Remove LFR? How about we remove mythic cause less than 5% players participate in it?

[Aleksej89]

Really interesting points raised in this thread.

According to the statistics, LFR and Normal are the vast majority of the raiding player base.

And the raiding player base is a bit over half of the entire player base - since 40% of players never even did LFR, let alone other difficulties.

It really makes an interesting point as to what purpose raiding has in WoW.
Sure it should still BE in WoW, but seems raiding no longer can justify being THE ONLY THING that gets new content during an expansion.

[Jtbrig7390]

So like you were saying before the timeless isle right? So friend what you want is daylies? Because ppl said i'm tired of daylies, of dungeon farm to get gear from vendors and guess what you got it! Now if ppl want epics they need to raid! So ppl are getting what they asked for!

I liked timeless island because it was killing mobs for loot out in the open world with 100's around me doing the samething. Then in the center of it we group up and kill the world boss and at the top we do it again. it was active it was fun and didn't feel like you was inside a cave all day long. There was many who enjoyed it for its pvp aspect as well. I am not a fan of dailys but TI's wasn't that bad and was done right.

In truth to brought GW2 to WoW and I enjoyed it.

[Mormolyce]

Any patch can be a major patch. There is no set rule that 6.1 is bla and 6.2 has to be bla bla. If they wanted to add 3 dungeons tomorrow they could.

Yeah sure, but that's not how WoW has worked, ever.

Any proof to this because opinion?

They've said it themselves many times... and... it's obvious? Look at a boss room in a dungeon vs. a raid. What's the difference? The biggest investment and cost is in art resources. A 12 boss raid or 3 4-boss dungeons are pretty much the same thing resource-wise. Only difference is they tend to make the mechanics more complicated, but that's what, a week of extra effort to make 2-3 more mechanics per boss? Plus presumably slightly more testing. All a raid is is a dungeon that's tuned to 10-25 people instead of 5.

People are already psoting Tanaan is a joke and barely anything to do in that zone.

Well QQers are always right aren't they?

You know for a year I had to listen to people bitching that there was nothing to do in TI. I was there yesterday, there are STILL things I haven't finished. Moral of the story: ignore what people say on forums.

Like I have said before if FFXIV can do it why can't WoW....

Go play FFXIV then.

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Sure it should still BE in WoW, but seems raiding no longer can justify being THE ONLY THING that gets new content during an expansion.

No longer? Today 60% of players see at least LFR. Before LFR, something like what, 5-10% of people saw the inside of a raid?

It has far more justification today than it had in Vanilla or TBC.

[Jtbrig7390]

When WoW was at its peak we had heroic (mythic) raiding and no LFR. :/

There is nothing wrong with putting development time into something that people can strive for.

Nope no LFR at all but we did have 10man and 25man normal that was puggable. I got my LK kill in a 10man Pug.

Also the last quater of Wrath is when we had the first major sub loss. Then Cata came and blizzard wanted to make it TBC 2.0 diffcuilty and more left. Not that was the only reason but it helped. Also to add a LFG system was planned for Wrath when LFG for dungeons came out but they wasn't ready to release it. With subs bleeding it got release with DS and slowed down the bleed and gave people something to do.

Is it the core reason the sub bleed slowed down....Nope but it sure as hell helped.

[HeiAggra]

Really interesting points raised in this thread.

According to the statistics, LFR and Normal are the vast majority of the raiding player base.

And the raiding player base is a bit over half of the entire player base - since 40% of players never even did LFR, let alone other difficulties.

It really makes an interesting point as to what purpose raiding has in WoW.
Sure it should still BE in WoW, but seems raiding no longer can justify being THE ONLY THING that gets new content during an expansion.

PPL have content to do, reps, mounts, quests, achives, pet battles, CM and a few more. No was much as in other expansion im not saying that but ppl are just to lazy! Like the other thread about the mount that costs 200K apexis! See a reason to do apexis and ppl were saying there NAH! I won't go farm them to much to do! So when they have a reason to do something they just don't want it. PPL are lazy, they just want all straight away. Also i remember a guys asking why best gear is in raids if he just kills to farm and get profession stuff and do quests. So i ask him do you need to do 50K on world moobs? See where i'm going? PPL that put effort in raiding despite the difficulty should be rewarded is that simple

[Palemaster]

According to the statistics, LFR and Normal are the vast majority of the raiding player base.

It's not true.

