it codes for physical properties of organisms. And still assume those properties can be beneficial or not, to survival and reproduction. Then, to discount evolution, we must assume that mutation is not real. That there is no spontaneous changing of DNA.

    So then what's doing it? Why, the inventors of DNA, of course: Bacteria. These little bastards have been around for billions of years. You carry kilograms around in your guts and on your skin. We're the perfect hosts to carry them around to explore the world, a lot more interesting and efficient then sitting in the ground in the same location forever. Of course, these little assholes that designed all other living things, for food, habitat and transportation, aren't peaceful. Many races exist, and many wage a constant war. They attack each other, or each other's hosts, with weaponized hosts, viruses by their design, and horrible toxins. We are but playthings in a global war, ruled by overlords too tiny to perceive. And they continue to construct more advanced hosts by their artificial mutations to DNA.

    Pray for mercy from your bacterial overlords!

  3. #143
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Soulscorch View Post
    Alien theories is the next step after believing in god for awhile and then getting you head out of the box, but it's still a wierd trade-off. It's cooler though
    Ofcourse, there are a lot of hints pointing to this theory.

    *The eradication of the dinosaurs because the aliens didn't want the development of their creations to be endangered by them.
    *Multiple stages of human evolution. More like multiple attempts at creating the desired design for the human being.
    *The missing link. Where current homo sapiens design jumped straight up from the last stage that looked nothing like it.

    It all points out at outside intervention, can't be just universal RNG.

    Maybe it was an experiment, maybe it was some alien organization's idea of art, maybe there was a purpose for Humanity that was eventually abandoned.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by ellieg View Post
    Ive always thought about it like this. Evolution is real. We can describe how every single organism came to be by understanding evolution. Except for the very first organism. How did that living thing come to be? Was it chemicals interacting with eachother that became more complex until it became a life? Or did God create it? You can believe in God and evolution at the same time.
    The problem I have with the whole "god created it and then life evolved from there" aspect is that God supposedly created this very first life BILLIONS of years ago and just let life evolve over these billions of years without any input until just a few thousand years ago. He makes his first appearance hands down some commandments and then is never heard from again.

    Are we the only life that he created? If so why? If not where is this other life. The universe is unthinkably large and you believe we are the only life god created?

    Does that make sense? Why would god show himself and command these people to do things yet he doesnt do anything now to prove his existence? Why wouldnt he just appear before us to validate his existence? Could it be that there is no god and that you just happened to be born in a time and in a country that believes in god and not Allah, Buddha, Poseidon, or Rah?

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Aori View Post
    Not sure what you're getting at. Your hostility is noted however.
    You thought that was hostile? lol

  6. #146
    Deleted
    Every counter argument to evolution requires me to conclude that when a question has not been answered, it means all the answered ones are wrong.

    I just cant do that. Worse yet, that the unanswered questions mean that there is a superbeing who zaps life into rocks for fun. It's a good thing I don't have such faulty logic.

  7. #147
    The Lightbringer Aori's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    While I'm glad that most people acknowledge that scientists are basically right, the cocky attitude people have about "knowing" something that they can't explain worth a shit is really offputting. As someone with a science background, I could easily argue the intelligent design perspective in a fashion that would technically beat the majority of people in a formal debate.
    I wouldn't stand a chance in a debate on any scientific topic, I just don't have that knowledge upfront and ready. However I love to talk about it, I do have the ability to comprehend it.

    What is sad though is people can't just talk about. Instead it has to be a war. This thread is littered with evolution is right, there is tons of evidence go look it up gg. Evolution isn't a simple topic, it is quite complex. What is most irritating is when someone will ask for it to be explained, the general reply is, go figure it on your own. Then again this isn't the best place for such a topic, you get my meaning though.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    You thought that was hostile? lol
    It was hostile, doesn't mean it was rage induced hostility, just means you were unfriendly. Is that better? Still don't get the fight you're trying to pick.

  8. #148
    The Insane Revi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    Complex life can come about without a "guiding hand". The Earth is a big place, so it's not like one species is going to completely die out all over the planet.
    You can't prove that complex life came about without a guiding hand, that's just a necessary assumption to be able to believe in the theory of evolution. They say all things share one common ancestor.. If life can come about on its own given the right conditions, why hasn't it happened more than once? After the supposed extinction of the dinosaurs we have developed from rodents into what we are today.. In the same time, many other species have barely evolved at all? Too many gaps. If you look at these issues with a creator in mind though, all the pieces make sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    The Earth is "special" in that it just happened to be the right distance from a star to have temperatures that sustain life. No "creation" required.
    Many, many planets with earth-like qualities in the universe, yet no other sign of intelligent life from anywhere. The chances of this happening according to our current "scientific" knowledge are astronomically small. It simply doesn't make sense (again, see the Fermi paradox) unless earth is special, chosen by a creator.

