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  1. #21
    The Lightbringer Evildeffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    How am I ignoring the answers people are giving? I tried the flashing new firmware thing using the tool recommended to me above but it didn't work You go through the process and end up at a command line that you can do nothing with, as for safe mode no mate it wasn't just the odd time it worked that's what I figured yesterday because I noticed EVERY time it booted in safe mode it worked fine.

    I'm not ignoring advice I also stated above I plan to get a new ssd but seeing as I followed the advice above and it didn't work I had to figure out my own temporary fix to get my pc back up working? Or wasn't I allowed to do that? Your attitude is bizarre to say the least!

    - - - Updated - - -



    Mate I tried to update the firmware! The tool is a load of crap, it gets to the bit where it's asking you if you really want to continue as you will lose any data on the drive if you do.....you press y to continue and it blanks out on you, just gives you a command line you can't do anything with, you talk as if I didn't even try to update the firmware....it did it didn't work.....and yes I've just 'slapped a bandaid' over the wound for now with a quick fix but that's not a problem for me as I do intend to get a new ssd in a couple of weeks anyway.....if I can keep my pc working till then that's my only care.

    And what's with the passive aggressive stuff st the end? I'm know your trying to help me, I followed your advice, but it didn't work hence me working out my own way.
    Consider the tool does not do a destructive update, I'm kinda curious as to how you get to that point of it saying that to you.

    You specifically stated the tool didn't work for you when put on USB, hence why I told you to burn it on CD.
    USB bootable sticks do not always work for various reasons, perhaps you popped it in a USB3.0 port or perhaps it's wonky with Board Brand and Model X.

    By going the CD route it pretty much is forced to work as it's a standard that given that HAS to work where USB does not.
    Granted it's not the answer that always works out but it's the one that succeeds most often.

    The point here is that a command line toolbox shouldn't even show up to update the firmware, it's done in an actual GUI.
    The only command line window you should ever get is the WiFi connection window which you can promptly ignore if you are connected by cable.

    Anyhow perhaps you had downloaded an older version of it as well, who knows.
    This is the proper link in any case.

    The attitude given at the end is not due to what you have done but more due to how you replied.
    You replied in a manner that you were sure that you were right and everyone else is wrong and proceeded to argument that you WERE right when I tried to tell you that no matter how much you'd want it to that is not how it works.

    Your last reply to my attempts to help you even start with "We'll see" to refute my point for yourself which is a rather arrogant and
    "Fuck it, I fixed it and there's nothing you can tell me that'll change that so you're wrong"-like attitude.

    Are you surprised others reply in a manner to which they have when they read that?
    (because it made sense to only you because of a fundamental misunderstanding of the technology you're working with)

    There are many people on this forum whom are experienced and professional builders, repair and support IT personnel.. I am one of them.
    So when I believe that what you've done will be a band-aid at best which could possibly be fixed to work normally it is for a good reason I try to make you do things that are for your own best interests.

    I have nothing to gain by attempting to assist you, I do it because am actually trying to help you.

    Take it how you will.

  2. #22
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    Right first of all pal, no just no, the tool simply does not work.....I did use the right version, the exact same link you posted actually from the ocz website, I also tried it from cd and got the same response as usb hence my distrust of it....especially when I did a little research and found it is pretty notorious for having bugs either bricking drives during the flash or like in my case simply not responding at all.

    Secondly don't make the mistake of thinking because someone is asking for help they know nothing about system building and repair.....I was incredibly frustrated when I made that post as I was seeing things I didn't think made sense.....why did they not make sense? Because I Know my way around a machine and therefore I knew what was happening made no sense.

    I later saw information which led me to go the other way with trying to work it what was wrong, there was plainly a problem with my windows installation as I was getting bsods to do with Windows process errors and console errors when logging in. The fact the system ran fine when on safe mode many different times during testing also suggested me it was a problem affecting Windows startup as obviously in safe mode Windows loads with a minimum amount of processes and drivers so when you run it in safe mode and it runs fine you've pretty much knuckled down the problem. If it had turned out to be a disc error then safe mode/not safe mode would not have mattered as no matter what mode its in its running on the same physical disc.