The graph describes how many players (out of 2.1M) have killed the specific boss on a specific difficulty on one character at least once.
So the % of players who killed Gruul in LFR can also include the same players who killed him on heroic and mythic (it's double dipping, or quadruple dipping in this case).
The only actual data we have is how many players killed bosses on mythic difficulty. The graph does not describe how many people raid only LFR, only normal or only heroic.

[Jtbrig7390]

Go play FFXIV then.

Who says I'm not playing FFXIV. I still like WOW and I wish for it to be better but in its current state its not even worth playing as a B2p title.

Asking people to pay $10 more on the xpac cost and milking people with the shop without providing any content has gotten old. When blizzard gets there act together ill be happy to come back until then ill just keep my eye on WoW.

Like I have asked before when was the last time you 100% believed blizzard when they said they cared about the community. All blizzard care's about now is money and WOD proves it. I get it they are a company and they got to make money. But there is a difference in doing it with the love of the community and just milking them.

[Glorious Leader]

How would they add more dungeons when there hasn't been a major content patch yet? We're still finishing the first tier of the expansion.

In any case, adding dungeons in an expansion is not a great use of resources. They require about the same amount of resources per boss to create as a raid, and the content lasts a week

Not if you put a shiny currency behind them. Dungeons in wrath were being used right up till ICC.

[lukyl]

These graphs are COMPLETELY unreliable , if you can honestly tell me that 50% of the level 100 plyers you come by are decked out only in questing greens and dungeon blues, and NOT in full raiding gear often mixed between lfr/norm/heroic , then you can spout your BS about how no one is raiding. But the fact is you will barely find anyone in lesser gear then lfr proving the majprity DO raid, and mythic being there is a fantastic thing because it creates incentive whether you do it or not.

[Jtbrig7390]

Not if you put a shiny currency behind them. Dungeons I in wrath were being used right up till ICC.

Dungeons in Wrath was being used even when ICC was out even with the 3 5-man dungeons they added. They had a reason to do them.

Like I have said many times Blizzard just needs to copy FFXIV's system.

[HeiAggra]

Who says I'm not playing FFXIV. I still like WOW and I wish for it to be better but in its current state its not even worth playing as a B2p title.

Asking people to pay $10 more on the xpac cost and milking people with the shop without providing any content has gotten old. When blizzard gets there act together ill be happy to come back until then ill just keep my eye on WoW.

Like I have asked before when was the last time you 100% believed blizzard when they said they cared about the community. All blizzard care's about now is money and WOD proves it. I get it they are a company and they got to make money. But there is a difference in doing it with the love of the community and just milking them.

Sorry but this is just BS, i don't think Blizz doesnt care for players that give them most of their annual revennue! They made bad calls? YES! They will continue to do some bad calls? I think so! It's possible to please all players? HELL NO! So i try to enjoy with my friends in game and do what i like more in wow. Raids and Mount farm.

[Jtbrig7390]

Sorry but this is just BS, i don't think Blizz doesnt care for players that give them most of their annual revennue! They made bad calls? YES! They will continue to do some bad calls? I think so! It's possible to please all players? HELL NO! So i try to enjoy with my friends in game and do what i like more in wow. Raids and Mount farm.

Just have to agree to disagree. I feel blizzard only cares about $$$ now compared to years back.

But thats my opinion. Like I said when was the last time they said they cared for the community and you 100% believed them.

[HeiAggra]

Just have to agree to disagree. I feel blizzard only cares about $$$ now compared to years back.

But thats my opinion. Like I said when was the last time they said they cared for the community and you 100% believed them.

I tell you why i think they care! PPL did not want more daylies. They gone! PPL did not want valor points because it would maked them run everyday a dungeon and a scenario! They gone! PPL wanted World PVP! Ashran! I hate it but it's there!

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Lol, pretty sure no one would care if Paragon, Blood Legion and the rest of 5 10/10 M guilds in the world would suddenly quit the game. Blizzard is effectively making content for 5 guilds while everyone whines about non-raid content.

Actually theres more guild's with 10/10M

[Gilian]

Seriously, look at the armory stats from the front page - only 3,99% of players killed Gruul and 4,6% killed Oregorger on Mythic difficulty.

How about, instead of wasting resources on making mythic-only abilities/bosses Blizzard focuses on content for the MAJORITY of their playerbase?

Developing Mythic difficulty is a waste of time at this point.

