SV hunter legion CD idea

[MisterBigglez]

w/e inc hate comments but hey, its a suggestion.

Serpent Storm

Coat your weapon with a poison and swivel your weapon, dealing x damage in a 10 yrd cone every 0.5 seconds and applying a dot that deals the same damage over x seconds.

The animation would be the drakonids that spawn in BWL at the start of Nefarian encounter.

Peace out, I await your thoughts.

[Azortharion]

How is that a cooldown? It's just Bladestorm with a cone instead of a radius, and a DoT.

[Septik]

How is that a cooldown? It's just Bladestorm with a cone instead of a radius, and a DoT.

when you can only use it every X minutes and it accounts for x% of your damage?

[Azortharion]

when you can only use it every X minutes and it accounts for x% of your damage?

So something that does damage, and has a cooldown of over a minute?

So this is just a regular ability that has a long cooldown - that makes it a cooldown?

It's like giving warrior Bladestorm a 2 minute cooldown. Would be pretty weak.

[Deleted]

I like your idea! I am super excited with the Survival Hunter becoming melee, the jungle animal-ish spear fighting warrior theme is amazing and the possibilities for new unique spells are endless.

[Deleted]

I like it, but only if we a) actually turn into one of the drakonids and b) start auto-running and can't stop until the ability is cancelled. Whether it's a cooldown or the only ability SV hunters get, having this animation would make me actually consider playing SV

[MisterBigglez]

I like it, but only if we a) actually turn into one of the drakonids and b) start auto-running and can't stop until the ability is cancelled. SV

As cool as it would be to turn into a drakonid, I don't think it would make sense for a hunter to shapeshift. I like the idea of you being forced to move while it channels though.

Keep the ideas flowing! ignore whether it should be classed as a cd or not and think of the mechanics

[Deleted]

While I was mostly joking before (because I like the animation, but couldn't see it work as an ability), the idea is actually growing on me. Just standing there, doing damage in a cone sounds quite boring, you can just play a monk for that.
Make it a 10s channel with a huge focus cost and no cooldown. Make me move while channeling. Let me cancel it at any time. Tune it so it's a dps increase if there are atleast 3/4/5 mobs. Probably not 3 mobs, since it would be awful to just use this ability in a council fight. More of a Darmac-style "Adds are incoming, I'm gonna plow through them for a few seconds before returning to my ST rotation".
While it would not be as convenient as Spinning Crane Kick or Bladestorm, it might give a nice bit of flavour to the class. It would also increase the skill cap a little. There are X mobs that will probably only live Y seconds, is it worth it to use it here? And as a keyboard turner, you would probably have your back to the mobs a few seconds in between, while a good player would be able to make every hit count~

[Derian]

Think I'd rather see a cooldown form of poisoned ammo from exotic munitions, maybe with a haste buff included; gain 20% (or whatever) haste for 10 seconds, and all of your hits poison the target with a stacking dot. It's close to bloodbath I guess, but might fit survival spec.

[Deleted]

While I was mostly joking before (because I like the animation, but couldn't see it work as an ability), the idea is actually growing on me. Just standing there, doing damage in a cone sounds quite boring, you can just play a monk for that.
Make it a 10s channel with a huge focus cost and no cooldown. Make me move while channeling. Let me cancel it at any time. Tune it so it's a dps increase if there are atleast 3/4/5 mobs. Probably not 3 mobs, since it would be awful to just use this ability in a council fight. More of a Darmac-style "Adds are incoming, I'm gonna plow through them for a few seconds before returning to my ST rotation".
While it would not be as convenient as Spinning Crane Kick or Bladestorm, it might give a nice bit of flavour to the class. It would also increase the skill cap a little. There are X mobs that will probably only live Y seconds, is it worth it to use it here? And as a keyboard turner, you would probably have your back to the mobs a few seconds in between, while a good player would be able to make every hit count~

Give it a duration of 4sec max, otherwise it won't see much use in PvP. So what you have in mind is that you're forced to move while channeling? That honestly sounds really cool. (Anything that makes keyboard turners realize they should change their ways sounds cool)
Maybe make the poison stack. It further rewards skillful gameplay by giving additional incentive to stay on top of the targets. The stacking poison could increase damage intensity. At 5 stacks it would apply a slow. Or a healing debuff. Something along those lines.

