I hired new graduates and I want to share some experiences and give advice!

[Deleted]

This post is written based my personal view and experiences as an entrepreneur and employer!

Allright, I have 3 companies and one of them is a marketing firm that I started about 3 years ago. We are growing to a degree that we are forced to slow it down because it's difficult to find enough qualified/skilled employees.
Everytime we are scouting for talent we are mostly (sometimes only) approached by students, graduates and young people in general. "Older people" never have the right knowledge for some reason and only want to apply for management level jobs.

Now, on to the point of my post: I invited about 20 people (out of almost a 100 people that responded) for interviews and there were 5 jobs to be filled (turned out we created a 6th in the process).
I want to share some things that I noticed in these interviews while talking to different people and maybe it can help some people gain insights, motivation or direction!

Our expectations:

- You completed (or almost completed) a 4/5 year study and you have learned something in those years!
- You have loads of spare time in which you can learn and practice additional things!
- You are going to start at the bottom like everyone else: no, you can not start in a management position fresh out of school!

What we hear in interviews:

- "Yeah, the books at school were kinda outdated and so I only have some knowledge on how things used to be done"
- "What I did in my spare time? Hanging out with friends, partying, gaming and enjoying life as a student ofcourse!"
- "But I have completed a study called Business management (or something simular), I don't want to be a worker I want to be a manager!"

Allright. We ended up hiring 6 people who actually did not fit in the group of people mentioned above becasue they did it more than what they had to do.
Some build their own website, others helped (starting-) companies with marketing and campaigs etc. They read up on the latest trends and some even had a list of blogs they followed every week just to be up to date!

So the advice is simple: do everything you can! Don't do the bare minimum! No one wants to hire you for that.
Another thing I can share is that if a company asks for an X amount of years experience (we do this too oftenly) it doesn't mean we aren't going to invite you if you can show that you are exited about something and you've done related things (in your own time). Companies love that!
(Maybe not the mega sized companies, but those work more like an outdated machine anyway).

[Deleted]

It's unfortunately true everywhere - most graduates (particularly 2nd tier ones) seem to think their degree makes them gods gift to the world and those that don't often have no clue how to act in a professional environment or how to come across well in interviews.

Believe it or not, people hiring you don't want to hear how wasted you got with friends every night in uni because it makes them worry you'll continue doing exactly the same.

Best advice I think I could give to a graduate is
a) Acknowledge and understand what you learnt during uni, realise the most important thing about uni is usually proving you CAN learn and how you learn, not the exact content of your curriculum (obvious exceptions for certain STEM subjects)
b) Be professional and prove you understand you know what a work-life actually is. Having held a job during or prior to uni is a huge advantage, even if it's just stacking shelves.
c) Know what the job you're signing up to do is and what the company is, if you've not spent 15mins researching your role why would an employer trust you to learn new skills relevant to your position after hiring you?
d) Think about what you're saying before you say it - your interviewer doesn't want to know about your party-life, your interest in extremely niche activities, the fact you were bored at uni etc.
e) Be polite and don't expect too much. Even if you think something is "below you", be grateful and polite in your refusal of the position, even if you don't want it now you might want to do something else for that firm in the future.

source - freelance developer, ex technical recruiter, often get asked by firms I contract at to help with hiring processes.

[belfpala]

In my profession, I kind of have a spectrum. I prefer to hire complete rookies or 15 year veterans.

Here's why:

Complete rookies -- will do anything I tell them, and I can judge quickly if they'll stick. If not, I'll suggest another line of work, and yes I'll give a good recommendation.

15 year veterans -- don't give a fuck, they'll do everything on my prep and cleaning list, keep the line in order, have a drink with me after work, high five, go home.

Compare to:

New culinary school grad -- Hate them. No, really, I do this with oregano, not thyme. I don't care what they taught you. No, you're not cooking for you, you're cooking for me and my customers.

Just on a tangent: Don't hire groups of friends. That causes divisions.

[Deleted]

So basically you want to attract above average graduates and expect them to learn (= work) for you in their spare time for a company with no reputation/history.

What do you offer in return? above average expectations require above average compensation. I'm hoping at the very very least you pay for the education they do in their spare time?

[Deleted]

So basically you want to attract above average graduates and expect them to learn (= work) for you in their spare time for a company with no reputation/history.

What do you offer in return? I'm hoping at the very very least you pay for the education they do in their spare time?

What they learn in their spare time is up to them, although many companies (including mine) do "expect" that you keep up with trends in the field and educate yourself where needed.

The extra education that I was talking about in my post is the extra effort you do in your school years! Don't do only the bare minimum, it's oftenly not enough!

[Deleted]

What they learn in their spare time is up to them, although many companies (including mine) do "expect" that you keep up with trends in the field and educate yourself where needed.

The extra education that I was talking about in my post is the extra effort you do in your school years! Don't do only the bare minimum, it's oftenly not enough!

Every sector i have worked and heard off it's the norm that the company pays for any additional courses or certifications it's employees need to stay relevant.