    The error with my disc actually dissappearing from the bios I also traced as I mentioned before once I started using the different sata cable that stopped happening, hence it must have been the cable.

    Now about your attitude? I was all ready to give you a vote of thanks to be honest, because you did try to help me and even if your solution turned out to be a dead end the fact is you gave up your time to help and I appreciated that.

    Then I saw your comments getting snotty with me for having fixed my machine in a way that was different to what you suggested......I actually thought you were being the arrogant one with a 'do it my way or it won't work' mentality and talking at me as if I was stupid when in fact I'd simply used my own logic and knowledge to make the connection as to what the problem actually was and I'd managed to fix it.

    Then I stopped caring....you say your an IT professional? Is this how you talk to your clients if they manage to find a way to troubleshoot and fix their issues themselves if the way you suggest happens to not work? Can't imagine you'd stay in the job long with that level of condescending at people!

  3. #23
    The Lightbringer Evildeffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    Right first of all pal, no just no, the tool simply does not work.....I did use the right version, the exact same link you posted actually from the ocz website, I also tried it from cd and got the same response as usb hence my distrust of it....especially when I did a little research and found it is pretty notorious for having bugs either bricking drives during the flash or like in my case simply not responding at all.
    You have not mentioned at any point prior to right now that it did not work via CD, you have stated only USB, you can read that back if you want.
    However for having the reputation as not working.. considering almost every other toolbox in existence that I had the unfortunate pleasure of working with the OCZ one is very much well thought out and has all the tools a system builder needs.
    Considering you have not yet stated this either since you're adamant about your cable being the problem, have you tried it with the new cable?

    By your own logic every single toolbox (and I do mean every single one of them, as well as any BIOS updating tools) should be distrusted as they all cause bricks for any type of hardware that can take it, hell .. technically any firmware update is to be distrusted regardless of platform to do it on.

    You should have a little bit more trust in these things, shit happens with everything, distrusting it immediately for not working is like saying "Ford is a horrible car brand, once in the middle of -30°C winter it refused to start instantly, it took 3 seconds longer... thus the brand is bogus! NEVER AGAIN!".

    Also... do not call me pal, I replied to your post with exactly the information you asked for and explained why, personally attacking me does not help you.

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    Secondly don't make the mistake of thinking because someone is asking for help they know nothing about system building and repair.....I was incredibly frustrated when I made that post as I was seeing things I didn't think made sense.....why did they not make sense? Because I Know my way around a machine and therefore I knew what was happening made no sense.
    Informative... except I am speaking from experience regarding that very SSD you are referring to, more specifically it's controller.
    I replied to your lack of knowledge of this particular matter because it is evident that you do not have it in that area.
    This is not meant to aggravate you, it is a simple fact.

    For example:
    chkdsk on an SSD whilst it disappears from your BIOS is a futile attempt and would never solve your issues as they are 2 fundamentally different issues.
    Expecting chkdsk to show "bad sectors" on an SSD is also fundamentally impossible due to how SSDs work.
    Same with Windows Restore points, which would only have assisted you if it was just a software issues, which clearly it is not.
    Also the fact that your problem is exactly the issue that SandForce drives have been plagued with and to solve most of those issues is to firmware update.

    The thing you're not understanding is that I am trying to assist you to prevent future such events, not band-aid possible fix things.

    Things that you described make sense to me (and others) because they know these issues and root cause, knowing your way around the rest of the system is irrelevant if you do not know the specific issue you are trying to fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    I later saw information which led me to go the other way with trying to work it what was wrong, there was plainly a problem with my windows installation as I was getting bsods to do with Windows process errors and console errors when logging in. The fact the system ran fine when on safe mode many different times during testing also suggested me it was a problem affecting Windows startup as obviously in safe mode Windows loads with a minimum amount of processes and drivers so when you run it in safe mode and it runs fine you've pretty much knuckled down the problem. If it had turned out to be a disc error then safe mode/not safe mode would not have mattered as no matter what mode its in its running on the same physical disc.
    Ah but it does, again... the SandForce controllers have issues with SATA controllers and how they communicate.
    At one moment it works perfectly fine and the other moment it tells you to take a hike.

