Simcraft rotations bots, where do we draw the line?

[Ferali]

Recently i've found a Github open source project for a priority list addon for a bot, the following executes simcraft profiles in-game. Assigning keys to aoe , single target and even cooldowns .

Each day more people are using them , this will lead to a banwave but till then.. The only way i can beat them is by build up of extra resource due to boss abilities, delaying instant casts for movement and a few other things.

This sounds tempting at first but like hearthstone i expect blizzard to do a banwave, so stop using them for the community . Rotations bots exist for a long time, there even ones using wow api unlocked, but their perfomance recently has been over the top . When you discover a fellow player in your mythic guild uses it makes your head explode .

Have you encountered players like this one in your guild? Blizzard could server side detect this bots like you can detect by watching the logs, i think we just need their attention .


// Mods: This is controversial it might not produce what i intended ,awareness to the issue and more pressure on blizzard for action, if you think this has more negative impact than positive please delete this topic .

[Dangg]

I doubt a rotation addon/bot can be better than playing yourself (at the specs I know) unless it's on a target dummy with zero movement, add switching involved.

[Ferali]

I doubt a rotation addon/bot can be better than playing yourself (at the specs I know) unless it's on a target dummy with zero movement, add switching involved.

I can beat it at fights with high movement and you need to delay casts due to mechanics, save abilities for aoe and simple not follow your action priority list . Top 10 rank players will be better , but i want to compete vs players not AI's . This was a problem with hearthstone too, bots reached legend rank.

Still not sure if i should have posted this thread.

[Deleted]

I doubt a rotation addon/bot can be better than playing yourself (at the specs I know) unless it's on a target dummy with zero movement, add switching involved.

Believe me the level some of these bots have reached is honestly scary. If you run one that does the rotation correctly and use the mode-switch binds at the right time you will easily parse in the 95th percentile for your iLevel.

[Ballrug]

If you want a bot to play your game for you, and you think "I win!!!" when the bot works, then more the fuck power to you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rog-O-Matic

[Granyala]

Where do I draw the line?

Targeting and Focus-cast macros.
Everything else is done manually.

I don't give a shit about that degrading my performance, I play the game to PLAY and not to watch.

[Ryme]

I doubt a rotation addon/bot can be better than playing yourself (at the specs I know) unless it's on a target dummy with zero movement, add switching involved.

Depends on the simulationcraft profile, a good one will model movement and add switching correctly.

[Ichifails]

I'd wish more people would adopt it. It would make grouping with random people a lot less painful.

[Deleted]

I'd wish more people would adopt it. It would make grouping with random people a lot less painful.

Just to be clear - using these rotation bots is a clear violation of ToS. Although Blizzard haven't ban-waved it yet I wouldn't be surprised if they're currently figuring out a way to "discover" the people using so they can do a mass wave all at once. If you're using one, or have used one in the past you're likely to be hit by a ban at some point in the next 12-18months.

[Thelxi]

But how would that work with movement? If something like this actually works I'd be very impressed.

[Ferali]

But how would that work with movement? If something like this actually works I'd be very impressed.

The user control the movement, it knows if you're moving or not . There are high rated arena bots so almost the same.

[mauserr]

You talking about the remnants of what ProbablyEngine was? There was a ban wave long time ago, including PQR users. There is no need to draw a line, it has already been drawn by Blizzard. It's against the ToS. You use it, you get banned, sooner or later.

I doubt a rotation addon/bot can be better than playing yourself (at the specs I know) unless it's on a target dummy with zero movement, add switching involved.

While they might not be better than a top100-200 player but rather equal or close to, using them will still be advantageous. On a lot of fights what matters more than DPS is mechanics execution. Having a bot do your rotation on a level good enough to get 85-90th percentiles just so you can focus SOLELY on mechanics is not to be underestimated.

[Schizoide]

Yeah, exactly. The line is drawn, it's cheating, they'll get banned sooner or later.

[Tharkkun]

Just like the Archy bot. Blizzard will add tech to be sure they can detect the bot to a near 0 false positive rate. Then they'll use their net for a month or two and ban a huge chunk of idiots at once.

The hard work for Blizzard is acquiring the bot and decompiling it so they can use warden to find it. When it's open source they have all the code right in front of them.

[Anxty]

So I have checked these rotation bots out. Because people in my guild said they had actually used it on farm bosses in our raid. I tested it on my warrior and controlling the cooldown and cleave and single target phases with a macro I was about 1k dps off me manually playing but still had 2 98th percentiles with it. So these things are far more sophisticated than you think and honestly you cant tell when someone in the raid is using it opposed to when they are not using it due to how well it performs.
The 2 guys who showed didnt know until I told them the 2 fights I had used it on.

Mind you it does not make it anymore right that these things are out there its just people underestimate the hell out of them. If blizz wanted to take steps to shut these down they would have. But sadly they are not so they will be around I am guessing until the game finally dies. Because there will always be a demand for a product like this. People are lazy plain and simple.

[Deleted]

If blizz wanted to take steps to shut these down they would have. But sadly they are not so they will be around I am guessing until the game finally dies. Because there will always be a demand for a product like this. People are lazy plain and simple.

They already have, the previous bot used mostly for this basically received huge banwaves after they worked out how to detect it - the particular bot is mentioned in a previous poster in this thread. The current one which is in widespread use hasn't received any banwaves yet but I'd suspect as soon as blizz can work out a detection method for it they'll basically just mass-ban everyone using it.

[Deleted]

Just to be clear - using these rotation bots is a clear violation of ToS.

So is account sharing but the so called top guilds think that's fine so why wouldn't they be using rotation bots?

[Deleted]

So is account sharing but the so called top guilds think that's fine so why wouldn't they be using rotation bots?

How on earth does this enter this thread lol.

Blizzard have ban-waved for using rotation bots before so it's likely soon as they are capable of detecting the current one it'll also get ban-waved.

[Anxty]

They already have, the previous bot used mostly for this basically received huge banwaves after they worked out how to detect it - the particular bot is mentioned in a previous poster in this thread. The current one which is in widespread use hasn't received any banwaves yet but I'd suspect as soon as blizz can work out a detection method for it they'll basically just mass-ban everyone using it.

Yea thats fine but it dosnt stop them from doing it again lol. Thats the point I am making there will always be a rotation bot out there people can use until blizz does a banwave. And after the banwave they will do it again. Its a never ending cycle.

[Wilderness]

I don't think its that controversial - its a bannable offense and sooner or later Blizzard will figure out how to detect this particular bot and whomever uses it will be banned.

I'm sure that some people use it, but I would be surprised if it was that widespread. You're definitely not looking at thousands and thousands of bots all over WCL rankings, so you are competing against people. Ranks are a good way to track you and your guilds progress on a boss, how you are improving, etc, but the top ranks are always going to be dominated by players padding and using strats to try for high parses with very fast kill times. If you're one of the people trying to do that, then that's great, have fun with it, but if you're a lower ranking player trying to measure your own improvements on a boss, I think the ranks will be useful for that whether or not there are a few bots on them.