Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ...
7
8
9
10
LastLast
  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    You are resisting to understand the fundamental difference between a philosophical and scientific discussion.
    I don't see why you would want to make it a philosophical discussion, that's significantly less interesting than a scientific one.
    Deathknight's do it using disease, blood and the power of the unholy. Warlocks do it with dark demons by their side. Mages do it with summoned arcane powers. Druids do it using the forces of nature. Rogues do it through stealth, poison's, shadows and....from behind. Paladins do it by calling to the light for aid. Shamans do it with the help of the elements. Priests do it through the holy light.
    But warriors....
    Warriors just fucking do it.

  2. #162
    Stood in the Fire Arberian's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Moonglade
    Posts
    421
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolretadin View Post
    I don't see why you would want to make it a philosophical discussion, that's significantly less interesting than a scientific one.
    I have to assert that science is philosophy. Philosophy is always about drawing conclusions so is Science. Have you ever heard about "philosophy of science" ?!
    My youtube Channel : Arberian021
    WoW isn't all about new concepts or themes, it's about classic archetypes that fit the Holy Trinity gameplay style of Warcraft.
    Demon Hunter Class Idea
    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    Exercise releases endorphins that make you feel good, iirc, don't quote me on it

  3. #163
    The Normal Kasierith's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    St Petersburg
    Posts
    18,464
    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    I have to assert that science is philosophy. Philosophy is always about drawing conclusions so is Science. Have you ever heard about "philosophy of science" ?!
    The difference between philosophy and science is that you can verify one via induction, but not the other.

    Unless you want to go Hume on people. In which case science doesn't work.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolretadin View Post
    I don't see why you would want to make it a philosophical discussion, that's significantly less interesting than a scientific one.
    Because the original post is a philosophical one. It's kinda pain to see scientific arguments are being thrown around when what we are dealing pure logic. Interest is a relative term. Some people may find it more attractive compared to scientific discussion.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    I have to assert that science is philosophy. Philosophy is always about drawing conclusions so is Science. Have you ever heard about "philosophy of science" ?!
    Philosophy is not interested in observation and/or confirmation of the theories via empirical data. It's a fundamental difference.

    "Philosophy of science" is used as "the nature of science" or "understanding science".

  5. #165
    Stood in the Fire Arberian's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Moonglade
    Posts
    421
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Philosophy is not interested in observation and/or confirmation of the theories via empirical data. It's a fundamental difference.

    "Philosophy of science" is used as "the nature of science" or "understanding science".
    Philosophy if also about logic. You need logic to draw conclusions . Philosophy is a great help to science and the other way around.
    My youtube Channel : Arberian021
    WoW isn't all about new concepts or themes, it's about classic archetypes that fit the Holy Trinity gameplay style of Warcraft.
    Demon Hunter Class Idea
    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    Exercise releases endorphins that make you feel good, iirc, don't quote me on it

  6. #166
    The Normal Kasierith's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    St Petersburg
    Posts
    18,464
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuntantee View Post
    Because the original post is a philosophical one. It's kinda pain to see scientific arguments are being thrown around when what we are dealing pure logic. Interest is a relative term. Some people may find it more attractive compared to scientific discussion.
    You're conflating philosophy with one of its subgroups. Philosophy overall is a very vast field. It is not confined solely to axioms and the nature of reasoning.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Kasierith View Post
    You're conflating philosophy with one of its subgroups.
    I am genuinely curious about where did I do that.

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    I doubt that. BVG theorem proves that every Universe which has been expanding throughtout its history cannot be eternal in the past and must reach a space-time boundary(beginning).
    No, it proves that the inflationary model fails at a certain point backwards in time and has to be replaced. i.e. it can't have been expanding right before the big bang; it would have to be doing something else, for example oscillating is one possibility.

