Expansion Divergence (Post WoD)

[sweepdeepsPL]

It's becoming significantly possible that 6.2 will be the last major raiding tier of this expansion, and I've catalogued my thoughts as to where I think the Warcraft Universe will head next for their list of complaints and rose-tinted Agility-and-Spirit goggles.


So it's safe to assume that once we bash Archimonde's face in (for the first 'real' time, Caverns of Time kinda shoehorned him into TBC) he won't trouble us for the near future. Blizzard has stated that the concept of the armies Horde and Alliance of MU being 'stuck on Draenor' is not a particularly big lore issue, our heroes and forces can travel back to MU Azeroth safely without any threat preventing that (hopefully). What next? Let's see:


There are four main issues that are still present / within the near future of happening:

-Azshara wanting to invest in some prime beachfront property all over Azeroth, leading to a Naga invasion a la Frozen Throne. Old Gods playing a similar but not primary antagonist role.

-Sylvanas bringing to complete fruition the genocide of the Eastern Kingdoms north of Arathi, leading to a potential war to finally cleanse what was once Lordaeron of the plague.

-Your favourite former faction leader Bolvar Fordragon awakening and potentially aligning with the old gods (Yogg-Saron has only been pacified -- for now) or deciding to just go it solo.

-The Emerald Dream turning into a Nightmare (thank N'Zoth for this one folks). This one's validity and possibility was increased when the Green Dragonflight lost their glowing eyes at the end of Cataclysm, meaning their powers are weakening and therefore more susceptible to corruption.

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And there are a few issues that, in the long term, will most likely be realized as an expansion:


-Sargaeras coming to wreck. This is basically, lorewise, the end-all-be-all of expansions for World of Warcraft. He is and always has been the most powerful enemy in the universe.

-Outland being revamped and re-invaded by the Burning Legion. If Kil'Jaeden could arrive on Outland to scare the shit out of Illidan once couldn't he do it again? If it is just a few floating islands in the nether logically it can be accessed from the nether itself. Also, I kinda just want to see more ethereals.

-Things involving using the last vial of the Well of Eternity. Basically this last one is just a term for an umbrella of things that can happen. Since the vial can ressurect the dead (presumably) and gift immortality to mortals, Blizzard can just poke a little jet of water into any avenue of lore to make it happen.


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What do you guys think? Personally, I would love to see an expansion centering around Sylvanas and focusing on cleansing Lordaeron. Blizzard really likes to use characters that were established in Warcraft III as antagonists (Illidan, Arthas, Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde, etc.) and Sylvanas is right up there with them. Plus, it would be nice to have an expansion that didn't focus on something to do with Orcs or the Burning Legion.

[Darth-Piekus]

I would propose to leave Sylvannas alone or else we might feel the rivers of tears of the Forsaken Fanboys crying for the Big Bad Blizzard shattering their dreams that Forsaken are not evil enough to become villains and their Free will dreams.

[Deleted]

My thoughts on your questions in bolded

There are four main issues that are still present / within the near future of happening:

-Azshara wanting to invest in some prime beachfront property all over Azeroth, leading to a Naga invasion a la Frozen Throne. Old Gods playing a similar but not primary antagonist role - my personal opinion "Please No" seriously im done fighting orcs and demons, but i don't think i like also the idea ti fight reptilian/serpent people no matter how annoyed i'm from the clitorcs

-Sylvanas bringing to complete fruition the genocide of the Eastern Kingdoms north of Arathi, leading to a potential war to finally cleanse what was once Lordaeron of the plague - I don't think we will have (at least any time soon) another expack where another racial leader goes nuts, so his people can be "the master race".

-Your favorite former faction leader Bolvar Fordragon awakening and potentially aligning with the old gods (Yogg-Saron has only been pacified -- for now) or deciding to just go it solo - "There always must be a Lich King!" (/thunders in the distance). As much as we like the idea (or not), Blizzard said somewhere recently that they are done with the LK.

-The Emerald Dream turning into a Nightmare (thank N'Zoth for this one folks). This one's validity and possibility was increased when the Green Dragonflight lost their glowing eyes at the end of Cataclysm, meaning their powers are weakening and therefore more susceptible to corruption. - this will really get me offguard, it will feel like "filler" expansion a la MoP and honestly i think its stupid idea for a solo expansion (think of it - new unexplored land, hidden threat, awakened by some event... sounds familiar?)

