Help me with what our Feral druid needs to fix (even if its a lot please detail).

[Deleted]

Hey, we aren't a hardcore guild or anything but at the moment this druid isn't doing as well as it could be (IMO) it would be great if an experienced Feral druid helped me out in what I should tell them to improve one.

The problem is this is the first time i've posted so awesomely i can't link the logs -_-

I'll try to post around so eventually i'll be able to post links to the logs but thank you for anyone who helps.

Hilly

Edit:

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...g/Xtera/simple

Logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...-done&source=3

[Nugalicious]

Hey man! I'm going to make this as pretty as possible, but I don't post so my editing will be terrible. :>

I was looking at the logs you posted, and the two consistent things I noticed were CD usage and uptimes on Rip/Savage Roar.

Incarnation: King of the Jungle, Tiger's Fury, and Berserk are paramount in the amount of damage a feral can put out. Tiger's Fury should almost always be used on CD. Depending on the fight, Incarnation and Berserk should be used pretty much on CD as well.
The opener for feral is super important, and a 700+ feral should be doing at least over 100k burst.

Opener: Healing Touch on pull timer --> Pre-pot --> Incarnation 1 second before pull --> rake --> shred up to 5 CP --> Tiger's Fury and Berserk --> Rip --> Into normal rotation.

Savage Roar and Rip need to be 90% uptime minimum. Aiming to be at least 95%. Having a 45% uptime on an ability that increases your damage by 40% es no bueno.

If your Druid needs rotation help, I would recommend the addon Claw to get them started toward the path of great single target deeps.

Sorry for the vomit of information, I hope this helps!

[Cateaka]

If he was wearing his Feral Gear I would be able to better gauge his problem.

Other than that his logs look decent enough. He's not doing too bad on alot of the fights...

One large issue is his Gearlevel. I see that he is pretty undergeared so if you guys worked on getting him gear, it would be supremely helpful.

20k on HFA is pitiful, he should be Raking most things that live decently long. If he can he should also fit a Thrash into some of the mobs too. Most of his damage should be to the Mechanicals though.

21k on Reaver is... Pretty bad. Personally Im doing anywhere from 60-75k at the end of that; And even in Normal you should hardly be getting to the first Air Phase if the dps is good.

24k on Kormrok is better but still pretty bad. Its a pretty easy fight for Ferals since you can pretty much just stand there and dps boss until the Hands come out then just Thrash once and melee your hand where you can.

21k on Council is bad, but he dies 2:18, so its forgivable unless you Brez'd him.

25k on Kilrogg needs improvement. His damage isnt even good on the Hulk either and that is where he should be focusing pretty much all of his time. Kilrogg is irrelevant for him unless hes in the Vision.

29k On Gorefiend. I don't think I really even need to touch this....

I was looking more and more. He needs to use Incarnation and Berserk at the SAME TIME. I cannot stress that enough. On the pull he should be using them and every 3 minutes after that. I cannot stress HOW important that really is to him. His uptime on Savage Roar needs a little improvement, but not very much. Its very good throughout the entire place.

He probably just needs to get some Addons too. WeakAuras, Badkitty, and a couple others might help him if he doesn't use them.

More information would be much more helpful.


Edited

Also, FluidDruid.net and Icyveins does wonders. I also have posted in this post right here and he might do well to read what I posted.

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-a-DPS-spec-be

[Nekusar]

Opener: Healing Touch on pull timer --> Pre-pot --> Incarnation 1 second before pull --> rake --> shred up to 5 CP --> Tiger's Fury and Berserk --> Rip --> Into normal rotation.

The opener is a little different, you want to HT, Pre-Pot, Prowl+Rake, Incarnation, Trinkets, Shred to 5 CP, TF/Berserk, RIP, Shred to 4 CP and apply a BT Rake, Onto normal rotation.

[teddabear]

Don't listen to the chowderheads that say you need 98-100% uptime on Savage Roar but 60% is ridiculous. I have a feeling Feral is too much for him, he should probably be playing Rogue. Plus it will be almost impossible for him to die as a Rogue.

