More arena wins ...

[PPN]

Hey,

so i never liked arena, but since i have pretty much all cards i want, i started to spent my gold on arenas instead of buying cards.

I would say im an average player who just plays for fun (best ranked 10 by just doing dailies).

But this is how my arenas always turn out:

1. I make a deck (i try to watch my mana curve and that the deck has more or less some strategy behind it)
2. I start to play and go most often about 4 to 6 wins to zero losses.
3. (Ok at this point i of course expect better players and higher challenges, sometimes its also true)
4. After like 6-0 i get totally destroyed by the next 3 and finish 6-3, max. 7-3

What i think is a little bit a joke: After these 6-0 i meet almost only mages with multi fireballs or flamestrikes or like just before with multiple legendaries...

I mean its a head on head fight and then turn 7--> Dr.Boom, Turn 9--> Ysera...yeah well fuck, then flamestrikes, fireballs...and its a total loss.

It seems always the same, after a good start i just get smashed

My last few class picks were: Mage, Paladin, Lock, Shaman

But for all classes its really the same pattern...

Is it just a lack of practice, or i need to get a better deck for the later games?

[moudywins]

even though i play hearthstone pretty much daily you are expecting way too much skill. skill based games are ones in which you are given decisions and then you make the correct ones and youll come out on top, in hearthstone your moves are pretty much decided for you.

[haxartus]

Use a website that rates cards. You can also watch Trump, I think his worst games are at 7 wins, at least the ones he uploads to youtube.

[Tenris]

Use a website that rates cards. You can also watch Trump, I think his worst games are at 7 wins, at least the ones he uploads to youtube.

If using a website doesn't suck the fun out of it nothing else will You are always going to run into those decks, particularly mage, once you get past 6 wins you just need to be able to counter it with your plays, such as playing around flamestrike etc.

[caractacus]

If using a website doesn't suck the fun out of it nothing else will You are always going to run into those decks, particularly mage, once you get past 6 wins you just need to be able to counter it with your plays, such as playing around flamestrike etc.

I have to agree with this. I think Trump was asked once; What would do better, if he drafted a deck for an average player or if an average player drafted a deck for him? He answered that he would do better. This is because generally speaking most players draft well and already have a good understanding of what are good and bad cards and how to make a curve, it's the players skill that is the most important thing.

I would say, practice will make you better but also watching streamers can help pick up a lot of tips too.

[melzas]

Arena is pretty much all about luck. Sure, knowing which cards are good and which are bad is important, but it's not really a rocket science to look it up on the internets or actually use common sense. I got 12 wins few times but I also had few arenas with 0 wins.

[Korlok]

Getting to 6 wins is actually pretty good. The arena tries to match you up with someone who has as close to your number of wins to losses, so it only makes sense that once you hit the 6 win mark you're going to be fighting people that also have pretty nicely built decks.

A little trick you can try is to count how long it takes to match you up with another player. Once you hit 7 wins or higher, the longer it takes to match you, the more chance that the person it matched you with is lower on the win scale. If it matches you super fast, be ready for a deck of the same caliber.
The same holds true for lower wins. If you're at 1 or 2 wins, and it's taking forever to match you, quit out and try again. Chances are you're about to be matched against a 6+ win deck.

[muto]

Use a website that rates cards. You can also watch Trump, I think his worst games are at 7 wins, at least the ones he uploads to youtube.

yeah Kripp is also a good arena player to watch and streams all the time.

[Deleted]

even though i play hearthstone pretty much daily you are expecting way too much skill. skill based games are ones in which you are given decisions and then you make the correct ones and youll come out on top, in hearthstone your moves are pretty much decided for you.

Thats what players with no skill always claim. There is a reason it is usually the same players who get top legend, win qualifiers and tournaments etc. But it sure is easy to blame RNG.

[Deleted]

...
4. After like 6-0 i get totally destroyed by the next 3 and finish 6-3, max. 7-3

What i think is a little bit a joke: After these 6-0 i meet almost only mages with multi fireballs or flamestrikes or like just before with multiple legendaries...