-Sargaeras coming to wreck. This is basically, lorewise, the end-all-be-all of expansions for World of Warcraft. He is and always has been the most powerful enemy in the universe - there were hints somewhere in the TBC that the quraji might be a part of force a lot ancient, bigger and stronger than the Burning Legion, so about the Sargeras being " the end-all-be-all of expansions" i think the right thinking on the matter should be "the player base will be the end-all-be-all of expansions", because as long as there is sufficient number of players playing WoW "There always will be a World of Warcraft!" (/thunders in the distance)

-Outland being revamped and re-invaded by the Burning Legion. If Kil'Jaeden could arrive on Outland to scare the shit out of Illidan once couldn't he do it again? If it is just a few floating islands in the nether logically it can be accessed from the nether itself. Also, I kinda just want to see more ethereals - Yup for the Ethereals, Nope for revamped Outland (remember the last revamp of the Old world and its success + at the moment we basically are on revamped Outland, but insted of KJ we will kick the ass of Archemond, just like in the good ol days in Outland)

-Things involving using the last vial of the Well of Eternity. Basically this last one is just a term for an umbrella of things that can happen. Since the vial can ressurect the dead (presumably) and gift immortality to mortals, Blizzard can just poke a little jet of water into any avenue of lore to make it happen. - from where did you come up with this shizzle mate?!?

What do you guys think? Personally, I would love to see an expansion centering around Sylvanas and focusing on cleansing Lordaeron. Blizzard really likes to use characters that were established in Warcraft III as antagonists (Illidan, Arthas, Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde, etc.) and Sylvanas is right up there with them. Plus, it would be nice to have an expansion that didn't focus on something to do with Orcs or the Burning Legion.

I really stoped thinking what will eb the next expansion. It will be always the least you ever expected. I advise you to do the same. Just let it go and you will be surprised every time.

[Jaspias]

The Outland revamp is almost 100% guaranteed, the Dark Portal is the Legion's only real gateway to Azeroth, and i doubt there is anyone powerful enough on Azeroth loyal to Legion to open a new one. Hell, last time it took Medivh and Gul'Dan, the most powerful beings on their respective worlds.

[Deleted]

leave Sylvannas alone or else you might feel the rivers of tears of mes crying for the Big Bad Blizzard shattering my dreams that Forsaken are not evil enough to become villains and my Free will dreams.

[Aquamonkey]

The Outland revamp is almost 100% guaranteed, the Dark Portal is the Legion's only real gateway to Azeroth, and i doubt there is anyone powerful enough on Azeroth loyal to Legion to open a new one. Hell, last time it took Medivh and Gul'Dan, the most powerful beings on their respective worlds.

That wasn't the last time. For DP, the last time was Kazzak using an ancient artifact. For general portal, there was Kel'Thuzad using the Book of Medivh in WC3. Then it was Kael'thas using the Sunwell in TBC.

[Jaspias]

That wasn't the last time. For DP, the last time was Kazzak using an ancient artifact. For general portal, there was Kel'Thuzad using the Book of Medivh in WC3. Then it was Kael'thas using the Sunwell in TBC.

Kazzak was a powerful demon already on Azeroth, and just reopened the existing portal. Kel'Thuzad switched sides and Kael'thas is dead, and no one close to their power still supports the Legion on Azeroth,Medivh's Book is missing and the Sunwell is now closely guarded and filled with Holy magic. The Dark Portal is the only gate the Legion has to our world, aside from warlocks and the Dreadlords. Without the Dark Portal, the Legion are nothing more than pests.

[Kokolums]

Sylvanas should NOT be a villain. She walks the line between good and evil. Its an internal war within her but unlike others she is winning.

It would be a complete waste to simply have her succumb to any evil nature within her. They built up a lot of nice lore for Sylvanas and the most disappointing thing would be for her to simply end up a generic baddie. Not only that, but at this point it would feel like a rehash of the Garrosh storyline. We already had a faction leader succumb to evil.

[Splub]

Yeah I don't want Sylvanas to become an antagonist. Out of the racial leaders she has the best characterization and it would be a huge waste to diminish the Forsaken by removing her. At least with Garrosh the playerbase wasn't THAT opposed to dealing with him, if you force the players to fight Sylvanas your just going to alienate Horde players who once again have to fight a faction leader.

If you ask me they could make an expansion out of anything, I thought Pandaria and Draenor were great but judging how people have responded to MoP and WoD, it should be something more established. So I propose the next two expansions should be a South Seas/Emerald Dream combo expansion that has N'Zoth and Aszhara as the primary antagonists and an expansion in the Twisting Nether that has you go to various worlds and of course the primary villain is Sargeras.

[Phinx]

I also don't like the idea of Sylvanas being the main antagonist. Or any antagonist at all. Enough with horde people going bad. However, I would like to see her story progressing. I loved her story so far, but it has been told over and over again.

For me, Azshara is the most likely thing. Gul'Dan escaping to Azeroth to get to the Tomb of Sargeras is mentioned alot on this forums. But if I recall correctly, AU Gul'Dan shouldn't know anything about the tombs. I mean, who could told him about them? His Burning Legion masters? I dunno. Last time a Gul'Dan stepped into those caverns, things turned out pretty bad.

However, I'm still on it for Azshara. Simply because she is the most famous lore character left as a possibilty. Bolvar isn't actually a bad guy. The Emerald Dream has been dealt with, iirc. And I already talked about Sylvanas.

