6.2 Guardian BiS armor

[Thoranax]

So after doing a couple hours of comparing and figuring stuff out. I figured out our BEST(imo) armor comp for this raid tier.
Weapon: bite of bleeding hallow - kilrogg
Helm: oathclaw helm
Neck: 715 mastery/multi crafted amulet
Shoulders: mythic BRF tier
Cloak: 715 mastery/multi crafted cloak
Chest: mythic BRF tier
Wrists: mythic bracers of shattered stalactites - koromog BRF
Gloves: mythic cannonball loaders gloves- BRF
Waist: 715 mastery/multi crafted belt
Legs: Oathclaw leggings
Feet: toxicologists treated boots-
Kilrogg
Rings: legendary ring, pit extracted stone signet- kormrok hcf
Trinks: Anzu's cursed plum- shadow lord iskar, and mythic blast furnace door from brf

Seams pretty lame we can't get better gear from this tier.

This build will maximize our mastery>multistrike>no other stat helps us tank

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Just to put things in perspective we bears will have a constant ~60+% mastery ~30+% multistrike going with buffs. We don't really need the extra stamina for any reason thanks to our multistrike and with procs we should be over 80% mastery for 70% of the fight.

[Jellospally]

You are better off using the MS/BA or Mas/BA neck in the instance and the Mas/BA cloak. Archi has a 720 Mas/MS belt as well.

Probably rather use Tablet/Anzu instead of BFD/Anzu.

If you really wanted to craft loot. Craft boots if you want Mas/MS and something like Shoulders/Bracers. Kormrok doesn't have a Ring. Your best ring is either Fel Lords MS/BA ring or Mannos Mas/BA ring depending on what you are favoring.

Also we are gonna have so much mastery in a H HFC only Setup that you are better off using some of the 710/715 Crit/MS items because of higher ilvl and lot of a MS.

[heyitsqi]

You're a tank so why wouldn't you want bonus armor???

[Deleted]

because of the procs. also, hfc gear got a lot of BA on ring/neck/cloak + anzu trinket

[Thoranax]

You are better off using the MS/BA or Mas/BA neck in the instance and the Mas/BA cloak. Archi has a 720 Mas/MS belt as well.

Probably rather use Tablet/Anzu instead of BFD/Anzu.

If you really wanted to craft loot. Craft boots if you want Mas/MS and something like Shoulders/Bracers. Kormrok doesn't have a Ring. Your best ring is either Fel Lords MS/BA ring or Mannos Mas/BA ring depending on what you are favoring.

Also we are gonna have so much mastery in a H HFC only Setup that you are better off using some of the 710/715 Crit/MS items because of higher ilvl and lot of a MS.

You clearly haven't actually looked at the stats on HFC gear vs BRF gear. All the stuff I picked is optimized for maximum mastery and multi. If you use HFC gear you will have a mix of haste and crit scattered in for no reason.

Second, my set allowsnyou to benefit from 2 different sets. A) the BRF 2 set let's you keep the extra rage from maul proc B) the HFC 4 set isnt so important cause our resolve+frenzie is amazing spike heals already.

MASTERY>BONUS ARMOR. With 1k bonus armor you get enough armor to boost your passive physical damage reduction ~6% while the about 400 mastery and multi from crafted, gives you about 5% mastery AND 5% multi...

[Deleted]

You clearly haven't actually looked at the stats on HFC gear vs BRF gear.

yeah, he is known to be unprepaired *kappa

T17 2 set is nice to have, but:
- only shpulders got Ma/Ms on it. so you will get more crit in the mix (also crit is the higher stat on the T17 chest)
- if the two items are non WF / socket, than 15 itemlevel are MILES ahead
- you got more than enough rage for TaC

you aim for Ma > Ms > rest, but take a weapon with Crit and lower DPS instead of Ma/Ms.
also, if you that think the difference between +20 itemlevel on your gear is the amount of HP you get, you should read some guides.

[Thoranax]

yeah, he is known to be unprepaired *kappa

T17 2 set is nice to have, but:
- only shpulders got Ma/Ms on it. so you will get more crit in the mix (also crit is the higher stat on the T17 chest)
- if the two items are non WF / socket, than 15 itemlevel are MILES ahead
- you got more than enough rage for TaC

you aim for Ma > Ms > rest, but take a weapon with Crit and lower DPS instead of Ma/Ms.
also, if you that think the difference between +20 itemlevel on your gear is the amount of HP you get, you should read some guides.

Why would 15-20 items levels over power set bonus PLUS better secondary stats? We already have more than enough stam... More agiliy, thus more dps would be nice, but multi provides more dps too..