    Quote Originally Posted by anon5123 View Post
    The problem is that you have also failed to prove your claim of "divine fact". Spouting off "creator! creator! creationism!" without a single grain of proof.

    "You can't prove me wrong so it's still a possibility!!" is a dumb argument, rebutted by "There is a teapot orbiting the sun. Since you can't prove me wrong, it's still a possibility."
    If there is a teapot orbiting the sun, it's because God made it so. Burden of proof lies with the one making the claim, which are the ones claiming there is no God.

  9. #149
    The Unstoppable Force Mayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurioxan View Post
    Haha not that harsh, but conversations etc, you are fucking sure you had a conversation with someone, you mention it and they are like "what?"
    has happened more than once, there is a reason i stopped messing up with dreaming, was getting confusing as hell.
    Now imagine you could remember dreams for years.
    Quote Originally Posted by ash
    So, look um, I'm not a grief counselor, but if it's any consolation, I have had to kill and bury loved ones before. A bunch of times actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I never said I was knowledge-able and I wouldn't even care if I was the least knowledge-able person and the biggest dumb-ass out of all 7.8 billion people on the planet.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by petej0 View Post
    Are we the only life that he created? If so why? If not where is this other life. The universe is unthinkably large and you believe we are the only life god created?

    Does that make sense? Why would god show himself and command these people to do things yet he doesnt do anything now to prove his existence? Why wouldnt he just appear before us to validate his existence?
    Well, if you really wanted to know the answers, you would have to put as much time in to studying the bible as you did studying evolution. It doesn't mean you'll like or agree with the answers, but there are answers to be had.

    Again, I'm just throwing out the basic answers. If you want ot spend all your time shooting holes in them, then you should at least go get the full answers.

    1. God created heave and earth AND the Angels. We were not his first creations. It is also stated that a day to God is like a thousand years to man. You ask why haven't we been visited by other creations A. We don't know that we haven't and B. If they are on the same Technology line as us, they are behind the same tech curve that keeps us from traveling 100 light years in 60 secs

    2. We are a result of God's desire to have creatures with a free will to do whatever we want. Angels for example are a little more drone like, though clearly they can get besides themselves and think for themselves to some degree aka Lucifer and his 1/3

    3. In the old testament, God did all kinds of things to prove his existence. You would think the whole Moses getting the folks out of Egypt, parting of the sea, raining mana down from Heaven would have been more than enough for folks. But as soon as Moses disappears for a few days, those folks ran right back to what they were comfortable with and erected a gold cow.

    4. The old testament is showing that living by purely by strict laws and miraculous events wasn't enough to keep people from wondering off to follow the cool new hip god that sprung up. It also showed that even with laws like Stoning people for adultery, people still committed adultery.

    5. The new Testament changes most that around. As it became clear that man with his free will,and despite miracle events and strict laws, will still be naughty by nature. So a new plan was put in place. The new plan requires faith. Either you believe or you don't. If you want miracles, you'll get them, but don't expect any burning bush events. You'll ask why didn't we go with Plan B to begin with? Because we(man) needed to have some recorded history that Plan A doesn't really work. even now we keep hearing people cry out for the return of the "Eye for an Eye" model

    So there is some basic answers, it's obviously a much wider topic to try and discuss in these forums. I'm sure you already have a 1000 nitpicks you want to point out, but I'm not going to argue those with you. Since you're a man of science, I'm sure you are now more interested in learning more of the details on your own.
    Last edited by Mad_Murdock; 2015-02-24 at 02:42 PM.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Revi View Post
    You can't prove that complex life came about without a guiding hand, that's just a necessary assumption to be able to believe in the theory of evolution. They say all things share one common ancestor.. If life can come about on its own given the right conditions, why hasn't it happened more than once?
    It may possibly have, we dont know because we dont have every possible molecule on the planet under surveillance. It is possible new life was created deep down in the ocean where thermal vents spew super heated gases into the ocean. It could happen deep under glaciers where pockets of water still exists warmed by volcanic activities. It could happen deep in unexplored caves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revi View Post
    After the supposed extinction of the dinosaurs we have developed from rodents into what we are today.. In the same time, many other species have barely evolved at all? Too many gaps. If you look at these issues with a creator in mind though, all the pieces make sense.
    Developed from rodents? Where do you read this stuff?


