Disc - Clarity of Will Usage

[Deleted]

Xhul kinda depends on your setup, if you're running rogues and DKs then CoW isn't really going to do anything to help. If you're using locks or a tank then it's iffy, chances are that a PWS alone would be fine (I just PWS our locks and they drop to about 30% health) but having that extra buffer can help on locks for progress, sometimes they're late getting to the blackhole so the PWS is diminished when they soak, we also used a bear which resulted in ~5% health remaining. Using a DK to soak it's useful but you can also just pump healing into them after (a penance and some pally / shaman healing will do the trick just fine). I guess the flip side is that for the majority of the fight the only people taking damage are tanks, early progress on xhul saw tanks dropping pretty fast to some of the specials, using CoW as a filler was simply an hps increase then (since only 2-3 people were taking significant damage at a time), WoM doesn't really become useful until the last phase.

[PosPosPos]

Xhul kinda depends on your setup, if you're running rogues and DKs then CoW isn't really going to do anything to help. If you're using locks or a tank then it's iffy, chances are that a PWS alone would be fine (I just PWS our locks and they drop to about 30% health) but having that extra buffer can help on locks for progress, sometimes they're late getting to the blackhole so the PWS is diminished when they soak, we also used a bear which resulted in ~5% health remaining. Using a DK to soak it's useful but you can also just pump healing into them after (a penance and some pally / shaman healing will do the trick just fine). I guess the flip side is that for the majority of the fight the only people taking damage are tanks, early progress on xhul saw tanks dropping pretty fast to some of the specials, using CoW as a filler was simply an hps increase then (since only 2-3 people were taking significant damage at a time), WoM doesn't really become useful until the last phase.

It's generally easier to heal DKs back up after a Purgatory proc if they had a big shield ongoing, since the "fatal" damage would be smaller and easier to top back up.

As a sidenote, WoM is still the best at parsing on this fight for deep farm.

[Mythrose]

It's generally easier to heal DKs back up after a Purgatory proc if they had a big shield ongoing, since the "fatal" damage would be smaller and easier to top back up.

As a sidenote, WoM is still the best at parsing on this fight for deep farm.

Not to mention, with full CoW and a good shield crit you can actually prevent purg proccing in the first place. Won't happen every time but a bonus when it does.

Edit: After looking over my logs, I can't find an instance where this has happened, although I though it did at one point. Regardless, CoW makes dk's much easier to heal, as has been said.

[Djriff]

Not to mention, with full CoW and a good shield crit you can actually prevent purg proccing in the first place. Won't happen every time but a bonus when it does.

Slightly off topic, but does GS actually work for it or no?

[Deleted]

Not to mention, with full CoW and a good shield crit you can actually prevent purg proccing in the first place. Won't happen every time but a bonus when it does.

Edit: After looking over my logs, I can't find an instance where this has happened, although I though it did at one point. Regardless, CoW makes dk's much easier to heal, as has been said.

Ah that's a good point, I was using CoW on our DK and managed to avoid proccing purgatory occasionally, but not reliably.

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Slightly off topic, but does GS actually work for it or no?

I believe it does from watching Jak stream

[Djriff]

Ah that's a good point, I was using CoW on our DK and managed to avoid proccing purgatory occasionally, but not reliably.

Thankfully our DK won't be soaking it, having 2 locks and 2 rogues will trivialize it. Can a pally soak it with Bubble? never really tried it on heroic, but curious since it is death defying.

I believe it does from watching Jak stream

Now to convince my guild to let me play holy instead of disc...

[Mythrose]

Imo you really want to play disc for Xhul. Besides smoothing over black hole damages, your empowered chains soakers (again depending on comp and rng) can get wrecked. Shielding the chains group beforehand saves lives. That fight in general is a lot of individual spike damage, coupled with periodic heavy tank damage.

[Djriff]

Imo you really want to play disc for Xhul. Besides smoothing over black hole damages, your empowered chains soakers (again depending on comp and rng) can get wrecked. Shielding the chains group beforehand saves lives. That fight in general is a lot of individual spike damage, coupled with periodic heavy tank damage.

Oh you know i'll be playing disc, that was more of a joke since holy is meh at best and cringe worthy at worst.

[Mythrose]

Slightly off topic, but does GS actually work for it or no?

Iirc, GS prevents deaths if the overkill is less than 2x the player's health. If that is still true, it would work on classes like locks who can inflate their health pool, but not others.

[Azobank]

I play with CoW on Xhul'Horac, Tyrant and used it on a coupple of Socrethar kills. On Xhul'horac I make sure tank taking felblaze flurry have full stacks. It do a lot of damage which can be sorted with externals but it was easier to play with CoW and there's no other dmg intake that I really need to absorb that none of the other healers can heal with ease. Also put CoW on players with empowered chains. Fel snapback do significant damage and there's other soruces of dmg roughly at same time. For us CoW prevent players from dying from the chains.