    Just because you're getting a BSoD doesn't mean it's a software glitch, it's often times also very indicative of hardware issues.

    Example:
    Say you have 1 stick of 4GB RAM, now the first 2,5GB of RAM is perfectly fine but at 2,6GB the RAM is broken.
    Windows would boot normally and everything would work normally untill you hit 2,6GB of RAM usage with whatever programme.
    Your computer would BSoD immediately when the fault is detected, but would boot normally after untill the 2,6GB of use again.
    Would you classify that as a software glitch? By your own standards you would as it would work undetected.

    The point I'm trying to make here is that superficial findings often prove completely useless and you need to find the root cause for it.
    If Windows was the issue, how did this happen, when did this happen, what was the cause etc.

    All of which remain unanswered and saying "Safe mode worked, thus windows issue!" is not a viable thing to say.

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    The error with my disc actually dissappearing from the bios I also traced as I mentioned before once I started using the different sata cable that stopped happening, hence it must have been the cable.
    This is a possibility but the chances of this are so low (as I stated before) that it's more likely that I get struck by lightning in the face 10 times over.
    Mechanically the cables are identical and for the other cable to cause issues out of nowhere would mean you would have to have twisted it in 90 degree fashion or that a truck weighing 40 tons drove over it and mangled it up.

    However regarding the fact you have a SandForce drive and with it you are describing the very issue that had plagued that controller for years make people who know the drives immediately think of firmware issues compared to the abysmally low chance that the cable was the actual issue is kind of obvious don't you think?

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    Now about your attitude? I was all ready to give you a vote of thanks to be honest, because you did try to help me and even if your solution turned out to be a dead end the fact is you gave up your time to help and I appreciated that.

    Then I saw your comments getting snotty with me for having fixed my machine in a way that was different to what you suggested......I actually thought you were being the arrogant one with a 'do it my way or it won't work' mentality and talking at me as if I was stupid when in fact I'd simply used my own logic and knowledge to make the connection as to what the problem actually was and I'd managed to fix it.
    My attitude towards you has been very straight forward, in fact it still is.
    You asked for help, I provided you help and told you how to go about things.
    You said you did things 1 way, I told you to do it the other way.
    You then later on state you did but neglected to mention it prior with me assuming you've not done it.
    You also give up immediately on listening the moment you assume you found and fixed the issue at hand when I recommended you to still update the firmware after your formatting of the drive (random sidenote: formatting an SSD, especially SandForce drives is a bad idea, Secure Erasing them is far better).

    Any IT professional will tell you the same, you didn't fix the problem you alleviated it for now.
    I was genuinely trying to assist you into possibly prevent the problem from returning all together, in fact I still am.
    The attitude of arrogance in some manners we all possess to some degree, that I will admit to, but do not presume I talked to you as if you were stupid, I talked to you because you have clearly shown by your own statements that your knowledge of SSDs and their operation is lacking.
    That's not a bad thing, everyone lacks knowledge in things, but you dismissed everything I said directly after alleviated your issues.

    You asked why the attitude and I replied exactly why, no rhymes or personal attacks but simply how you've stated things which directly clash with experience of people who know about the very issue you had and your presumption following that you were right period.

    I will help anyone that asks for my help but if replied to in the same manner as how you replied then I, and anyone else in general, will reply to you in the same manner and you may not like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    Then I stopped caring....you say your an IT professional? Is this how you talk to your clients if they manage to find a way to troubleshoot and fix their issues themselves if the way you suggest happens to not work? Can't imagine you'd stay in the job long with that level of condescending at people!
    I am Dutch, if clients of mine alleviate or fix their issues I take in how they did it.
    If they were to tell me the exact same thing you did I would say the exact same and state it was only an alleviation and not a fix and that the issue will likely crop up again at some point yes, surprisingly I've yet to lose any client due to this and actually have had them returning to me acknowledging I was right.

    You see business clients are forewarned for these issues and it's noted down if they stubbornly refuse to listen to advice given so that the IT support company that helps them out doesn't have to pay for a mistake the client made, it is common practice across the world.