    Quote Originally Posted by Revi View Post
    Many, many planets with earth-like qualities in the universe, yet no other sign of intelligent life from anywhere. The chances of this happening according to our current "scientific" knowledge are astronomically small. It simply doesn't make sense (again, see the Fermi paradox) unless earth is special, chosen by a creator.
    The life that evolved on THIS planet is the only life that could have evolved on this planet. Had we been a few hundred million miles closer or further away, we would be different. We could be covered with a thick layer of hair still or evolved a greater tolerance to the suns deadly cosmic rays. The fact that we havent found another planet with life does not prove god. We cant even communicate with these planets so you cant prove intelligence exists. It doesnt even have to be intelligent life in the form that you expect. It could still be primitive yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Revi View Post
    If there is a teapot orbiting the sun, it's because God made it so. Burden of proof lies with the one making the claim, which are the ones claiming there is no God.
    The burden of proof is always on those claiming the positive assertion. We are born with no knowledge of a god. If you say there is one you have to prove its existence. I dont believe in a god for the same reason why I dont believe in a Tooth Fairy, a leprechaun or Unicorns. There is no evidence of their existence.

    A person being cured miraculously of a deadly disease after praying is not proof. Having a amputated limb restored after a prayer would be evidence of a miracle that would lead me on the path of belief. Cite me a story of that happening.

  12. #152
    This is a difficult task due to evolution being the only mechanism that has any sort of real evidence. Forming any sort of argument against requires a certain amount of willful ignorance that is going to make any argument be not very convincing. Mostly arguments against evolution rely on some sort of Russell's Teapot argument. i.e. the evolution could be guided by god argument.

    In order to believe otherwise I think it first takes a cultural shift away from scientific reasoning and more to belief by authority. Its not really that the argument is different, but the criteria for convincing is different. One has to replace evidence based critical thought with adherence to a cultural authority.
    While you live, shine / Have no grief at all / Life exists only for a short while / And time demands its toll.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Mad_Murdock View Post
    Well, if you really wanted to know the answers, you would have to put as much time in to studying the bible as you did studying evolution. It doesn't mean you'll like or agree with the answers, but there are answers to be had.
    I know the answers, I have debated these for years. I am trying to get self reflection of believers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad_Murdock View Post
    The new Testament changes most that around. As it became clear that man with his free will,and despite miracle events and strict laws, will still be naughty by nature. So a new plan was put in place. The new plan requires faith. Either you believe or you don't. If you want miracles, you'll get them, but don't expect any burning bush events. You'll ask why didn't we go with Plan B to begin with? Because we(man) needed to have some recorded history that Plan A doesn't really work. even now we keep hearing people cry out for the return of the "Eye for an Eye" model
    If god commanded you to kill your children would you do it?

  14. #154
    High Overlord Witchsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lock and troll View Post
    Maybe it was an experiment, maybe it was some alien organization's idea of art, maybe there was a purpose for Humanity that was eventually abandoned.
    Did you ever read Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? :P
    "You can cut our wings but we will always remember what it was like to fly!"
    #nogg-aholic

  15. #155
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stabetha View Post
    One day just out of nowhere there was "a big bang". what was here before that? I don't know. what caused it? I don't know. could it have been a higher power? nope a guy in a lab coat told me so. and people have believed in a higher power of some sort or another since the beginning of time and I'm so much smarter then them.
    Complete and total misinterpretation of the big bang.

    The Big Bang claims that at the beginning all of the universe was in a singularity, which expanded and ultimately formed the universe as it is now.

    The Big Bang however, contrary to popular belief, does NOT explain where that singularity came from, thus does not explain the ultimate origin of the universe. It is still one of the biggest mysteries in astrophysics and cosmology.

    Furthermore, science makes no claim about god, whether there is, or is no god.
    Putin khuliyo

  16. #156
    I am Murloc! Anakso's Avatar
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    Unfortunately going to have to close this, due to the nature of the discussion there is no way for this thread to continue without religion entering the discussion as it already has.

    Closed.

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