[Phototropic]

... At 5 stacks it would apply a slow. Or a healing debuff. Something along those lines.

Exotic Munitions could be baseline for SV and the 5-stack effect could be modified by whichever ammo is equipped

[Septik]

So something that does damage, and has a cooldown of over a minute?

So this is just a regular ability that has a long cooldown - that makes it a cooldown?

It's like giving warrior Bladestorm a 2 minute cooldown. Would be pretty weak.

Do you have a differnet definition that defines what is and what isnt a cool down, oh king of the huntards?

[Deleted]

Exotic Munitions could be baseline for SV and the 5-stack effect could be modified by whichever ammo is equipped

I'd argue that "Exotic Ammunition" is amongst the least propable abilities that would be made baseline for SV. We wield spears. What's the ammunition for?
Of course you could change that to different poison coatings for your melee weapons which would modify your attacks... But I believe that's already another class' shtick.
Aspects influencing effect of our attacks maybe? I don't know. It'd have to fit the hunter class though and it should be original (imo). And It also should fit/be fittingly incorporated the playstyle. Just like that, slapped on top of the spec, doesn't make much sense.

[Phototropic]

I'd argue that "Exotic Ammunition" is amongst the least propable abilities that would be made baseline for SV. We wield spears. What's the ammunition for?

I was pretty tired this morning, still am actually, but remains a very good point re "ammo" haha xD

Of course you could change that to different poison coatings for your melee weapons which would modify your attacks... But I believe that's already another class' shtick.
Aspects influencing effect of our attacks maybe? I don't know. It'd have to fit the hunter class though and it should be original (imo). And It also should fit/be fittingly incorporated the playstyle. Just like that, slapped on top of the spec, doesn't make much sense.

Yeah, true with rogues and poisons. Seeing as though the original idea from OP borrows a little from other classes, don't see why that'd be too much of an issue. I'd also argue that perhaps poison-coated spears fit well with a jungle-like, troll-based hunter, which tends to be the feeling I get whenever I think of SV as melee.

[Azortharion]

Do you have a differnet definition that defines what is and what isnt a cool down, oh king of the huntards?

Haha, you're easily offended. Just remember that you got prissy and sarcastic to start with and not me.

-

Just like how everyone thinks of cooldowns traditionally.

An ability that increases your overall proficiency at tanking/healing/dealing damage for X amount of seconds via a buff, or similar.

So, Bestial Wrath has flat damage, Rapid Fire has stat increases. Their cooldowns are over a minute long. Those are cooldowns, things that you may time around the encounter and such.

An ability that might as well be rotational like the pseudo-Bladestorm you mention isn't a cooldown because it doesn't buff you. It just deals damage. Additionally, it is only an AoE cooldown, or so it seems to me.

In short, and in my opinion, your idea just seems like a glorified rotational button.

[Phototropic]

Being devil's advocate a little, a long cooldown ability that hits relatively hard could fall within the proficiency-increasing category you prescribe. I only see one criticism from you about the idea, being that it's not technically a "cooldown," so probably a bad idea to slam others for being prissy or sarcastic.

[Azortharion]

It increases your damage because it does a lot of it. It is not a buff.

Besides, by that definition, any button you press is a cooldown. You'd be hard pressed to call something like Chimaera Shot or Barrage a "cooldown" more than it is just a rotational ability. When raid leaders go "save your DPS cooldowns for X", they don't mean Chimaera Shot. Or Barrage. Or whatever this Bladestorm would be called, unless you were hitting priority AoE targets which pretty much do not exist, and even then no one would really class it as a cooldown.

OP called for cooldown suggestions/ideas. The first suggestion is not a cooldown in the traditional sense.

Let's just live in a world where it is a cooldown, what would you save such a thing for?

- We assume that it's an AoE/cleave-based cooldown, since it hits in a cone, sort of like Barrage.

1) Priority AoE targets hardly exist at all. The idea of a cooldown in raid design is to put it to the best use on a given encounter.
2) Even if they did exist in the new raids, I don't see that being on more than 1-2 bosses altogether. So it's a cooldown that's only really useful for padding (seeing as it would likely decrease your single-target damage, seeing as it is a channel by OP's description), overall DPS on Council-type fights and that's it. So useless or even a complete disadvantage on most fights where you'd rather do single-target damage.

It's already looking pretty bleak for our new "cooldown", here. If it were not a cooldown, but instead a talented ability (or indeed, a talented cooldown, lol), you'd at least have a choice of picking a more useful ability/cooldown on 9/10 of fights instead of being stuck with an AoE ability-turned-pseudocooldown for Survival's main skillset.

Of course, they could just tune it to deal insane single-target damage too, which would make SV a spec that deals the bulk of its damage during this one "cooldown" (I can only assume you'd give it a long one), while being even more ridiculous for multi-target. Bad design. If it were to be a talent, it would also completely invalidate the two other choices.

Finally, DPS cooldowns have not been a talent option in the past as I recall. There's never been such a talent tier. In the case of Stampede/Crows/Blink Strikes, which is DPS Cooldown/Rotational Mechanic/Passive.

So besides it not being a real cooldown, there are plenty other issues with it from a design perspective, in short.

1) Only useful on very few fights, if any at all.
2) A direct disadvantage on most.
3) It's really just a nerfed Bladestorm, which is not a cooldown but ridiculously overpowered for burst AoE moments. Give it a longer cooldown, make it do more damage and you've just set yourself up for a spec that relies on a single cooldown to do meaningful damage, doing absolutely nothing at all till AoE comes up. Unless they undertune it, in which case you'd never use it anyway.

There's a reason why cooldowns have never been centered around either AoE or single-target, and a reason why cooldowns today are not strictly relating to either single-target or AoE. While there are single-target primary ones, there are no AoE ones, because mass AoE is not a priority.

Dark Soul: Critical Strike/Chaos Bolt damage increase for Destro, something else for Affli. Idr.
Avenging Wrath: Haste, Crit, damage done.
Icy Veins: Haste
Rapid Fire: Haste
Recklessness: Crit and Crit damage.
Arcane Power: Flat damage.
Ascendance: Lava Burst spammable single-target, Chain Lightning buff.
Celestial Alignment: Flat damage.
Adrenaline Rush: Resource regen and Haste.

Bladestorm is the CLOSEST you get to what OP mentions, and Bladestorm users already have an issue of being largely useless between the mass AoE, on which they become completely overpowered.

Either this new ability shares the 1 minute cooldown with Bladestorm, becoming a Hunter version of the same ability, which is boring, or they make it a shorter cooldown, turning it into more of a rotational staple, or longer, which would be ridiculous for a cooldown that you supposedly save for high-priority AoE situations, unless those are super rare - and are they really high priority if they are that rare? Fel Imps spawn every half-or-so-minute.

[Phototropic]

Now, that wasn't so hard I'd stand to agree with a lot of what you point out. Although, confusing a sub 10s ability with another at up to 2mins to try and make a point is being a little silly.

... We assume that it's an AoE/cleave-based cooldown, since it hits in a cone, sort of like Barrage ...

Maybe this is the point; would the idea be better served to be a survival barrage replacement?

[Azortharion]

Now, that wasn't so hard I'd stand to agree with a lot of what you point out. Although, confusing a sub 10s ability with another at up to 2mins to try and make a point is being a little silly.



Maybe this is the point; would the idea be better served to be a survival barrage replacement?

You can say whatever you want about how I make my point. Just try and actually challenge the point next time..

It could replace Barrage, sure. But Barrage is definitely not a cooldown, and we're talking about cooldowns (going by the thread's name), so it's irrelevant.

Plus, you know, a melee Barrage is just Bladestorm without the ranged problems in it.

[Phototropic]

You talk of ignoring points but it seems that, between the two of us, I'm the one that's trying to communicate.

Enjoy your little throne, sir.