[Deleted]

lmao he needs to fix like everything

rip/rake uptimes are awful, probably skipping on BT, savage roar 50% lol, what the hell

Make him read some guide. SET UP ADDONS TO TRACK COMBO POINTS/ENERGY/PREDATORY SWIFTNESS DURATION/BLEEDS < very fucking important

Group up, make him dps dummy and yell at him while on skype whatever until he does 100% rip/rake/savage roar and all rips/rakes are buffed with BT (should take like an evening)

[Deleted]

Thanks everyone, I'll speak to them today and go through setting up addons and keeping track of everything you've all been a big help! i'll keep coming back just in-case someone else has a really good imput but yeah thanks guys

[Dysheki]

Thanks everyone, I'll speak to them today and go through setting up addons and keeping track of everything you've all been a big help! i'll keep coming back just in-case someone else has a really good imput but yeah thanks guys

Please remember savage roar has two spell IDs (for the people spouting really low uptimes).

[Bearshield]

Please remember savage roar has two spell IDs (for the people spouting really low uptimes).

I don't play feral very often, but I remember seeing this before as well. Can you explain what the separation is please?

[teddabear]

Please remember savage roar has two spell IDs (for the people spouting really low uptimes).

Sorting for all bosses it looks like 82% uptime on Savage Roar. Not horrible but still quite poor.
Rip is 65% and Rake is at 61%.
I have a feeling he is not using anything to track these.

[Dysheki]

I don't play feral very often, but I remember seeing this before as well. Can you explain what the separation is please?

One is the automatic sr from the glyph and the other is just a normal cast.

- - - Updated - - -

Sorting for all bosses it looks like 82% uptime on Savage Roar. Not horrible but still quite poor.
Rip is 65% and Rake is at 61%.
I have a feeling he is not using anything to track these.

I'm not saying he can't do better, didn't really look through the logs honestly. They just seemed abysmally impossibly low from some of those statements (ie 40%).

[teddabear]

Usually when i see these threads it seems like the main issue is the guild isn't giving the feral any gear. In this instance it does look like he needs to improve and that he is most likely not using any tracker.

[noladrew]

Why did none of you touch on the fact that he's not using Ferocious Bite anywhere close to as much as he should be?

[teddabear]

Why did none of you touch on the fact that he's not using Ferocious Bite anywhere close to as much as he should be?

With low uptime on Rip and SR I would have concluded the opposite. If he did have too few FB then he is doing something really weird.

[badzerath]

Hillybilly, I'd like to apologize on behalf of the people posting misinformation about feral is this thread. It's honestly astonishing how fucking wrong some of you are and even worse you spread your ignorance to newer players...

Tiger's Fury should almost always be used on CD.

Wrong. Unless you have the archimonde trinket and your extended Berserk buff is active - you pop TF when lower on energy (I believe ~30) as to not waste energy gained. You DO NOT mindlessly pop it on CD wasting the energy gained. Why you would say this to someone who is obviously struggling with energy management (obvious from buff/debuff uptimes) is astonishing.

Opener: Healing Touch on pull timer --> Pre-pot --> Incarnation 1 second before pull --> rake --> shred up to 5 CP --> Tiger's Fury and Berserk --> Rip --> Into normal rotation.

Wrong. Ask yourself why using incarn in stealth makes sense after you bother to read the ability. I mean really. Just fucking read it.

Finally, suggesting someone depend on an addon to play their correct rotation is absurd and does not solve the problem.

Anyway, now that is out of my system - notes for improvement.

1. I won't bother explaining how bad his Rake, Rip, and Savage roar uptimes are. It has already been said and those three abilities are the basic keys to Feral DPS. I would just note that savage roar (in my opinion) should be the absolute number one priority always. What I mean by this is if your feral is ever in a situation where a bleed and SR are falling off at the same time - he should rebuff SR first. SR buffs all physical damage by 40% which basically equates to a pure 40% damage buff when up. People have been throwing around a bunch of random ass % uptimes for the bleeds/SR but in reality they should be aiming for 100% uptime across the board. OBVIOUSLY, this will not always be achievable but should be the goal - in mythic encounters I often manage 99.79% + uptime on SR across the two spell IDs (one from the glyph/opener and the other is the standard casted SR).