Same happens to me a lot as well; either I go to 5-7 wins without a loss and then get destroyed, or I lose twice in a row before even 1-2, before I do a crazy win streak. I don't think it's about fireballs, flamestrikes, and legendaries though. Most of my losses can be traced to a lot simpler reasons; like either really bad openers or opponents just getting all right cards when they needed them, most which do not include fireballs or flamestrikes. The last is actually really easy to play around by simply not over-committing the board.

Legendaries seem to play even less of a role, for me or my opponents. I think I've had, maybe one or two legendaries so far, ever on the arena, and couple of days ago when I got 12 wins I had zero legendaries. In my experience the cards that look the most innocuous tend to be the most dangerous. But it is kind of why I've started warming up to arena; because nobody will be playing with a cookie cutter deck, the dynamic of cards is very different, and you really need to make the most of your cards.

[lordsphinx]

You have to realize that “playing around” certain things isn’t just not playing extra minions into a flamestrike. It almost always also includes trading correctly in a particular situation. Let’s take that same Flamestrike situation and make an example… You’re a Warrior playing against a Mage. It’s turn 7 and you went first. You have a Chillwind Yeti, a Spider Tank, and a Wolfrider on the board. Your opponent has an Azure Drake. In your hand you have a Piloted Shredder, a Sunwalker, and another Spider Tank.

Option A.) Trade the Chillwind Yeti into the Azure Drake and play your Shredder and your Spider tank. Go face with the Wolfrider and Spider Tank
Option B.) Trade the Spider Tank and Wolfrider into the Azure Drake and play your Sunwalker. Go face with the Yeti

In option A.) You spent all of your mana, you got in 6 face damage, and you saved all of your minions. You have 5 minions on the board and your opponent has none.
In option B.) You floated 1 mana and you got in 4 face damage. You have 2 minions on the board and your opponent has none.

At first glance, option A.) seems like the better play. You have a dominating board position, you cleared your opponent’s board, and you got in the maximum face damage that you could on that turn. For option B.), you wasted 2 damage by hitting a 1hp minion with 3 damage, and you only ended up with 2 minions on the board instead of 5. Option B is actually the correct play if you’re playing against a Mage. You just completely stumped their turn 7 flamestrike while still maintaining the board. If you chose option A, you should be able to hear the mage’s “Evil Villain” laugh from your end of the computer while he played his Flamestrike and spams “I’m Sorry”.

Then again, maybe the game is 100% luck and RNG. Plays like this make no real difference on the outcome of the game, and choosing option A is perfectly viable =)

[Ravex]

You have to realize that “playing around” certain things isn’t just not playing extra minions into a flamestrike. It almost always also includes trading correctly in a particular situation. Let’s take that same Flamestrike situation and make an example… You’re a Warrior playing against a Mage. It’s turn 7 and you went first. You have a Chillwind Yeti, a Spider Tank, and a Wolfrider on the board. Your opponent has an Azure Drake. In your hand you have a Piloted Shredder, a Sunwalker, and another Spider Tank.

Option A.) Trade the Chillwind Yeti into the Azure Drake and play your Shredder and your Spider tank. Go face with the Wolfrider and Spider Tank
Option B.) Trade the Spider Tank and Wolfrider into the Azure Drake and play your Sunwalker. Go face with the Yeti

In option A.) You spent all of your mana, you got in 6 face damage, and you saved all of your minions. You have 5 minions on the board and your opponent has none.
In option B.) You floated 1 mana and you got in 4 face damage. You have 2 minions on the board and your opponent has none.

At first glance, option A.) seems like the better play. You have a dominating board position, you cleared your opponent’s board, and you got in the maximum face damage that you could on that turn. For option B.), you wasted 2 damage by hitting a 1hp minion with 3 damage, and you only ended up with 2 minions on the board instead of 5. Option B is actually the correct play if you’re playing against a Mage. You just completely stumped their turn 7 flamestrike while still maintaining the board. If you chose option A, you should be able to hear the mage’s “Evil Villain” laugh from your end of the computer while he played his Flamestrike and spams “I’m Sorry”.