    If you think I was condescending to you than you should honestly re-read your own replies to posts that were trying to help you.
    "Pot calling kettle black" is a saying that applies perfectly.

  4. #24
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    Dude I didnt even bother to read that, I cannot be arsed with you quite frankly, I thankyou for your attempts to help me, I dont thankyou for your childish attitude of throwing toys out pram and getting stroppy because I managed to sort things out myself in a way you dont `approve of`.....end of! bye now! wish I could say itd been a pleasure! mods please close this thread before it becomes another silly flame war.

  5. #25
    The Lightbringer Evildeffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatcrazypenguin View Post
    Dude I didnt even bother to read that, I cannot be arsed with you quite frankly, I thankyou for your attempts to help me, I dont thankyou for your childish attitude of throwing toys out pram and getting stroppy because I managed to sort things out myself in a way you dont `approve of`.....end of! bye now! wish I could say itd been a pleasure! mods please close this thread before it becomes another silly flame war.
    Thank you for illustrating my point, enjoy your day.

  6. #26
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    Evildeffy, thank you for the information you posted. I myself have limited to 0 knowledge of SSD's and while I don't have this type of issue (I work mostly with Software issues, the very occasional Hardware problem) it is much appreciated the amount of detail you went into, and the info regarding the specific board. Much appreciated.

    I'm going to be swapping my girlfriends OS to a SSD for her soon, if I have any issues may I send you a PM about it?

    Again, thanks for the info. Not having a problem, but knowledge is power.

  7. #27
    The Lightbringer Evildeffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leese View Post
    Evildeffy, thank you for the information you posted. I myself have limited to 0 knowledge of SSD's and while I don't have this type of issue (I work mostly with Software issues, the very occasional Hardware problem) it is much appreciated the amount of detail you went into, and the info regarding the specific board. Much appreciated.

    I'm going to be swapping my girlfriends OS to a SSD for her soon, if I have any issues may I send you a PM about it?

    Again, thanks for the info. Not having a problem, but knowledge is power.
    Be my guest, be aware of the time zone difference since you are living in Canada and me in the Netherlands.

    I might not be awake at the exact time you ask for info/help.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evildeffy View Post
    Thank you for illustrating my point, enjoy your day.
    ok pal look how I see it.

    1.I ask for help with an issue I cant find an explanation for.

    2.you kindly offer your help.

    3.you give me advice.

    4.I follow it

    5.it doesnt work.

    6.never mind I think ill have a rethink.

    7.I do a few tests myself and work out a way myself of fixing the issue.

    8.I post my happyness at the fact I now have a working machine again and explain what I did to fix it.

    9.Im about to logon to thankyou for your help

    10.I instead see you posting a lot of passive aggressive bullshit getting offended or some shit because I didnt fix it in exactly the way you advised.

    11.I laugh at the sheer arrogance of it.

    12.I still see you going on and on.

    13. I simply tell you to take a hike and stop being so damn childish-Learn your lesson, you may be an `it professional` but that doesnt give you the right to lecture someone for not fixing their machine the exact way you told them to especially when that method doesn't seem to work in their particular case.....im not an idiot (I do have a pretty good it knowledge myself.....this is the second system ive built and the first issue ive ever had that I couldnt figure out straight away) and I know when Ive fixed something.....its still working fine by the way not even a single reset, error, bsod or drive issue since yesterday morning despite heavy use.

    14.I end my participation in this thread.

    You can say what you like pal im happy ive got a working machine again and but for your sheer arrogance youd simply have got a thankyou for trying to help me when id asked for a bit of advice.......as it happens id be quite happy if you never offered that kind of `help` again....if its going to come with stipulations that if I dont follow your advice down to the letter your going to throw a major wobbly like a spoilt kid not getting his own way on someone elses pc.

    This is actually the most laughable thing ive come across in a long time. bye now!

  9. #29
    The Lightbringer Evildeffy's Avatar
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    Glad to see you're continuing to prove my point.

    I will agree with 1 thing you posted, participation ending here of this post.
    Enjoy your imagined knowledge.

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