2. His cooldown usage is illogical which is also something already covered. After the initial CD usage on the pull which should be a synced TF/Berserk/Incarn - his TF should be used as described above (when available and at 30 energy or lower), and Berserk/Incarn should be used together on CD unless otherwise postponed for an encounter strategy for priority kill targets. However, this will only delay their usage and should not effect them being used together.

3. My personal recommendation for them is to stop playing bloodtalons for now. The spec requires some finesse/timing to maximize its effectiveness and considering he is obviously struggling with basics of the spec he probably shouldn't be concerning himself with that talent....for now. Instead I suggest going with lunar inspiration. With that he can just focus on maintaining rake, rip, moonfire, and savage roar - no special timed HT required. This will be especially helpful for him in mastering the basic snapshot mechanics feral still has with TF/SR. Let him work on bloodtalons later once he is just bored from lunar inspiration being too easy.

4. Finally, use of sounds, weakauras, classtimers, etc. for combo points, buffs, and debuffs is mandatory. This should go without saying. However, like I said earlier DO NOT let him rely on a stupid addon to vomit out buttons for him to hit next in a rotation like this and expect him to get better.

If you want a really nice source of updated feral info go here: http://fluiddruid.net/

Here he can read the guide on the forums by Pawketz that covers everything from the basics to the finer points of the spec/talents/rotation. He can also read the other threads and get some feral specific tips for each fight.

[Dysheki]

Wow, dude, you need to chill out. First, while there are caveats, it's rare this tier where I'm not using TF on cd since pooling isn't really a thing. Second, there is no reason to not use incarnation pre-pull, ESPECIALLY if you have soul cap that procs immediately. Otherwise there is a wasted GCD that does 0 damage into the soul cap proc.

So calm your acne, son.

- - - Updated - - -

And besides, he has more to gain with buff/debuff uptime than the nuances of energy management.

[Enitzu]

lmao he needs to fix like everything

rip/rake uptimes are awful, probably skipping on BT, savage roar 50% lol, what the hell

Make him read some guide. SET UP ADDONS TO TRACK COMBO POINTS/ENERGY/PREDATORY SWIFTNESS DURATION/BLEEDS < very fucking important

Group up, make him dps dummy and yell at him while on skype whatever until he does 100% rip/rake/savage roar and all rips/rakes are buffed with BT (should take like an evening)

Glad I'm not the only one seeing this. This guy should not be playing a dot class if he can't learn how to track dots. Looking at Kormrok, he should be at or above 90% uptime on both rip and rake. He is actually at 84% rip and 54% rake. Savage Roar uptime of 12% ... that's terrible.

He gained 20 Pred Swiftness buffs yet only used 14 Healing touches so hes wasting a lot of dmg from his 100 talent. Used a pre pot but did not use Incarnation on the pull. Didn't use a 2nd pot or a 2nd use of Incarnation.

I know you said this isn't bleeding edge or anything but there are so many things wrong with his play. He could easily be getting another 8-10k dps or more. I haven't even looked at his gear. Just logs and I know that already

- - - Updated - - -

Snip

Jesus, you are trying to tell people about posting misinformation when you have no clue what you are talking about apparently.

You do use BF on CD. Always. You drop energy to use it so it's not wasted.

Using Incarnation pre pull should also always be done. You are pre potting so why would not take advantage of that?

Please stop posting about people being wrong when you yourself don't know.

[badzerath]

Wow, dude, you need to chill out. First, while there are caveats, it's rare this tier where I'm not using TF on cd since pooling isn't really a thing. Second, there is no reason to not use incarnation pre-pull, ESPECIALLY if you have soul cap that procs immediately. Otherwise there is a wasted GCD that does 0 damage into the soul cap proc.

So calm your acne, son.

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And besides, he has more to gain with buff/debuff uptime than the nuances of energy management.