Then again, maybe the game is 100% luck and RNG. Plays like this make no real difference on the outcome of the game, and choosing option A is perfectly viable =)

Option C - Kill Azure with Yeti, play sunwalker.

Still plays around flamestike, if he does have it, it hurts a bit more then option B, but you still have a strong board going into the next turn and you avoid making a bad trade in on the assumption of a board clear.

[Mormolyce]

Option C - Kill Azure with Yeti, play sunwalker.

Still plays around flamestike, if he does have it, it hurts a bit more then option B, but you still have a strong board going into the next turn and you avoid making a bad trade in on the assumption of a board clear.

If he does have flamestrike though, you lose your Yeti. The wolf/spider tank will die regardless.

Obviously, if it turns out he doesn't have flamestrike you'd go with option A. But you don't know that.

[Ravex]

If he does have flamestrike though, you lose your Yeti. The wolf/spider tank will die regardless.

Obviously, if it turns out he doesn't have flamestrike you'd go with option A. But you don't know that.

Option A is never an option because it all ins you into a flamestike.

Option B plays ultra safe and you choose to 2 for 1 when its not needed.

I don't like either.

[Fluorescent0]

If he does have flamestrike though, you lose your Yeti. The wolf/spider tank will die regardless.

Obviously, if it turns out he doesn't have flamestrike you'd go with option A. But you don't know that.

And the question becomes "am I okay in him flamestriking a yeti"? Because you wouldn't have the other two minions if you chose to go option B. I would definitely be okay with that.

While value is indeed a concern, tempo plays a major role in arena, especially because with decks not being as combo-based, explosive comebacks are far less likely.

[Mormolyce]

Option A is never an option because it all ins you into a flamestike.

Option B plays ultra safe and you choose to 2 for 1 when its not needed.

I don't like either.

I don't like that my opponent has flamestrike, but there you have it!

[Deleted]

The "randomness" factor, or whatever you want to call it, is very strong with Arena "decks".

I hate that most cards hardly work well together and it comes down to who pulls out the best cards first.
This plays a factor in all matches ofc, but if I make a deck of my own I Always insert multiple mechanics and combo's.

[HisDudeness]

As some have said, alot comes down to the start. For example in an arena I am playing now. Built it around going face. But I keep getting deadly shot and explosive shot in my opener. Shit happens.

[Pyromelter]

I think one mistake new-ish arena players make is to have an even curve, or taking strictly better value minions.

You can almost always get to 7+ wins if you load up on decent quality 2 and 3 drops, with at least 2 cards capable of drawing. You can have a slightly higher curve with little/no draw power, but I feel like going that route requires extreme expertedness, and it also punishes you if someone plays aggro.

Dr. Boom can't do crap if I've got him down to 10 health with a decent board by turn 7. And basically, I just never play around any kind of aoe, unless my board has 2-3 very strong minions to where more minions would be a luxury.

Don't believe me? Here's ratsmah with a 12-win arena run with aggro paladin, most of his minions are not all that great, but he was just able to face-face-face to 12 wins:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkNCuE3yFJU

[Deleted]

I think one mistake new-ish arena players make is to have an even curve, or taking strictly better value minions.

My experience has been the opposite; aggro decks are difficult to build and don't tend to do very well, particularly since your opponent can simply out value you. Sure, if your opponent has a very slow opener, then you co an wreak havoc but if your opponent has a decent deck with good early game, it often gets shutdown hard.

It's one of the things I kind of like about the arena; a lot fewer facehunters and mech mages running around.

Of course you can still play aggressive, but I still prefer doing it with control. Paladin is great for this because of all the blessings and weapons that can quickly ramp an insane amount of burst, but it still can't be the sole focus of the deck, since with random decks you can't rely on perfect draws as much.