And only above average graduates do a lot of extra curricular education. The average graduate ussualy only has a part time job that is related to their field.

[belfpala]

So basically you want to attract above average graduates and expect them to learn (= work) for you in their spare time for a company with no reputation/history.

What do you offer in return? above average expectations require above average compensation. I'm hoping at the very very least you pay for the education they do in their spare time?

My industry has something called Stage (link).

Paying for their education is OJT.

[AeneasBK]

Nothing personal Deruyter

[Deleted]

My industry has something called Stage (link).

Paying for their education is OJT.

internships are extremely common during any tertiary education. Most graduates have between 9-18 months of internships. I can't think of any degree of the top of my head that doesn't require a internship (or equivalent) as the "final exam". Never heard of a company sending a employee to intern at another company though.

OJT can't keep you relevant. OJT cant certify you as say a windows10 engineer, you need to follow a formal course for that. or if you are a car mechanic and a new type of engine is discovered, your company needs to pay you to take a course in those engines if it wants to cater to that need. etc. it's beyond ridiculous to expect employees to do that on their own.

[Deleted]

Nothing personal Deruyter

I have no idea why people are laughing and cheering.

I guess it's a certain type of public?

[Wildtree]

You guys need to sort your shit out here, before it gets complicated...
Do not forget that you're on an international forum, and the handling, regulations, laws etc. vary widely, country by country...
Especially a comparison between US and EU is factually impossible.

[belfpala]

internships are extremely common during any tertiary education. Most graduates have between 9-18 months of internships. I can't think of any degree of the top of my head that doesn't require a internship (or equivalent) as the "final exam". Never heard of a company sending a employee to intern at another company though.

OJT can't keep you relevant. OJT cant certify you as say a windows10 engineer, you need to follow a formal course for that. or if you are a car mechanic and a new type of engine is discovered, your company needs to pay you to take a course in those engines if it wants to cater to that need. etc. it's beyond ridiculous to expect employees to do that on their own.

Internships in most fields here are paid. Staging is basically, "Work for a couple hours, for free, and then we'll talk."

Very different from training programs. One of my best friends is an auto mechanic. He gets flown around the US to get training on new engines.

[Wildtree]

I have no idea why people are laughing and cheering.

I guess it's a certain type of public?

Because he describes the as is situation of American marketing and advertisement.
It's intrusive, it's annoying, it's disgusting..

[Deleted]

One of my best friends is an auto mechanic. He gets flown around the US to get training on new engines.

Deruyter makes it seem like your friend would have to pay for that himself and do it on his own time.

What they learn in their spare time is up to them, although many companies (including mine) do "expect" that you keep up with trends in the field and educate yourself where needed.

[belfpala]

Deruyter makes it seem like your friend would have to pay for that himself and do it on his own time.

Nah, his company pays for it. The reason is so that he's up to date on modern cars. Pretty simple.

[Deleted]

Deruyter makes it seem like your friend would have to pay for that himself and do it on his own time.

I work in development - everyone I know spends "free time" learning new skills / working on alternate projects relevant to their roles, most don't get any sort of pay from their work for it. The only exceptions I can think of off the top of my head are people who work with Microsoft techs and need to get those ridiculous certifications (which are usually funded by employers and allowed to be studied for "on work time").

(although many companies do fund related things like conferences, software licenses, new personal hardware etc)

[Wildtree]

Deruyter makes it seem like your friend would have to pay for that himself and do it on his own time.

It depends entirely on job field and within the job field on the companies.

My brother is one of very few engineers that install high tech rotogravure printing machines.
His company flies him around Europe for both, special training courses and for the installations at the customer locations.

[Deleted]

[B]
- You have loads of spare time in which you can learn and practice additional things!

..."What I did in my spare time? Hanging out with friends, partying, gaming and enjoying life as a student ofcourse!"

This is why you are "growing to a degree" in an industry with exponential growth.

Kids who are partying and hanging out with friends have good networking skills. That's about 95% of business.
It is way, way more important than what people think "skills" are. A fucking chimpanzee can design a website,
most of it is using the cut and paste button. Keeping up to speed on tech blogs means you have no life, thats
not a good employee.

I'd also consider that older people aren't applying because they know you are out of your depth. No one wants
to apply for a job where the company won't exist in two years.

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c) Know what the job you're signing up to do is and what the company is, if you've not spent 15mins researching your role why would an employer trust you to learn new skills relevant to your position after hiring you?

This is deeply ironic. You've participated in countless threads where you loudly sound off on some subject where thirty seconds worth of googling contradicts flatly what you are saying.

[Deleted]

A fucking chimpanzee can design a website, most of it is using the cut and paste button.

What? You are joking right?

- - - Updated - - -

This is deeply ironic. You've participated in countless threads where you loudly sound off on some subject where thirty seconds worth of googling contradicts flatly what you are saying.

Hi Mr Conspiracy theory. Feel free to pull up an example of that.

[Deleted]

Sounds like you're trying to find above average people. What does your company offer that is above average?