Demonic Phylactery? Healers

[Daystar]

Ok so all the healers in my guild are arguing about this trinket on who should get it first for mythic progression and i want to see what others think about it?
Hpally
Rdruid
Rshaman
MW
Priest?

[PosPosPos]

Ok so all the healers in my guild are arguing about this trinket on who should get it first for mythic progression and i want to see what others think about it?
Hpally
Rdruid
Rshaman
MW
Priest?

In order of effective spirit value, starting from the highest
1) Rdruid
2) Disc Priest(Mindbender users)/Holy Priest
3) Disc Priest(Solace users)
4) Holy Paladin/Mistweaver/Rsham

Adjusting for maximum progression benefit:

1) Disc Priest(both specs)
2) Rdruid
3*) Mistweaver/Holy Paladin/Rsham
4) Holy Priest

*Depending on what the raid needs.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...Xuo/edit#gid=0

Casts per minute gathered from BRF encounters which should be diverse enough to give a general idea.

The raw spirit value is best for Disc Priests but since Haste is the best secondary stat for Resto Druids it's slightly better for them, still more or less mandatory for all healers though. It's best (for obvious reasons) for the specs that use the most instant casts and worse for the channeling/long cast healers, which are your monks and shamans.

[PosPosPos]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...Xuo/edit#gid=0

Casts per minute gathered from BRF encounters which should be diverse enough to give a general idea.

The raw spirit value is best for Disc Priests but since Haste is the best secondary stat for Resto Druids it's slightly better for them, still more or less mandatory for all healers though. It's best (for obvious reasons) for the specs that use the most instant casts and worse for the channeling/long cast healers, which are your monks and shamans.

It's actually very inaccurate to gauge the value of the trinket by using the casting pattern without the trinket itself, because it's a fact that many healers are able to and will spam a lot more when they get the trinket versus without it, or cast more expensive/fast spells.

Holy Paladins get to hit a lot more FoL casts than without the trinket for one, and roughly half of the sample size used did not properly control for factors like different talents, downtime etc. And no, taking 98 percentile parses do not necessarily eliminate downtime.

[EzG]

It's actually very inaccurate to gauge the value of the trinket by using the casting pattern without the trinket itself, because it's a fact that many healers are able to and will spam a lot more when they get the trinket versus without it, or cast more expensive/fast spells.

Holy Paladins get to hit a lot more FoL casts than without the trinket for one, and roughly half of the sample size used did not properly control for factors like different talents, downtime etc. And no, taking 98 percentile parses do not necessarily eliminate downtime.

I can pretty much stop using holy light on some fights and just hit FoL with that trinket although that was partially how I could heal before getting the trinket with more HFC gear. Even then on some fights I find myself with a HUGE amount of extra mana and have yet to get my on use crit which would probably end up being a better throughput for me. Either way the trinket is pretty damn good for pallies up to a certain point where it becomes close to useless because spirit is as useful as strength for us.

[PosPosPos]

I can pretty much stop using holy light on some fights and just hit FoL with that trinket although that was partially how I could heal before getting the trinket with more HFC gear. Even then on some fights I find myself with a HUGE amount of extra mana and have yet to get my on use crit which would probably end up being a better throughput for me. Either way the trinket is pretty damn good for pallies up to a certain point where it becomes close to useless because spirit is as useful as strength for us.

I haven't encountered a single holy paladin telling me they can hit FoL back-to-back and still have plenty of mana leftover at the end of the fight link me a log actually doing that. Or isn't a log of Failord Zakuun.

Until that happens, I cannot in good faith believe any account stating that Spirit can be useless at some attainable value for Holy Paladins.

[Huntingbear_grimbatol]

Instant casts > channeled casts for this trinket.
Of the current healer models that means Disc Priests and Resto Druids, I did not say that other healers didn't benefit from it- they very clearly do. However for a Holy Paladin you want your class trinket + the on use crit trinket that sync up with your wings (glyphed) for most fights, also like I said Resto Druids best secondary stat is (spirit) haste so point for point you'd give it to Resto Druid > Disc Priest > (holy priest, not that you should play one) > T18 Holy Paladin > Resto Shaman > MW Monk.

[Rano]

Instant casts > channeled casts for this trinket.
However for a Holy Paladin you want your class trinket + the on use crit trinket that sync up with your wings (glyphed) for most fights

You do NOT want to use Wings and Intuition's Gift's Crit on use simultaneously. You want to stagger the use so you can maximize IoL procs.

[Kaslia]

If I remember correctly in the healing thread, it stated that the on use trinket for crit has to be used separately from wrath bec it puts you over the top wasting the extra crit. Aladya recently in that same thread noted that the DP trinket with the class trinket would be the best combo. Of course diff fights might call for diff trinkets but in my guild you don't get extra trinkets till all have their bis for the content. So I will take a world's 1st raiding Holy Paly's advice, as this trinket, despite what you put in this thread is actually for progression especially will be BIS for Holy Paladin's and puts us up at the top not at the bottom. Again, you are missing many factors that go into why a trinket is best for a certain class and this depends on the fights.

[Clrg]

You do NOT want to use Wings and Intuition's Gift's Crit on use simultaneously. You want to stagger the use so you can maximize IoL procs.

Depend of the fight ofc, there is no point of delaying the trinket if there is nothing to heal so your iol hl or fol will end in overheal.

[EzG]

I haven't encountered a single holy paladin telling me they can hit FoL back-to-back and still have plenty of mana leftover at the end of the fight link me a log actually doing that. Or isn't a log of Failord Zakuun.

Until that happens, I cannot in good faith believe any account stating that Spirit can be useless at some attainable value for Holy Paladins.

Well not so much back to back to back without going oom. But using it to the point where FoL output is beating several other spells. A few of my logs have FoL close to even or above holy light on progression fights. Farm fights I can get away with FoL blowing away heals, but that's since overgearing content means you can do that since the fight is so short. I'm very mainly comparing my mana/fol healing to gorefiend, and not so much other fights where healing is a little more spread out and predictable where FoL would really be a waste. But even without using FoL on the slower fights I still end up with a very generous amount of mana using this trinket. IG is something I have yet to even see drop so that's a bummer but with this I feel a hell of a lot more leniency to blowing heals on a FoL here and there to either snap heals for shits and giggles or save someone from dying and still be safe even if you need to conserve a little.

[Deleted]

The trinket is best for Discs/Resto Druids, then the other healers.

That's really the end of it. Probably worst for MWs but it's not so bad if you do a lot of Soothe healing (Soothe has 0 mana cost with mythic trinket)