[Merlinb]

My personal BiS list I made about 10 minutes before our HFC raid started is:

Head - Tier ( Kormrok)
Neck - Contained Fel Orb Locket ( Socrethar)
Shoulders - Tier ( Xhul'orac )
Back - Void Lord's Wizened Cloak ( Xhul'orac )
Chest - Tier ( Mannoroth )
Wrists - Manacles of the Multitudes ( Fel Lord )
gloves - Felfinger Runegloves ( Archimonde )
belt - Waistwrap of Banishment ( Archimonde )
legs - tier ( Gorefiend )
boots - Toxicologist's Treated boots ( Kilrogg )
Ring 1 - Mannoroth's Calcified Eye ( Mannoroth )
Ring 2 - legendary Ring
Trinket 1 - Anzu's Cursed Plume ( Shadowlord Iskar )
Trinket 2 - Seed of Creation/Blademaster ( Archimonde/Council )
Weapon - Xutenash, Glaive of Ruin ( Mannoroth )

The rings/cloak/neck might change to the multistrike versions after I actually start thinking about it, until then this is full mastery > multistrike with enchants towards MS.

[Jellospally]

You clearly haven't actually looked at the stats on HFC gear vs BRF gear. All the stuff I picked is optimized for maximum mastery and multi. If you use HFC gear you will have a mix of haste and crit scattered in for no reason.

Second, my set allowsnyou to benefit from 2 different sets. A) the BRF 2 set let's you keep the extra rage from maul proc B) the HFC 4 set isnt so important cause our resolve+frenzie is amazing spike heals already.

MASTERY>BONUS ARMOR. With 1k bonus armor you get enough armor to boost your passive physical damage reduction ~6% while the about 400 mastery and multi from crafted, gives you about 5% mastery AND 5% multi...

Thing is you don't need that much Mastery to live with Anzus. Also BA and Crit give dps which is good you don't just stack mitigation and afk.

[Dreyen]

Why would 15-20 items levels over power set bonus PLUS better secondary stats? We already have more than enough stam... More agiliy, thus more dps would be nice, but multi provides more dps too..

I think you don't realize how powerful armor, stamina and agility are for bear tanks... Having some crit and haste is not a big deal. I mean... you want 2p T17 to keep the rage reduction but you don't want rage stats? What? haste is also not too bad, it gives you more multistrikes from autottacks, more T&C procs, more rage...

Keeping gear 15-20 ilevels below is just severely gimping yourself.

[Thoranax]

Thing is you don't need that much Mastery to live with Anzus. Also BA and Crit give dps which is good you don't just stack mitigation and afk.

I understand that raidwide dps is important... But our dps isn't that important compared to our ability to survive. Saying "you don't need that much mastery" doesn't make any sense. Our WHOLE defense is based around our mastery. Most of the damage in ANY fight is physical...

Mastery>haste- even though haste raises rage, mastery will absorb more damage thus less rage usage anyways. Plus we already generate a fuck load of rage with soul of the forest and dream of cen.

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I think you don't realize how powerful armor, stamina and agility are for bear tanks... Having some crit and haste is not a big deal. I mean... you want 2p T17 to keep the rage reduction but you don't want rage stats? What? haste is also not too bad, it gives you more multistrikes from autottacks, more T&C procs, more rage...

Keeping gear 15-20 ilevels below is just severely gimping yourself.

Why do we need more stamina? I'm ilvl 697 with BRF gear... During fights my hp ranges between 750k-800k from MULTISTRIKE proc. No fight in HFC is going to hit you for over 300k if properly mitigated.

YES, I would keep the ability to maintain 60%+ mastery (no procs) and 30% multistrike (no procs) over the oodles of stamina and agility that the 20 ilvls gives me.

With what the new gear looks like, they probably realize how strong a bear's mastery is and accordingly reduced the amount that comes on the new tanking gear.

[Jellospally]

I'll let you know why we don't need mastery when I tank mythic progression and we are perfectly fine with me having little mastery and stacking MS/Crit with higher Ilvl loot.

Mastery is strong yes. So is Multistrike for all the magic damage combo'd with the melees obviously we don't need 2m hp, but it doesn't hurt and neither does a dps gain. Any tank who shrugs off dps gains is still in the wrong mindset. Tanks are there to do damage and tank. Not just tank.

20ilvls is better than a mas/ms piece unless you are talking like crit/has... ya that combo of stats is gay but not 1 item in HFC has that that we are forced to wear.

There is also no point in which BA is worse than Mas or MS as well.

