Haste or MS for combat cleave fights

[sk8jack]

For combat spec, would you enchant/socket your gear for haste or MS?
For Hans and Franz I know that haste will outweight MS since you will be hitting only one or two targets at all time.
But what about for fights like Flamebender, Operator Thogar, Iron Maidens, Blast Furnace?
For Flamebender and Thogar the adds usually dies quickly so most of the fights will be single target, hence will it be more beneficial to enchant/socket haste over MS?
Or will MS be better for increased DPS during add phases?
Which will provide higher damage overall?

[Laykra]

Just go with MS taladite, it's better than haste for your off spec and the damage increase/decrease from using haste taladite won't be that high. Also you should check out shadowcraft to see your stat weights.

[Kaite]

I'd hazard a guess that MS overall is better if you want to pad. Use Haste for progression.

[Laykra]

You should also give Sub a try, it's a bit hard in the start, but after a week you will be able contribute a little more than you can in combat spec, that goes atleast for some BrF fights like beastmaster. Thou if your raid team lacks strong cleave damage then just keep using bladefury. This is my opinion and in the end you should do what you feel is most fun.

[Deleted]

Haste is overall better for combat. In the optimal case and with some luck you may get more dps with ms against operator or blast furnace, though the gain will be probably not more than 1%, and you do less dmg on primary/focus target.

[Deleted]

Haste is overall better for combat. In the optimal case and with some luck you may get more dps with ms against operator or blast furnace, though the gain will be probably not more than 1%, and you do less dmg on primary/focus target.

This isn't true. Multistrike is only slightly behind haste on 2 targets, and overtakes it quite comfortably when you're hitting 3 targets and more. People seem to do sims etc for combat and look only at 1 target, which shows haste to be the best stat and they automatically think they should be maximising haste for combat, which isn't necessarily true.

The only time you should really be playing combat is for cleave fights anyway, so multistrike is more valuable in these conditions. Also helpfully, multistrike is the best stat for Subtlety, so for single target fights you just switch to sub, and can keep the same gear (apart from weapons ofc, and maybe trinkets) and your multistrike gems remain valuable.

Haste is still obviously an important stat for combat, but as far as gemming/enchanting, if you play both combat and sub (you should be) then if you 're gemming/enchanting for multistrike then you cant go far wrong.

[gahddo]

This isn't true. Multistrike is only slightly behind haste on 2 targets, and overtakes it quite comfortably when you're hitting 3 targets and more. People seem to do sims etc for combat and look only at 1 target, which shows haste to be the best stat and they automatically think they should be maximising haste for combat, which isn't necessarily true.

The only time you should really be playing combat is for cleave fights anyway, so multistrike is more valuable in these conditions. Also helpfully, multistrike is the best stat for Subtlety, so for single target fights you just switch to sub, and can keep the same gear (apart from weapons ofc, and maybe trinkets) and your multistrike gems remain valuable.

Haste is still obviously an important stat for combat, but as far as gemming/enchanting, if you play both combat and sub (you should be) then if you 're gemming/enchanting for multistrike then you cant go far wrong.

As far as simc goes, haste/multistrike/mastery are all incredibly close for 1-2 targets. Once you start getting into sustained cleave fights like iron maidens, multistrike is just flat out better than haste because of the BF/poison/MS interaction.

My line of thought is that I'm only ever going to play combat for cleave/aoe fights, so I might as well just gem multistrike because it's the best for subt and quite good for assassination too.

[Deleted]

This isn't true. Multistrike is only slightly behind haste on 2 targets, and overtakes it quite comfortably when you're hitting 3 targets and more. People seem to do sims etc for combat and look only at 1 target, which shows haste to be the best stat and they automatically think they should be maximising haste for combat, which isn't necessarily true.

As far as simc goes, haste/multistrike/mastery are all incredibly close for 1-2 targets. Once you start getting into sustained cleave fights like iron maidens, multistrike is just flat out better than haste because of the BF/poison/MS interaction.

Do you have simc-results for it / which show that you gain much more than 1% dps? Here are Rymes
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post33433875
My results with my gears are not much different.

Sub/Offspec is another subject.

[Deleted]

Well its unclear from OP if hes just playing combat every fight, if he is then I'd agree more haste is worthwhile as itll help the single target dps. My point mainly was that if youre switching between sub and combat depending on the fight, it works quite nicely to just have a pure multistrike set and gems and for the sake of marginal gains I wouldnt be regemming. I think the only changes I make between my sets atm apart from weapons and trinkets is a cloak and bracers with some haste on for combat.