  9. #169
    Stood in the Fire Arberian's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Moonglade
    Posts
    421
    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    No, it proves that the inflationary model fails at a certain point backwards in time and has to be replaced. i.e. it can't have been expanding right before the big bang; it would have to be doing something else, for example oscillating is one possibility.
    There are only 3 models compatible with that:
    Hubble Expansion=0 (Contraction)
    Improbable Weak Energy Conditions
    Hubble Expansion<0

    But all these models fail to avert the beginning of the Universe.
    All inflationary models cannot be past eternal.
    My youtube Channel : Arberian021
    WoW isn't all about new concepts or themes, it's about classic archetypes that fit the Holy Trinity gameplay style of Warcraft.
    Demon Hunter Class Idea
    Quote Originally Posted by TJ View Post
    Exercise releases endorphins that make you feel good, iirc, don't quote me on it

  10. #170
    The Unstoppable Force May90's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Somewhere special
    Posts
    21,699
    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    1)Everything which begins to exist is either caused or uncaused.
    2)If things which begin to exist have no cause for their beginning(nothing caused them to begin),they must not have begun to exist.
    2) does not follow from 1).
    Quote Originally Posted by King Candy View Post
    I can't explain it because I'm an idiot, and I have to live with that post for the rest of my life. Better to just smile and back away slowly. Ignore it so that it can go away.
    Thanks for the avatar goes to Carbot Animations and Sy.

  11. #171
    The Unstoppable Force THE Bigzoman's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Magnolia
    Posts
    20,767
    Quote Originally Posted by Kasierith View Post
    You're conflating philosophy with one of its subgroups. Philosophy overall is a very vast field. It is not confined solely to axioms and the nature of reasoning.
    I'm not even sure what this thread would fall into.

    Epistemology with a possible dash of metaphysics if the argument is valid.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    For ever action there is a reaction one of the fundamental laws of physics
    so if we never have an action we will never have a reaction so going by the fundamental laws of physics there has always has to be a cause
    Which puts us in a never-ending loop and a headache to boot.

    Causality is surprisingly complex in sciences.

    Learing Granger causality in econometrics was a bitch for me.

  12. #172
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    1)Everything which begins to exist is either caused or uncaused.
    --->The Beginning of Existence is an action.
    --->Therefore it is logical to think that they are either caused or uncaused.
    2)If things which begin to exist have no cause for their beginning(nothing caused them to begin),they must not have begun to exist.
    3)C:Therefore everything which begins to exist has a cause. (Since something which begins to exist, must begin to exist (2))

    All these arguments follow deductive reasoning therefore the conclusions logically follow.

    I want to know if this argument works or not. Thank you for the support in advance. (Hope it works for everything that begins to exist)

    I am trying to prove that everything that begins to exist has a cause.

    (Please note that the second premise and the third premise are assumptions based on logic. They are not conclusions. The third premise bring us to something illogical , therefore the second premise is also illogical which helps us deal with the first premise as it is needed.)

    Terms used:
    Cause-something which gives rise to an action
    Uncaused- nothing gives rise to an action
    something(existent)-nothing(non existent)
    Explain it to me like i'm five.

  13. #173
    The Insane apepi's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Mostly harmless
    Posts
    19,388
    Quote Originally Posted by Finnish Nerd View Post
    Explain it to me like i'm five.
    "If you can't say it simply, then you don't yet understand it well enough." N.B.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  14. #174
    Did we prove the existence of Odin yet?

  15. #175
    The Insane apepi's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Mostly harmless
    Posts
    19,388
    Quote Originally Posted by Algathor View Post
    Did we prove the existence of Odin yet?
    You mean Mr. Wednesday?
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Arberian View Post
    There are only 3 models compatible with that:
    Hubble Expansion=0 (Contraction)
    Improbable Weak Energy Conditions
    Hubble Expansion<0

    But all these models fail to avert the beginning of the Universe.
    All inflationary models cannot be past eternal.
    Uh, no, hubble expansion <=0 does not require a beginning. It could have been oscillating forever.


    You don't understand the theory you're trying to talk about like... at all.

    You're misinterpreting the requirement for a change as the requirement for an end point.

  17. #177
    The Insane Revi's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    The land of the ice and snow.
    Posts
    15,628
    Quote Originally Posted by apepi View Post
    You mean Mr. Wednesday?
    That makes a lot more sense in Norwegian "Onsdag" Odins dag = Odin's day.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •