Refugees : what do they become ?

[apepi]

Send um to UK and Japan, they need more people.

[Deleted]

It would be less 'smug' if you didn't actually treat your Arab minorities like garbage.

And no, taxes are not 'too high'.

You toss this phrases around, as someone who thinks, that he knows about what he's talking about.

Care to elaborate, where you insight comes from, before I pick it apart?

[draganid]

well maybe instead of treating them like niggers make them feel more acclimatised and force them to integrate more. sending them to their own little ghettos and then sending a cheque once a month obviously isnt working

[GennGreymane]

I don't have a problem with immigrants or in this case refugees if they contribute and want to integrate. Like in the US I have no problem at all with illegal immigrants... They want to be American, they want to integrate, they want to work, many pay taxes yet receive no government support, they work the jobs most people don't want to work, etc...

In Europe though... A lot of the refugees they are getting don't want to integrate, they don't want to be more western, the only thing they wanted when coming there was to not live in the middle of a war torn failed state.

Also a lot of people forget a small detail about those immigrating to the U.S is that they share a culture with similar roots. Yes they may not speak English, but many of those south of the boarder enjoy good ole christian family values. They also share a history of repelling a European colonizer.

[Deleted]

well maybe instead of *1 treating them like niggers make them feel more acclimatised and force them to integrate more. sending them to their *2 own little ghettos and then sending a cheque once a month obviously isnt working

Yes, one more "know it all" sitting on the other side of the pond.

I give you a little hint whats going wrong here in comparison with the US / Canada.
Two words: selection process.

If you massively let people in, who are ... useless (due to their low education and therefore 0 use for the job market.) + (the glaring cultural differences due to religious beliefs, traditions a.m.m.). This is what you get - a divided society.
People can only integrate themselves, if they are actually able to get into the job market as fast as possible.

But OK, lets see what you did write there.

*1 We treat them as niggers?

No... in Germany during the harvest, there is the need for many harvest hands. You know where they come from? Poland / Czechoslovakia ... mostly from Eastern Europe. You won't see many Arabs there.
Interesting, don't you think?
You don't have to be very educated or have a degree, to be a harvest hand. I could expand this example to most of the lower wages sector in Europe.

*2 Which brings me to... the ghettos.
No, nobody puts them there. It's a free choice, that they started to assemble in one particular part of their new hometown. Being the language barrier (which due to their low education is hard to overcome.), the cultural differences or simply the fact, that they like to tend to their own.

[Piglord]

Thanksgiving dinner

[nextormento]

It would be less 'smug' if you didn't actually treat your Arab minorities like garbage.

You should really elaborate if you want this illiterate and irrational bashing to make any sense.

[Dezerte]

They become all sorts of people. Some become productive while some become detrimental to society.

I think the core issue here is integration, which can be an issue created from both indigenous and refugees. And both sides make some valid arguments, e.g. anti-refugees may say that we can't accept so many so that our integration falls apart from the pressure put on it. While a pro-refugee can say that if the indigenous people are hostile and non-welcoming to refugees they only make the problem worse.

[Deleted]

You should really elaborate if you want this illiterate and irrational bashing to make any sense.

What about the arab minorities who treat the natives like garbage and advocate the adoption of sharia law in Europe?

[Deleted]

I'm not talking about illegal immigrants, but those with the refugee status

Send them back. 99% of the ones that seek refugee in EU are not even from conflict zones and they cross 5-10 countries to even make to EU. You think if they were fleeing they would go to the first country where it seems it's stable, yet they risk their live to cross the sea and illegal in 5+ countries just to make it to EU.

For americans this would be like mexicans illegal crossing US to get to Canada for refugee.

[Deleted]

instead of treating them like niggers

You have no idea about the situation here, do you? Please inform yourself.

make them feel more acclimatised and force them to integrate more.

The first has been tried and is still being tried, they laugh at it, grab the benefits and then spit at the people. The second one has in this thead already described as "oppression" and "intolerance".

sending them to their own little ghettos

Nobody is sending them there, they're building them themselves. They are actively segregating themselves both from the host nations populace and any other European/different group. They are mostly just accepting groups from a similar background and even then you have your occasional issues with these groups infighting.