1. My face is smoother than a baby's ass.
2. Last night he didn't have anywhere near the gear you or I do. Posting from mobile device atm and from what I can tell he doesn't have even the tier bonuses....
3. You post as though resource management wasn't/isn't important to buff/debuff uptime.

- - - Updated - - -

Jesus, you are trying to tell people about posting misinformation when you have no clue what you are talking about apparently.

You do use BF on CD. Always. You drop energy to use it so it's not wasted.

Using Incarnation pre pull should also always be done. You are pre potting so why would not take advantage of that?

Please stop posting about people being wrong when you yourself don't know.

1. Hey genius, read what you posted about TF (assuming BF = TF) then read what I said and then try to explain wtf is different. Maybe your comprehension of the english language is piss poor or maybe you need me to type out every detail about TF being used with low energy as close to every 30 seconds as possible.

Regardless, what I posted above is correct and if you are sitting there advocating wasting energy to pop TF exactly every 30 seconds then I am done talking to you.

2. If you think pressing a CD that makes our generators function as if we were in stealth...WHILE WE ARE IN STEALTH is smart then again you are hopelessly stupid. This guy doesn't have SC and even if he did - not guaranteed to pop on your first GCD. I am not even sure what point you were trying to make with prepot comparison but it just came off as nonsensical bullshit to me.

[Blueredwolf]

1. My face is smoother than a baby's ass.
2. Last night he didn't have anywhere near the gear you or I do. Posting from mobile device atm and from what I can tell he doesn't have even the tier bonuses....
3. You post as though resource management wasn't/isn't important to buff/debuff uptime.

- - - Updated - - -



1. Hey genius, read what you posted about TF (assuming BF = TF) then read what I said and then try to explain wtf is different. Maybe your comprehension of the english language is piss poor or maybe you need me to type out every detail about TF being used with low energy as close to every 30 seconds as possible.

Regardless, what I posted above is correct and if you are sitting there advocating wasting energy to pop TF exactly every 30 seconds then I am done talking to you.

2. If you think pressing a CD that makes our generators function as if we were in stealth...WHILE WE ARE IN STEALTH is smart then again you are hopelessly stupid. This guy doesn't have SC and even if he did - not guaranteed to pop on your first GCD. I am not even sure what point you were trying to make with prepot comparison but it just came off as nonsensical bullshit to me.

TIL I am hopelessly stupid.

Incarnation+Prepot at 1 second. We incarn at 1 not because we are too stupid to realize stealth already gives out the bonus. It's the gcd we get out of the way.

[v1perz53]

1. Hey genius, read what you posted about TF (assuming BF = TF) then read what I said and then try to explain wtf is different. Maybe your comprehension of the english language is piss poor or maybe you need me to type out every detail about TF being used with low energy as close to every 30 seconds as possible.

Regardless, what I posted above is correct and if you are sitting there advocating wasting energy to pop TF exactly every 30 seconds then I am done talking to you.

2. If you think pressing a CD that makes our generators function as if we were in stealth...WHILE WE ARE IN STEALTH is smart then again you are hopelessly stupid. This guy doesn't have SC and even if he did - not guaranteed to pop on your first GCD. I am not even sure what point you were trying to make with prepot comparison but it just came off as nonsensical bullshit to me.

Your first point is a distinction without a difference and your second point is the wrong way to play. There is never any reason to pool energy, so in normal play you will never waste the energy regen from TF even by popping it on CD. No reason to overcomplicate TF useage for someone obviously already struggling with feral when that complication will gain nearly nothing over the simpler version of just using TF on CD. As per the second point, Incarnation causes a 1 second GCD. As such, you are unable to use any attack abilities for 1 second after using Incarn. It should now be obvious that you should use it 1 second before the pull, so that the first moment you attack the boss and the first ability you can use with Incarn up overlap. If you wait until combat to use it, you have 1 wasted second of not using attacking abilities that could have been avoided. And since Incarn has no passive damage boost, simply boosting abilities used, you lose nothing by using it 1 second before pull. And nobody said to use Incarn from stealth. In fact, that would be a waste, since it breaks stealth. No real reason to start the fight from stealth as a feral at all.