On Socrethar I used it when we had a tank not usually tanking dying two pulls in a row in soulbound construct phase. Whenever he tanked I used CoW. My HPS got lower but the tank didn't die, we didn't wipe and we got phast lewts. Priorities.

When I play CoW I use it to counter something and not as a part of some rotation. If I've CoW talented I often find it convinient to use it for other things aswell like players with touch of harm on Tyrant in P1, player clearing fire or breaking early chains on Xhul, players with Man'ari debuff on Socrethar.

When I consider using CoW HPS have very little impact on my choice.

[Deleted]

Pretty helpful info in this thread, thanks again.

[decnalabnu]

Seems pretty useful for Mythic Archimonde if you have to do doomfire.

[Djriff]

Seems pretty useful for Mythic Archimonde if you have to do doomfire.

I haven't done Mythic Archimonde yet, but if you have 2+ hunters, you don't need it as deterrence = mitigation and 0 damage.

[decnalabnu]

I haven't done Mythic Archimonde yet, but if you have 2+ hunters, you don't need it as deterrence = mitigation and 0 damage.

I do the first doomfire myself and the 2 hunters do the others so I CoW myself before.

Also you still need to heal them when they deter. It's only 50% reduction and I dont' think they can deterence everyone.

[Deleted]

It's also a fairly major DPS loss to have hunters (or mages can also immune, better than hunters) doing doomfire, chances are you'll be wanting at least one healer each time and disc is a very good candidate for doing so.

I'm not convinced about CoW though, I've been doing it for a couple of weeks now and found that I didn't really have time to fully stack it before hand on the harder allures (the ones that come right after chaos), after picking up the fire I found I needed to flash heal anyway since the CoW cast time was too long (and I had EAA active on each time), and after the flash heal I could just penance > PWS again with no need for CoW. Overall it ended up limiting my movement and not really helping at all where I needed it. I also heal myself AND another soaker on the 5th wave and that requires flash heal, CoW cast time is just too long to land on 2 people after running around to pick up.

I do think it would be a good choice for Archimonde all round if you WEREN'T soaking though, since you could stand still and cast it on soakers whilst they were picking up or simply channel into tanks, which is the majority of the damage on the fight anyway.

[Mythrose]

It's also a fairly major DPS loss to have hunters (or mages can also immune, better than hunters) doing doomfire, chances are you'll be wanting at least one healer each time and disc is a very good candidate for doing so.

I'm not convinced about CoW though, I've been doing it for a couple of weeks now and found that I didn't really have time to fully stack it before hand on the harder allures (the ones that come right after chaos), after picking up the fire I found I needed to flash heal anyway since the CoW cast time was too long (and I had EAA active on each time), and after the flash heal I could just penance > PWS again with no need for CoW. Overall it ended up limiting my movement and not really helping at all where I needed it. I also heal myself AND another soaker on the 5th wave and that requires flash heal, CoW cast time is just too long to land on 2 people after running around to pick up.

I do think it would be a good choice for Archimonde all round if you WEREN'T soaking though, since you could stand still and cast it on soakers whilst they were picking up or simply channel into tanks, which is the majority of the damage on the fight anyway.

Yes, especially on progression having dps soak doomfire is less than ideal, and will probably lead to later orb spawns dropping more stacks, missed dps checks etc. Most guilds use disc if they have one, if for nothing else than focused will.

I treat CoW more as a mana saver than anything. In my experience CoW spam will just slightly lag behind your damage taken per second with a 10 stack, which means penance to full>pws>should have time for 2-3 casts of cow before your health dips dangerously. Also CoW is great for tanks in in p1 and p2, which at least for us had periods of quite dangerous spike damage. I can see if you are assigned to two people at once though, although tbh you should probably have some hots on yourself in that case from your healing partners.

[Deleted]

Yes, especially on progression having dps soak doomfire is less than ideal, and will probably lead to later orb spawns dropping more stacks, missed dps checks etc. Most guilds use disc if they have one, if for nothing else than focused will.

I treat CoW more as a mana saver than anything. In my experience CoW spam will just slightly lag behind your damage taken per second with a 10 stack, which means penance to full>pws>should have time for 2-3 casts of cow before your health dips dangerously. Also CoW is great for tanks in in p1 and p2, which at least for us had periods of quite dangerous spike damage. I can see if you are assigned to two people at once though, although tbh you should probably have some hots on yourself in that case from your healing partners.

Yup, that's exactly my experience, I shall reconsider CoW if I start finding myself oom (we haven't had a good try through p3 yet), although I have other options I'd probably go to first (like using spirit enchant and spirit ring)