Spec balance ATM

[dottie]

Lost my good post

TL;DR

Fire at 50th percentile is overall better than frost/arcane and the fights that fire beats out frost/arcane the margins are much wider. On the fights where frost is ahead at the 50th percentile fire is with 6k dps. Whereas the 50th percentile is as large as 40k dps higher than frost, though that is on kilrogg.

[Brianmage]

Lost my good post

TL;DR

Fire at 50th percentile is overall better than frost/arcane and the fights that fire beats out frost/arcane the margins are much wider. On the fights where frost is ahead at the 50th percentile fire is with 6k dps. Whereas the 50th percentile is as large as 40k dps higher than frost, though that is on kilrogg.

You can't look at percentiles on warcraftlogs for fire, not a large enough sample size

[Clrg]

Fire us useless. It is NOT the top dps spec on reaver. Not even RNG wise. Nothing can cause fire to out perform Frost or Arcane EVER on iron Reaver. Now, the reason why it shows it as the highest is due to an error and lack of parses. Fire has a high minimum due to lack of people playing fire, and some RNG has occurred. If you changed those ~500 parses to ~50k parses, fire would be below Arcane and Frost. Please don't go telling mages to go fire on any fight in HFC due to it being skewed because so few people play it.

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Depending on how warcraftlogs determines the 95th percentile, this could or could not be true.

TIL if a spec isnt top dps in a boss is useless, fire may not be the best spec to play mage atm, but is far from useless.

[wordup]

TIL if a spec isnt top dps in a boss is useless, fire may not be the best spec to play mage atm, but is far from useless.

Looking at an "all bosses percentile" (especially when there are SO few parses) chart is about as useful for determining where a class stands as jumping off a cliff to cool off.

[Brianmage]

TIL if a spec isnt top dps in a boss is useless, fire may not be the best spec to play mage atm, but is far from useless.

If you as a mage are required to min/max your performance, there is no instance in HFC that you would go fire.


Those numbers mean absolutely nothing at all. BM is ahead of MM. Sub rogue is one of the lowest dps, fire mage is above frost and arcane, Demo warlock is 3rd, literally nothing about any of these numbers are accurate in real time. This is just a misrepresentation using statistics. And goes with the saying that you can make statistics say anything you want to say.

It's like if I came up to you and said "Most criminals eat Ice cream." And your reply was, "Most people that eat ice cream are criminals?" This is what you sound like.

[Clrg]

If you as a mage are required to min/max your performance, there is no instance in HFC that you would go fire.


Those numbers mean absolutely nothing at all. BM is ahead of MM. Sub rogue is one of the lowest dps, fire mage is above frost and arcane, Demo warlock is 3rd, literally nothing about any of these numbers are accurate in real time. This is just a misrepresentation using statistics. And goes with the saying that you can make statistics say anything you want to say.

It's like if I came up to you and said "Most criminals eat Ice cream." And your reply was, "Most people that eat ice cream are criminals?" This is what you sound like.

I dont understand what are you trying to achieve since nobody else mentioned cutting edge progression (that shit ended weeks ago) i will try my best to explain what some of us were talking: Is fire useless? No, is fire playable? yes. Is the best spec for mage atm? probably no.

[Deleted]

2. The amount of variance you think fire

I wasn't talking about any particular spec.

[Brianmage]

I dont understand what are you trying to achieve since nobody else mentioned cutting edge progression (that shit ended weeks ago) i will try my best to explain what some of us were talking: Is fire useless? No, is fire playable? yes. Is the best spec for mage atm? probably no.

There's no reason to play fire when another spec can do it better.

[Bigbazz]

Please do me a favor and take a look at fire and tell me how it's doing. Nobody uses it for PvP and it's essentially useless in raiding. This expansion makes me sad to play my mage. Probably why I'm thinking about playing a DH as main in Legion(would get me back to my rogue roots in a sense as well).

You can play Arcane and Frost, our Arcane mage does 120k dps on some single target fights (Iron Reaver for example)... I ranked 9th in the world as an Arms Warrior on that fight this week and I was 40k dps behind him. Tell me more about your class problems just because one spec is not dominant on single target, while your other specs are amazing.

As I said, Lock and Mage are fairly dominant across the board.. Top Fire mage players can still do well as has been shown, even if it is generally unpopular and less desirable.

[Ammanas]

Keep in mind the people playing Fire on fights like Reaver are either:

Extremely geared people fucking around on farm content that their guild will oneshot regardless
People that insist on playing fire because they like it and don't care about being optimal

Both of those cases, the person will at least be good at the spec.

Very few bad to mediocre mages in lowish (710-720) gear will ever play fire. Thousands of them play arcane. It obviously skews the numbers.

Also, the whole variance/RNG thing is actually wrong. Arcane RNG is WAY higher than Fire, especially on single target. My 10k sim results single target arcane has a minimum of 75k and a max of 185k...

Anyway, in regards to the other point mage spec balance is about as perfect as it can get right now. You can literally play all three specs on progression for different fights depending on what is needed for your strat/raid comp. Its not uncommon to play Fire on Mythic Xhul for guilds lacking imp damage, and we actually played fire on Iskar progress as well (loliskar). There are even a few logs of people using fire on Manno when they needed more imp damage.

There is also a wide variation in talent and glyph selection compared to most other classes.

[Deleted]

Extremely geared people fucking around on farm content that their guild will oneshot regardless

Yep. It's been clear several log posts are basically trolling those browsing said logs. Besides, several of them had been done with raid/class effort specifically to boost that particular person.

This was more true in the past when the game was more complex in some class abilities that could boost another specific player only (dark intend for example).

[Foj]

There's no reason to play fire when another spec can do it better.

You like fire and hate arcane and frost, seems like a legit reason to play a game the way you prefer to play it.

Of course, preferring to play a game a particular way is sort of the point of why you pay to play a game.

[xtramuscle]

You like fire and hate arcane and frost, seems like a legit reason to play a game the way you prefer to play it.

Of course, preferring to play a game a particular way is sort of the point of why you pay to play a game.

Said no-one in a competitive raiding guild ever. You do what's best for the raid. In general that means not playing fire right now, but as someone else pointed out, there are a few rare examples where the opposite is true.