[Thoranax]

I'll let you know why we don't need mastery when I tank mythic progression and we are perfectly fine with me having little mastery and stacking MS/Crit with higher Ilvl loot.

Mastery is strong yes. So is Multistrike for all the magic damage combo'd with the melees obviously we don't need 2m hp, but it doesn't hurt and neither does a dps gain. Any tank who shrugs off dps gains is still in the wrong mindset. Tanks are there to do damage and tank. Not just tank.

20ilvls is better than a mas/ms piece unless you are talking like crit/has... ya that combo of stats is gay but not 1 item in HFC has that that we are forced to wear.

There is also no point in which BA is worse than Mas or MS as well.

How much dps do you want bears to pull? I average around 30kdps with my current BRF gear... I'm sure with the HFC upgrades it will be around 35-40k. Should we be pulling more dps? I don't think it's priority over survival.

Your argument for bonus armor is .... Not there. Bonus armor just raises your passive ability to block physical damage...which you'll only be able to stack enough bonus armor to add 5-7% to that passive effect. If you stack mastery you'll just be absorbing that physical damage.

I don't think you even looked at stat weights before you spoke

[Deleted]

at this point I think you are just a troll

[Dreyen]

How much dps do you want bears to pull? I average around 30kdps with my current BRF gear... I'm sure with the HFC upgrades it will be around 35-40k. Should we be pulling more dps? I don't think it's priority over survival.

Your argument for bonus armor is .... Not there. Bonus armor just raises your passive ability to block physical damage...which you'll only be able to stack enough bonus armor to add 5-7% to that passive effect. If you stack mastery you'll just be absorbing that physical damage.

I don't think you even looked at stat weights before you spoke

All I read from your posts:

I don't need more hp
I don't need more dps
I don't need more armor from higher ilevel gear
I don't need more rage but i really like 2piece since it helps my rage
I just want mastery and multistrike... but i dont want more hp!

Basically you don't seem to care about improving your character, you just like getting high mastery.

Point is: If you use your gearing strategy of keeping BRF gear, you WILL be a weaker tank.
Bonus armor doesn't cap, it's always bis. You might think 5-7% phys DR from armor is not a lot, but each perecentage from armor is exponential. 1% DR from armor at this point is much better than 2% mastery.

While you get your 60% mastery 30% multistrike ill be busy getting similar stats, except with 1000+ more stamina and agility, which will improve my healthpool exponentially compared to yours, improve my dps greatly, give me some dodge, add a lot of armor from the armor on the gear, and improve my self-healing via the attack power from agility. I'll probably end up with 200-400k hp more hp than you after multistrike, maybe 5% less mastery, but significantly more rage gen, and a huge chunk of dps probably 10k more.

If you talk stat weights, you definitely did not look at them.. BA, armor from gear, stamina and agi are all rated above mastery and multistrike by a good chunk.

[heyitsqi]

How much dps do you want bears to pull? I average around 30kdps with my current BRF gear... I'm sure with the HFC upgrades it will be around 35-40k. Should we be pulling more dps? I don't think it's priority over survival.

Your argument for bonus armor is .... Not there. Bonus armor just raises your passive ability to block physical damage...which you'll only be able to stack enough bonus armor to add 5-7% to that passive effect. If you stack mastery you'll just be absorbing that physical damage.

I don't think you even looked at stat weights before you spoke

...bonus armor increases AP. It's not a zero DPS stat. Why do you think BA pots are better dps wise and mitigation wise over agility? Or have you been using agility pots all this time?

[Jellospally]

How much dps do you want bears to pull? I average around 30kdps with my current BRF gear... I'm sure with the HFC upgrades it will be around 35-40k. Should we be pulling more dps? I don't think it's priority over survival.

Your argument for bonus armor is .... Not there. Bonus armor just raises your passive ability to block physical damage...which you'll only be able to stack enough bonus armor to add 5-7% to that passive effect. If you stack mastery you'll just be absorbing that physical damage.

I don't think you even looked at stat weights before you spoke

Pretty sure everyone in this thread is in agreement you don't know what you are talking about and are a troll. This is a nice thread.

[Bobby1291]

I had a good time reading this thread, boys. Gave me a good laugh on a Monday morning.

[CenariusTheForestLord]

I had a good time reading this thread, boys. Gave me a good laugh on a Monday morning.

Indeed, exactly what I needed. Thank you very much OP.

[teddabear]

Doesn't any leather with bonus armor override anything on that BIS list? My preference would be 1) Bonus armor, 2) Warforged, 3) Your BIS list.