Sure, whatever.

Just don't think you will get anything back in return. There won't suddenly be more non-raid content.

[Xirev]

When I read "Yes remove Mythic" I can't help but feel that it is to punish players that are better/ have more time on their hands. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it shouldn't exist. And I hardly believe removing one difficulty would equal more content. Tuning and adding in some extra textures and abilities takes a lot less time than making another dungeon or bigger zones.

[Xeerah]

Lol, pretty sure no one would care if Paragon, Blood Legion and the rest of 5 10/10 M guilds in the world would suddenly quit the game. Blizzard is effectively making content for 5 guilds while everyone whines about non-raid content.

Are you even trying to be serious here?
Every Guild having killed at least 1/10 M is a mythic guild and in this regard the content is relevant to them.
(Currently i am 7/10 - guild disbanded and i went to a 9/10 guild - so its relevant for me)
If u remove the Content from them guess what - oh we have cleared HC gonna unsub.
Thats where it will lead (and i think - ASSUMPTION - that many wont bother resubbing -> i wouldnt).

And another fact:
Guess whos writing boss guides, class guides, guides how to farm XYZ?
Right its mostly the ppl who would be gone then.

[phantummy]

If mythic was gone I wouldn't even notice. I wouldn't mind if they diverted resources from mythic to create more content.

[HeiAggra]

Sure, whatever.

Just don't think you will get anything back in return. There won't suddenly be more non-raid content.

I'm there but to get a kill doesnt mean theres no ppl do it and wipping on it!

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If mythic was gone I wouldn't even notice. I wouldn't mind if they diverted resources from mythic to create more content.

What content?

[Glorious Leader]

Are you even trying to be serious here?
Every Guild having killed at least 1/10 M is a mythic guild and in this regard the content is relevant to them.
(Currently i am 7/10 - guild disbanded and i went to a 9/10 guild - so its relevant for me)
If u remove the Content from them guess what - oh we have cleared HC gonna unsub.
Thats where it will lead (and i think - ASSUMPTION - that many wont bother resubbing -> i wouldnt).

And another fact:
Guess whos writing boss guides, class guides, guides how to farm XYZ?
Right its mostly the ppl who would be gone then.

If I went in general chat asked people if they had any clue who midwinter was I think at absolute best you'd get somebody ggolign them or doing /who. The top end raiding guilds are so obscure and also nobody gives a shit.

The game has an in game boss guide now. The game has little to no farm left for their to be farm guides. The game had an extremely limited class guide that should be expanded on. You don't paragon or I'd winter for any of that.

[Yuna]

I would like to summarize my post from different threads here, in my opinion it´s the most obvious answer to all your questions and should get rid of the "remove lfr/mythic" drama:

The Statistics only represent 2.1m players in a very small spectrum:

My accountwide Blackhand Kills for example:

LFR: 0
Normal: 0
Heroic: 14
Mythic: 7

I am not represented in the LFR or Normal statistic, as are many others from my guild alone. If you add all those on top of it, the whole graph would shift.

If you look at the "participation" and "lack" of content from a design standpoint, as was stated by Blizzard devs:

They at first try to create "heroic" content and tone numbers down or up, remove or add abilities for their needs which leads to normal/mythic content. Modelling and Art are the biggest time/resource consumers here. Most ideas get scrapped during the development process as it would take to long to pursue them.

The Prime Question would be:

Can they create new Dungeons/Battlegrounds/Outdoor Content, which would require to model and texture entire new Instances/Zones/NPC´s, if they only removed "mythic only abilities"? Because thats what mythic is, toned up numbers and 1-2 new abilities per boss, based on the heroic version.

I would say no, because it´s easier to add/remove on/from existing content and add flavor, different goals/tactics, achievements than it is to create entirely new content from scratch. Assets will always be reused if possible because it´s logical.

Conclusion:

Both LFR and Mythic content are more likely than entirely new content (dungeon/bg/outdoor), so both have it´s place and right to be there, because it is the least effort for the developers. If they want to add NEW content every major patch, it will either be a Raid + Outdoor Zone like 5.2 Isle of Thunder (which was great btw) or a mix of Dungeons + 1 Battleground.

The Sad Truth: Something like Tempest Keep or Serpentshrine Caverns or even Icecrown Citadel (Dungeons + Raid) is longer being added in Patches, but as a "seller" of a new expac or in other words, as a Grand Opening.