Oh and btw: Bring back Magni. Let him see some Dark Irons in his city, so shit can get serious.

[Aquamonkey]

Sylvanas should NOT be a villain. She walks the line between good and evil. Its an internal war within her but unlike others she is winning.

It would be a complete waste to simply have her succumb to any evil nature within her. They built up a lot of nice lore for Sylvanas and the most disappointing thing would be for her to simply end up a generic baddie. Not only that, but at this point it would feel like a rehash of the Garrosh storyline. We already had a faction leader succumb to evil.

Sylvanas is already evil. She murdered an ally, going back on their deal. She condoned medical torture. She viewed her people as nothing more than tools to be expended in her vengeance against Arthas and humans. She was going to murder her sister and nephews so she could have them by her side as undead for all eternity.

[Deleted]

On the map behind the mission table (alliance) there are still a couple of islands northeast and southwest of draenor that are undiscovered.

I would assume these will still play a role.

[Aquamonkey]

On the map behind the mission table (alliance) there are still a couple of islands northeast and southwest of draenor that are undiscovered.

I would assume these will still play a role.

Those were originally supposed to be in content patches. But Blizzard decided to cut them.

[Jaspias]

Sylvanas is already evil. She murdered an ally, going back on their deal. She condoned medical torture. She viewed her people as nothing more than tools to be expended in her vengeance against Arthas and humans. She was going to murder her sister and nephews so she could have them by her side as undead for all eternity.

Sylvanas loves her people. She has no desire for world domination, so why worry about whether or not the Forsaken die out? Her hate of Arthas was stronger than her loyalty, true, so she would throw her entire kingdom at him in order to kill him, but now that there is no Arthas for her to hate, she is likely wanting to secure Lordaeron so the Forsaken can go back to the search for their cure.

[Aquamonkey]

she is likely wanting to secure Lordaeron so the Forsaken can go back to the search for their cure.

They have never been interested in a cure. Their plight was about how to make more Forsaken.

[Arrashi]

Sylvanas is already evil. She murdered an ally, going back on their deal. She condoned medical torture. She viewed her people as nothing more than tools to be expended in her vengeance against Arthas and humans. She was going to murder her sister and nephews so she could have them by her side as undead for all eternity.

You know, murdering them was fine...its just that why would you ever want them back ?

[Jaspias]

They have never been interested in a cure. Their plight was about how to make more Forsaken.

Are you sure about that? I remember plenty of quests in vanilla that mentioned that the Royal Apothecary Society was working hard for a cure.

[Aquamonkey]

Are you sure about that? I remember plenty of quests in vanilla that mentioned that the Royal Apothecary Society was working hard for a cure.

The rest of the Horde merely thought the RAS was working on a cure. They were always working on a new plague to fight Arthas and kill everything else on Azeroth.

[Darth-Piekus]

They have written themselves into a corner this time. The Forsaken cannot Progress with Sylvannas as she is right now. I don't know why they had to scrap the Quest for a Cure in order to go Scourge 2.0? There are only two ways now to resolve this. Either they do a 180 degree turn with them and make them change their Scourge ways trying to find a Cure for their Curse or they eventually have to fight both Alliance and Horde and whatever Neutral Factions might also take part.

To be honest I am really tired of this bullshit. Alliance being Lawful Good in Gold Letters and the Horde going Something Evil but not Enough Evil because it's an MMO game and for the sake of bringing War in Warcraft is really becoming boring and predictable and it doesn't really make sense after what happened last time.

[Zuben]

The problem with looking for a cure is that it diminishes Forsaken's identity as sentient undead and rather makes them humans with a skin disorder. This problem is present in the worgen, they're very much a human culture despite their furry-ailment.

It's better the way it is, Forsaken having accepted what they are and live with it. That ex-Forsaken alchemist in EPL is an individual, their society at large isn't looking for a cure. Their aggressive expansion halted during Cataclysm and hasn't advanced since. We're in a good place atm, Forsaken occupying borders at Thoradin's Wall, Greymane Wall and the Bulwark, and the areas they're currently holding have been condoned by Alliance with their war settlement. It needs to stay that way, if they are to co-exist with the other races (though I would like to see continuation to Arathi storyline).

Sylvanas isn't so much at the deep end as some like to think. She personally partook in SoO instead of sending a token force, and even though Vereesa hit a sore spot Sylvanas is still stable enough to understand diplomacy, as she sent people to aid Horde's efforts in Draenor. Her being evil is irrelevant. Sylvanas is a nasty woman, but we didn't take Arthas down for being nasty, we did it because he was an active threat to us. She's still lonely and needs help for it; maybe Alleria will do something about that when she returns.

All in all, I don't see issues surrounding Sylvanas being severe enough to warrant much content. Lordaeron's land won't be cured of the plague in WoW, as its current aesthetic fits the Forsaken. WPL is the best you can hope, as it is AC's heartland; they got no business spreading their curative ways to Forsaken-held territories.