They do not want to be part of those societies, most of them outright say so and will tell you to your face if asked, they LOATH the society that took them in, it's values and ethics.

and then sending a cheque once a month obviously isnt working

Yeah, except that there isn't much else to do as they're most often not interested in anything. A lot of them are actually getting social benefits while simultaneously "working" with working ranging from drug dealing to minor criminality, bouncers are clubs and so on and on. Basically they're happily double dipping on low income jobs. They have also outright taken over some groups such as "Bouncers" and use it for turf wars, to get control over etablishments and so on and on.

Send them back. 99% of the ones that seek refugee in EU are not even from conflict zones and they cross 5-10 countries to even make to EU. You think if they were fleeing they would go to the first country where it seems it's stable, yet they risk their live to cross the sea and illegal in 5+ countries just to make it to EU.

Because most of them are economic refugees, it's something people steadfastly refuse to acknowledge. Somehow every single last one of them is a war refugee from the recent conflicts. You can bring it up as often as you want, they will either not comment on it or gloss it over.

For americans this would be like mexicans illegal crossing US to get to Canada for refugee.

Closer to some South Americans making their way through the entirety of South America to reach Canada then claiming they came from a civil war wrecked Mexico (which they happily passed on their way) after having spend a few thousand dollars their family collects to send them off so they could eventually bring the entire family over once they etablished themselves.

[Deleted]

Because most of them are economic refugees, it's something people steadfastly refuse to acknowledge. Somehow every single last one of them is a war refugee from the recent conflicts. You can bring it up as often as you want, they will either not comment on it or gloss it over.

There are two kinds of people, who are refusing to acknowledge the problem.
One are the useful idiots, who are being exploited by the second kind of people, who will directly benefit from this.

And regarding the benefits for some special people I have this little analogy:
The Magicians trick is, to redirect the auditions attention away from what a Magician is truly doing.

And a little hint for that is the frightening pace of how they cut the fundamental rights of the citizens in the EU.

[kendro1200]

I don't have a problem with immigrants or in this case refugees if they contribute and want to integrate. Like in the US I have no problem at all with illegal immigrants... They want to be American, they want to integrate, they want to work, many pay taxes yet receive no government support, they work the jobs most people don't want to work, etc...

In Europe though... A lot of the refugees they are getting don't want to integrate, they don't want to be more western, the only thing they wanted when coming there was to not live in the middle of a war torn failed state.

Most immigrants that come to the U.S. don't want to integrate anymore, in fact just the opposite, there is the expectation that the country will bend over backwards to adapt to them. The melting pot stopped working decades ago, when traveling became quick and fairly affordable. Illegal immigrants are often some of the worst when it comes to refusal to integrate. They skipped the stupidly long and painful immigration process through proper channels, so there is less of a forward investment for them to make it work. Illegal immigrants also need to draw less attention to themselves, so attending programs, where they have to provide identifying information, in order to become better educated in culture, language and acquiring skills to help them in the workforce or life, is completely out of the question.
The U.S. needs immigration reform, and it also needs to get rid of illegal immigrants (because they did break the law, getting rid doesn't necessarily mean deport, but they do need to be taken care of). The U.S. also needs to dictate an official language. Enforcing a singular language for communication is the first and best step to enable immigrant integration.

[Mihalik]

This is a touchy questions for me, because I'm a grandchild of refugees.

My maternal grandparents left Greece in 1949 in the wake of the Greek Civil War. My father's mother left Hungary in 1946 after the Soviet Occupation, she was 16 at the time and has been raped at least twice before finally reaching American controlled Austria. My grandfather left Hungary after the Hungarian revolution in 1956 as he didn't want to become a Russian PoW again, as he already been to Siberia once between 1945 and 1948.

My Greek grandparents went into retail, and my Hungarian grandparents, my grandmother has become a Chef and my grandfather thought math, still none of my grandparents spoke their new countries languages fluently, they always made mistakes and were heavily accented, yet they were all successful in the end.

Refugees aren't necessarily a drain on the societies they join. But a lot depends on the education that was available to them and the treatment they received in their new homelands.

[Ave07]

I see a lot of Syrian and Iraqi refugees at the mosque my dad goes to asking for donations from the people who go there.

The government needs to do something instead of just bringing them here and dumping them out on the streets and forgetting they exist.